Diablo® III

Diablo 3 - The road NOT taken


We are listening! We may not be very visible at times, but I can promise you that we are not ignoring you.


You are apparently not listening at all when we tell you to block forum posts containing the names of certain gold selling websites. I know this because I report several identical posts serveral times each week, using progressively sterner language, and not only do they and they keep appearing, they actually seem to be taking longer to get removed...
Edited by oogatron#2834 on 14/11/2012 18:57 GMT
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This isn't going to be another of your usual "diablo 3" sucks (as i think this game is awesome), and it isn't going to be another "barbs are OP" even though they are.

This thread is going to be about options the developer team has had over the half year since the game has been out, and what wrong choices they made. My intention in this post is not to start a typical cry thread, but a real discussion that Blizzard can read AND learn from in order to make this game better for us all.

So after the long introduction i'll get on with what I have to say.

1. Economy - The fact that there even is an AH is GREAT, truly a good idea, because if there was none - a black market would rise, which would make the same problems only less controlled.
The problem with this is that once you have given out a gold AH and RMAH (which is a whole bigger story), you need to understand now that this isn't a normal "pc game" but it is now a fully operating Economy.
That being said here are the problems:

  • Gold sinks - There is none. Each patch the game becomes easier, hence less people need to repair items, and more than that every patch the repair prices are lowered.
  • Duping - Once you release the AH duping is annoying, that's true. But once you release RMAH duping is a felony. If I buy from RMAH a $250 bow and then dupe it once, i actually created $250 out of thin air (no work at all). [not to mention there are even gold duping videos running over youtube from way back in patch 1.0.3]


How to fix this you ask?

  • Gold sinks - Gem upgrading has a fail rate which will make you lose the whole gem, so when you do get to a radiant star it will mean something and there will be little of those, and not trillions like in the market atm.
  • Duping - If it has been proved that someone has been hacked and a rollback has been initialized - the account that so called "hacked" him should be blocked OR at a minimum rolled back also


2. Game content.
The biggest problem with the current game is that there is no endgame content, meaning that once a character has finished the game (killed diablo) there is pretty much nothing left to do.
Sure the real hardcore players look for the thrill of being the BEST and will have the proper motivation to be able to finish MP10 and get to Paragon 100, but for the main player mass - this isn't interesting. We want something real, a proper challenge, not finish ACT 3 for the 1000000th time just with each enemy having +10% dps and 150% hp - that's damn boring.

The last patch 1.0.5 brought in the Infernal Machine, a very interesting idea.
People spent days farming for keys and trying to get organs in order to achieve the perfect ring, this made people spend more gold, the inflation went down a tad and now that people have got a good ring - they don't need another, the whole infernal machine has now become as useless as whimsyshire.

3. Class equality.
We all know that the classes aren't equal. I don't want to add anything here as it's obvious what the problems are, just go read another QQ thread on barbs / hunters being so strong, or see how a 50mil barb can stand in unlimited amount of monsters + elites in MP 10 and stay full health without moving or attacking at all.

My point
Listen to the community, the people here bring up great ideas. ideas that you (Blizzard devs) should give more attention to.
For instance what's up with this ring thing? It is pretty useless.. If it was better it would be BiS (like you made the http://us.battle.net/d3/en/item/triumvirate which gives 18% damage bonus even before we start looking at the other affix) and as it is now.. not really worth the hassle - Instead, once you have the whole machine worked up.. got the 3 organs... you now have an option to go to the blacksmith and upgrade an item of your choice, YES upgrade. You give the item of your choice to the blacksmith and he will upgrade one affix giving it a 10% bonus.
Each time you upgrade an item it will get a little blue (1) next to it [next will be (2) then (3).. you got the point]. Each time you take that item for another upgrade it will have a 10*UpgradeLVL chance to fail.
Meaning first time 0% fail chance, 6th time will be 50% chance.
Upon fail - item is gone, item inflation is down, and there is a real challenge in finishing the whole business.

Instead of trying to make a market reset with every patch, when you introduce new rings and amulets / new legendaries, try and make the game balance itself.

http://www.d3rmt.com/auction-house/gold/eu/
This site shows that status of the Gold to Euro, pretty clear that many people are leaving the game and the gold and item inflation is huge while no real gold sink exists.


i like the idea about upgrading but insted of loosing the item perhaps loosing tge +'s insted and dura too, the price of upgrading the item should go up with each succes making the last +'s exspensive but over time worth aiming for, it will work as a freat gold sink, like +1 costs 5 mill +2 10 +3 15 +4 20 and etc, making a + 10 ring without any failure cost 275 million
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An idea how to solve problem about drop rates, rolls and the AH:

Make double D3 profiles on accounts! In game "server options" players can choose non AH profile. On that profile we start creating characters from begining, upgrading Blackmist, Jewler and stash all over again, clean character slots etc., like we've just created fresh D3 game profile.
On that new non AH pofile let everything be the same except:
-no shared stash, Blacksmith and Jewler for characters
-new better item rolls, no str on bows, no dex/int on mighty weapons etc.
-highly increased drop rates for rares, legendary and set items so everyone can find low lvl sets and legendary during leveling and high lvl on inferno difficulty
-no character transfer or anything between profiles
-unlimited or very high amount of character slots due to not sharing anything between characters
-no trading between players!!!! items are bound to characters and their followers!!!!
-level and experience restrictions, lets say, you play on normal mode and when you reach lvl 35 you no longer gain XP in normal mode so you can continoue to farm normal but no gaining levels, nightmare limit lvl 50 and hell of course lvl 60, you gain paragon levels only on inferno difficulty!!!

So every time player start a new character there is no gold in stash, have to uprgade Blacksmith and jewler again, collect plans again, gold etc...

So go on and make a PTR test! On every player profile put non AH profile and test this for one month to see how will this work. Some players will choose that non AH profile to play and some will play AH profile and that's it, problem solved :)))

This will work! I have a hunch ;) You can concider this also like an end game because it will be challenging, specially in hardcore mode, no AH, no items and gold sharing between characters, no trading between players. We can play co-op, PvP in future but with those restrictions, so only real fans of good old Diablo will chose to play on this non AH profile!!

Or at least implement these ideas in a new mode called "hardcore challange" so every hardcore challange character will work like this, no AH, no trading, every new HC challange char from the same begining!!! :) And reward for players playin' this mode will be highly increased drops and much better rolls on items ;) And you got your neverending end game!!! You die and you start again from very same begining, and for month or two you can again have you IK set or 400k dps DH but only one life :)


This post has to be immediatly readed by developers.
+1
Reply Quote
An idea how to solve problem about drop rates, rolls and the AH:

Make double D3 profiles on accounts! In game "server options" players can choose non AH profile. On that profile we start creating characters from begining, upgrading Blackmist, Jewler and stash all over again, clean character slots etc., like we've just created fresh D3 game profile.
On that new non AH pofile let everything be the same except:
-no shared stash, Blacksmith and Jewler for characters
-new better item rolls, no str on bows, no dex/int on mighty weapons etc.
-highly increased drop rates for rares, legendary and set items so everyone can find low lvl sets and legendary during leveling and high lvl on inferno difficulty
-no character transfer or anything between profiles
-unlimited or very high amount of character slots due to not sharing anything between characters
-no trading between players!!!! items are bound to characters and their followers!!!!
-level and experience restrictions, lets say, you play on normal mode and when you reach lvl 35 you no longer gain XP in normal mode so you can continoue to farm normal but no gaining levels, nightmare limit lvl 50 and hell of course lvl 60, you gain paragon levels only on inferno difficulty!!!

So every time player start a new character there is no gold in stash, have to uprgade Blacksmith and jewler again, collect plans again, gold etc...

So go on and make a PTR test! On every player profile put non AH profile and test this for one month to see how will this work. Some players will choose that non AH profile to play and some will play AH profile and that's it, problem solved :)))

This will work! I have a hunch ;) You can concider this also like an end game because it will be challenging, specially in hardcore mode, no AH, no items and gold sharing between characters, no trading between players. We can play co-op, PvP in future but with those restrictions, so only real fans of good old Diablo will chose to play on this non AH profile!!

Or at least implement these ideas in a new mode called "hardcore challange" so every hardcore challange character will work like this, no AH, no trading, every new HC challange char from the same begining!!! :) And reward for players playin' this mode will be highly increased drops and much better rolls on items ;) And you got your neverending end game!!! You die and you start again from very same begining, and for month or two you can again have you IK set or 400k dps DH but only one life :)


This post has to be immediatly readed by developers.
+1


Except Diablo 3is a business and need to make money, this is not charity dude!
You can expect no new patches no fix on bugs nothing other than the game 1.00 version provides on buy. Of course no multilayer because the servers cost too. And i they can not be payed by ads on battle net because i suspect that D3 are allot more sophisticated than the D2 servers
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There is only one thing those Developers should really listen too. Dont make every skills efficiency you have based on your Mainhand Dps. D3 is not half as good as DII, hence the 12 Years in between. Wyatt Cheng or whoever was responsible for that decision just took the easy road on that Issue and it was the probably the worst.

I know that that this is igniting some controversy but you guys (Jay and Wyatt) just took to much over from WoW. While WoW is not a bad game to take from ideas you totally forgot that WoW took Ideas from DII. We dont want to have everything handed on a silver plate. We want to try out things with our Characters. We want to reroll them. We even rerolled 5 Characters of the same class in Hardcore while the other 4 of the same class were still alive. Add some Depth on it. Get away from the (My perception) WoW based Itemization. its just not healthy to the game, especially for those guys( the majority was born before 99) who just expected some game closer to the prequel than to another franchise of yours. Its a long way to go, but if youre still that blizzard that i used to love back then, then its you who can rethink some of the descisions you made.
Edited by Nephelem#1427 on 14/11/2012 23:06 GMT
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14/11/2012 16:20Posted by Vaneras
I believe the CMs are listening, the devs just are not doing anything about it :)


I totally get how frustrating it can be to hunger for new information, and I also know how easy it can be to jump to conclusions when being in that state of mind., but I can assure you that the developers are working hard to make Diablo III a better game... there are many things in the works for future updates, and we will share more detailed information on these things when we are ready to talk about them :-)

When we get mods that don't post for weeks at a time and developers that listen to us by making half measures (give us what we want such as more legendaries yet make item quality seemingly worse) it's no surprise they feel that way. I've not had a good legendary or set item since 1.0.5 to be honest other than one not so brilliant inna's radiance. Thank god I sold it before the rest flooded in because it seems like a lot of people get better items than me. Still no great legendary or set ring, still no amulet, no shoulders, no pants, no armour etc. and just spotting the crap ones.

I'm improving my game, I've gone from not being able to kill goblins to killing almost every goblin, I've improved my MF, I've improved my DPS to go quicker and I've improved my routes as I find quicker mobs. I even paired up with a guy and took out the 3 duo bosses from the infernal machines and I've found next to nothing good. Anyway point is these half measures (such as AH effecting item drops too as everyone noticed increases in legendary items on the first days of the patch) and ignoring the community isn't really instilling confidence. When Americans get replied to near every day there's no wonder we're in the belief that we're not being listened to, especially in EU.
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I think people are somewhat disappointed cause there are times when on US forum there are 10 new blue posts in 3 days and on EU its shows: last post 3 days ago.

I understand sometimes you guys just dont have any info to give to us, but please be active, reply, give opoions on interesting topics, its really good on community morale.

As for development, sure it isnt a democracy, but minor balance changes should be sth like "Community Vote", for example some skill or run arent being buffed for minor amount like 1% and all active players can cast their vote during weeks period. Then devs buff the skill, we test it live and give feedback if that should stay or not. Thats would attract lots of new people to both game and forums and game would have more.. hmm experience to offer.
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Gold sinks - Gem upgrading has a fail rate which will make you lose the whole gem, so when you do get to a radiant star it will mean something and there will be little of those, and not trillions like in the market atm.

above is ridiculous as a gold sink...

A good gold sink would be a gem cant be removed from a weapon
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This topic is great. ++++++1
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I totally agree with alot your saying.
Not only myself, but my whole family are Huge Fans of Diablo.

My Mum in particular is not a farmer, the content is repetative and although there is the intention of Expansions ect, it's just not enough to keep the "RPGer's" entertained. Its becoming Daily-craft in a way.

Putting the Daddy-D in Diablo more then 2-3 times and people get bored. Yes Diablo II was a farm if you played properly, but there was something in it that Diablo III lacks.

Hopefully someone reads this Thread. TTFN
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I'd simple LOVE an upgrade system for items!! Maybe with commonly gained reagents for the first tiers so salvage may gain a real purpose instead of just dismantle blues not worth even for the vendors.

The higher tiers may come with rare or very rare new kind of reagents, organs, etc. i don't know but i thik it's really a good idea. I'm kind of tired of farming gold to be spent in AH and not upgrading on my own.
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12/11/2012 13:45Posted by Shoshi
You give the item of your choice to the blacksmith and he will upgrade one affix giving it a 10% bonus.


Being able to add a socket to an item wouild be... beautiful :) back in D2 there was such an option thrice per character (one time per difficulty level finished).
As for socketing - I'd suggest more things you are able to put into a socket... In D2 you had runes (I miss them so much) gems, skulls... it gave players so much diversity in customising their items. Nowadays there is almost no weapon without an emerald, no helm without amethyst (or ruby if someone is leveling) and so on...
Reply Quote
An idea how to solve problem about drop rates, rolls and the AH:

Make double D3 profiles on accounts! In game "server options" players can choose non AH profile. On that profile we start creating characters from begining, upgrading Blackmist, Jewler and stash all over again, clean character slots etc., like we've just created fresh D3 game profile.
On that new non AH pofile let everything be the same except:
-no shared stash, Blacksmith and Jewler for characters
-new better item rolls, no str on bows, no dex/int on mighty weapons etc.
-highly increased drop rates for rares, legendary and set items so everyone can find low lvl sets and legendary during leveling and high lvl on inferno difficulty
-no character transfer or anything between profiles
-unlimited or very high amount of character slots due to not sharing anything between characters
-no trading between players!!!! items are bound to characters and their followers!!!!
-level and experience restrictions, lets say, you play on normal mode and when you reach lvl 35 you no longer gain XP in normal mode so you can continoue to farm normal but no gaining levels, nightmare limit lvl 50 and hell of course lvl 60, you gain paragon levels only on inferno difficulty!!!

So every time player start a new character there is no gold in stash, have to uprgade Blacksmith and jewler again, collect plans again, gold etc...

So go on and make a PTR test! On every player profile put non AH profile and test this for one month to see how will this work. Some players will choose that non AH profile to play and some will play AH profile and that's it, problem solved :)))

This will work! I have a hunch ;) You can concider this also like an end game because it will be challenging, specially in hardcore mode, no AH, no items and gold sharing between characters, no trading between players. We can play co-op, PvP in future but with those restrictions, so only real fans of good old Diablo will chose to play on this non AH profile!!

Or at least implement these ideas in a new mode called "hardcore challange" so every hardcore challange character will work like this, no AH, no trading, every new HC challange char from the same begining!!! :) And reward for players playin' this mode will be highly increased drops and much better rolls on items ;) And you got your neverending end game!!! You die and you start again from very same begining, and for month or two you can again have you IK set or 400k dps DH but only one life :)


i dont understand how can you say fans of old good diablo and no trading in same post. hell there was lot of trading even on open battle.net characters (you know the ones that could easily cheat items) massively multiplied on actual realm characters. some of you people have really short memory or didnt played legit d2 at all. (legit as in original copy that was able to play online)
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We want brainzzzz!
I mean info, yeah we want some informations about upcoming changes at least.
Edited by Chempo#2976 on 15/11/2012 07:06 GMT
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Community
We all hope for the same thing here (the community), we hope for a better game.
So I hope those "super secret" future updates will fix the over inflated economy and bring back some interest in the Diablo franchise.


You(and many others as well) have posted some valid points, and I just want you guys to know that they have been noted.

The future updates I hint at are not "super secret" per se, the reason why we are not ready to talk about them yet is that there is a lot of iteration and changes happening right now.

How a new feature looks like today for an example may look completely different next week, and as you can imagine it is hard to make a preview or describe a new feature if that feature will work completely different upon release.

We also don't want to raise false expectations, so if we announce a new feature and people get all excited about it, then those very same people might get very upset if the developers find that the new feature actually doesn't work out very well and decide to replace it with something they feel works better.
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Community

We are listening! We may not be very visible at times, but I can promise you that we are not ignoring you.


You are apparently not listening at all when we tell you to block forum posts containing the names of certain gold selling websites. I know this because I report several identical posts serveral times each week, using progressively sterner language, and not only do they and they keep appearing, they actually seem to be taking longer to get removed...


Slightly off-topic, but yes, those posts are very annoying. We remove these posts all the time, yet they are always ready with a new account to post with... it is an ongoing "cat and mouse" game I'm afraid :-(

I know it is really frustrating, so thanks a ton for your continued efforts with reporting these posts.
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Thank you very much.
I want you to know these replies from you guys mean a LOT to all of us.
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