Diablo® III

What IS weapon damage?

85 Human Warlock
13155
To answer your question; What is shown as "Damage" on the character screen is the damage that is applied to your spells. Attackspeed modifiers are still a mystery to me, they apply a HUGE amount of damage to the "Damage" but they also make you attack faster. Double-dipping?

So say you have 10000 "Damage", and your spell hits for 200% of your damage, the spell will (without resistances) hit for 20000.

Does this answer your question?
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Most likely even a skill that only uses 1 weapon in the animation is using the "damage" value given for both weapons while dual wielding. As is explained in some of the vids post, this "damage" is along the lines of weapon damage + bonus damage * attack speed * dual bonus * primary stat/100.
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85 Gnome Warlock
2750
To answer your question; What is shown as "Damage" on the character screen is the damage that is applied to your spells. Attackspeed modifiers are still a mystery to me, they apply a HUGE amount of damage to the "Damage" but they also make you attack faster. Double-dipping?

So say you have 10000 "Damage", and your spell hits for 200% of your damage, the spell will (without resistances) hit for 20000.

Does this answer your question?


No it does not.

I have told this at least two or three times in this thread alone, and it is really a mystery to me how some people don't seem to get it, but at least in MY copy of the game, when you hover your mouse over the Damage attribute on inventory screen, it will show you what it is made of. It has nothing to do with the weapon damage used in skills.
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How about spells like the plague thing that WDs got? You typically just do it once every pack as it spreads and do its thing and it uses alot of mana. Will it do more damage with a slow 2h weapon and the same listed damage?
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weapon damage used for skills is a tricky one.
i dont think it is visible anywhere atm.
it is basically the base damage of the weapon, combined with any passives + attribute bonuses etc.

i really don't understand dual wield atm myself. there just seems to be NO point in doing it.
if you take a 1h + shield you practically double your survival, and lose like 0.5 dps. ???? :S
the attack speed bonus from dual wielding should be included in the dps calculation.
but it is such a low amount, that you are far better off with the survival of a shield imo.
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85 Gnome Warlock
2750
19/05/2012 02:22Posted by Bankers
How about spells like the plague thing that WDs got? You typically just do it once every pack as it spreads and do its thing and it uses alot of mana. Will it do more damage with a slow 2h weapon and the same listed damage?


Well, what we do know for certain is that for the biggest benefit out of spells that do not stack (like the Wizard's Blizzard and the spell you just mentioned, though I have not tried it myself) do more damage for the Arcane Power or Mana cost with the slowest weapon of the same DPS you find: it is the damage range of the weapon that counts.
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85 Gnome Warlock
2750
weapon damage used for skills is a tricky one.
i dont think it is visible anywhere atm.
it is basically the base damage of the weapon, combined with any passives + attribute bonuses etc.

i really don't understand dual wield atm myself. there just seems to be NO point in doing it.
if you take a 1h + shield you practically double your survival, and lose like 0.5 dps. ???? :S
the attack speed bonus from dual wielding should be included in the dps calculation.
but it is such a low amount, that you are far better off with the survival of a shield imo.


Indeed, this is what I've concluded as well so far. It seems that the second weapon only gives the 15% (I think) speed bonus and a very little damage bonus, judging by how little the DPS goes up.

It's pretty funny actually, since a Barbarian or a Monk can dual-wield weapons, but a Wizard or a Witch Doctor can get more damage out of their off-hand by equipping a Source or a Mojo, since their damage bonuses are added to the base damage of the weapon in their main hand...
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lets not even get started on 2h as well.
every 2h i see has like 1 more dps than a 1h.
ridiculous to see a dagger with more dmg than a big !@# 2h xD
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Dual weld more attack-speed and more stats....

....2Hander more dameg,but less attack-speed and less stats :P
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85 Gnome Warlock
2750
Dual weld more attack-speed and more stats....

....2Hander more dameg,but less attack-speed and less stats :P


But the real question of dual-wielding is this:

Why dual-wield when you can get good stats and only lose a little damage when using a shield?
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I had a simular expirience with my barb when i first tried dual wielding. I started with two weapons with almost identical DPS und managed to go even a little bit LOWER then single weapons. After trying some more weapons i finaly realized, that you need weapons with simular damage and speed, NOT simular DPS.

For the adventage of DW: it seams that damage items (rings & amulets) give more damage output on dual weapons then on singles, but i need to do more testing on this one.
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For the adventage of DW: it seams that damage items (rings & amulets) give more damage output on dual weapons then on singles, but i need to do more testing on this one.


The main advantage of dual wield is faster resource generation -> can afford to use special attacks more often :p

I think also, some classes have a passive that you unlock "later on" which helps to improve stats when using 2h or dual wield, but until you unlock those passives, 1h + shield is probably far more efficient...
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dual wield = faster spirit generation
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To answer your question; What is shown as "Damage" on the character screen is the damage that is applied to your spells. Attackspeed modifiers are still a mystery to me, they apply a HUGE amount of damage to the "Damage" but they also make you attack faster. Double-dipping?

So say you have 10000 "Damage", and your spell hits for 200% of your damage, the spell will (without resistances) hit for 20000.

Does this answer your question?


No it does not.

I have told this at least two or three times in this thread alone, and it is really a mystery to me how some people don't seem to get it, but at least in MY copy of the game, when you hover your mouse over the Damage attribute on inventory screen, it will show you what it is made of. It has nothing to do with the weapon damage used in skills.


Why don't you get something that is so simple?
"Blablah Strike hits enemy for 200% of weapon damage"
Weapon damage in that tooltip = the very same bloody damage number in bold you see in your inventory, that combines your weapons, attack speed and other stuff.

What is the problem here?
If the skill says 200% of weapon damage, it is 200% of that damage you see in the inventory..
How hard is it?

As for your other question, why dual-wield when u could use a shield?
Because gems in weapons can add a !@#$ton of damage, and you get faster resource generation, and you get more procs due to the attack speed bonus (knockbacks, the third strike of many monk attacks, etc).

It really is more simple than you make it. You spend too much thought on the technical mathematical side of things and fail to see the logical big picture. Think more about what your character actually does to the enemy and himself when attacking, rather than the numbers.

Also keep in mind how insanely important attack speed is, especially the bonus by dualwielding (especially if the MH AND OH weapons have attack speed modifiers, which seems to be more prevalent on weapons than shields).
It means, if we stop thinking about the math and start thinking about "real-life" situations, that you can very quickly spam a skill.

For example, while dual-wielding you could spam cyclone strike very very fast, and with the passive that heals you for spending spirit, you suddenly have a new insta-heal that also kills everything around you.

With a 2 hander or shield, it'll cycle far slower and as such would perhaps not mitigate the damage from higher level bosses or %^-*-on-the-ground-trying-to-DoT-you-to-death.

There's alot more than just the numbers to consider.
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85 Gnome Warlock
2750


No it does not.

I have told this at least two or three times in this thread alone, and it is really a mystery to me how some people don't seem to get it, but at least in MY copy of the game, when you hover your mouse over the Damage attribute on inventory screen, it will show you what it is made of. It has nothing to do with the weapon damage used in skills.


Why don't you get something that is so simple?
"Blablah Strike hits enemy for 200% of weapon damage"
Weapon damage in that tooltip = the very same bloody damage number in bold you see in your inventory, that combines your weapons, attack speed and other stuff.

What is the problem here?
If the skill says 200% of weapon damage, it is 200% of that damage you see in the inventory..
How hard is it?


Very hard for you.

Has it ever occurred to you that by the time I read the third answer I actually tested it?

I have a level 38 Wizard, my Damage Attribute is little over 2048.71. If what you are going out of your way to convince me of being true (by the way, it's false, read on), I should be hitting the lowest possible level monsters in the game (the zombies outside of the gates of New Tristram, at the very start of the game, on Normal difficulty) with a spell that does 105% weapon damage with up to 1900, or even 2000, damage.

Here's the catch: I'm hitting them for 700-1200. No matter how many times I test.

I even tried Wave of Force, which does exactly 200% weapon damage by the tooltip. Wanna guess the damage it did?

1600-2200.

I rounded the numbers here, and only tested Wave of Force a few times, but you can NOT be as stupid as to think that what the skills say as weapon damage is not actually a range of damage calculated by taking the original damage of the weapon, all the +damage from gear and gems and such and then multiplying it with the increase from the characters main stat and passive/active skills increases.

I can do some math here to show you this, if you really want to (since numbers are the way to go, duh):

  • My weapon has a damage range of 43-88
  • My added damage bonuses added together give me an extra of 27-47 damage
  • The percentage damage bonuses from Intelligence is 728%, or 8.28 times the original damage
  • My percentage damage bonuses from skills give me and extra 30%, or 1.3 times the original damage

  • Now, I don't actually whether the game adds the damage bonus percentages from skills to the ones from Intelligence before multiplying or not, so here's the math for both possibilities:
    If the % bonuses are added before multiplying, the damage range will be as follows:
  • Minimum damage - (43 + 27) * (8.28 + 0.3) = 70 * 8.58 = 600.6
  • Maximum damage - (88 + 47) * (8.28 + 0.3) = 135 * 8.58 = 1158.3
  • If the % bonuses are both multiplied into the damage, the range will be as follows:
  • Minimum damage - (43 + 27) * 8.28 * 1.3 = 70 * 8.28 * 1.3 = 753.48
  • Maximum damage - (88 + 47) * 8.28 * 1.3 = 135 * 8.28 * 1.3 = 1453.14


  • TL;DR of the mathboxes above: the minimum damage is either about 600 or 750, and the maximum damage is either 1160 or 1450.

    Neither of the minimum damages seem to fit exactly, but I'm not even sure how the game calculates it. The only thing I know for sure after all this math is that the actual weapon damage is not shown anywhere in the game, and that is the whole issue I'm having.
    Edited by DawnBlue#1133 on 20/05/2012 04:07 BST
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