Diablo® III

PvP will last mere seconds?

Hi everyone!

Haven't really played the game that much the last few months as I got bored pretty quick from doing the same levels and places over and over and over and.... well, you get the idea. :)

But now I see an increasingly amount of posts about PvP, and I was wondering. It's pretty common to see players with over a 100K dps, with some people claiming to do over 300K dps buffed.
That's nice and all, but with healthpools around 30-60K, wouldn't that mean that players will be killed in mere seconds? Even with players having 75% allres a 300K dps player will blow through such a healthpool in less then a second right?

So not a whine about PvP, just curious about how it would work out once it's released. :)
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90 Pandaren Monk
0
we have no information of how it is going to be implemented yet so i dont see much of a discussion is here for this at the moment.

personally...i hope they separate PvP from normal PvE diablo and dont allow RMAH with it.
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separated PvP gear = tons of cry here immediately from RMAH kiddos..
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29/11/2012 13:53Posted by Armorpiercer
separated PvP gear = tons of cry here immediately from RMAH kiddos..


you forgot the possibility for PvP RMAH/AH same as HC is separate
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They have to normalise it. It goes without saying. OP is right. Currently people would be 1 shot with a crit. I know they are doing arenas but I think most people want to see pvp zones and I just don't think that is possible without pvp gear only or a new char/ladder/hc type system.
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PvP will last mere seconds?

I very much doubt it. They will have to make it so that a character can sustain damage from 2 or even 3 players, at least for like 5-6 seconds.

It's pretty common to see players with over a 100K dps, with some people claiming to do over 300K dps buffed.
That's nice and all, but with healthpools around 30-60K, wouldn't that mean that players will be killed in mere seconds?

You are right that it's pretty damn easy to get your skills to crit for over 200K Damage, but it's damn hard to get your health over 100k HP.

As of current I've got 80k HP. My Bola Shot can crit for over 200k, however when reflected upon me (by a key warder or these other monsters which can reflect) i don't oneshot myself, because the damage is reduced twice -- one by armor and once by resistances.
If that's not enough, i am certain that Blizzard will implement additional modifier that would reduce damage against other players.

Many players don't seem to know that back in Diablo2 the damage vs another player was reduced by one sixth (or one eight, i don't remember exactly). I think that it worked out quite well, at least until the introduction of the synergy bonuses with 1.10, then the damage became so big that this modifier didn't mattered so much :*(.

I very much doubt that we'll get to see a specific PvP gear, however i expect improvements in the crafting, so that the newer players or the ones who just returned can catch up or get relatively close to the more dedicated players.
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29/11/2012 14:14Posted by Noxifer
I very much doubt that we'll get to see a specific PvP gear


the database has been trawled and there are pvp tokens so its presumed there will be. nothing is final tho so we will see.
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RMAH doesn't makes the game "pay-to-win" as long as it stays in PvE. However, PvP is all about playing against other players, and unlike the AI controlled mobs, players can get frustrated, pretty eaisly especially in Diablo, because if they'll be disappointed in PvP, nothing can save this game (from their perspective). RMAH should not effect PvP.

But how? Somebody buys something good in RMAH and he can't use it in PvP, but he can in PvE? That's stupid, now the RMAH user becames annoyed, feeling he is betrayed by the system he paid for.

The only solution to make PvP fights balanced and skill based (as it should be, if you don't agree with that, you just want to win, no matter if it was your doing, your skills, or just your wallet and a bad class / skill / item balance), is to make PvP gear and the chance to get better PvP gear equal to everyone.

Check Guild Wars 2 - it has the most balanced PvP in online game's history.

Why?

Everyone starts with the same level - even if you are lv5, when you enter PvP mode, you get to max level (only for PvP of course), you get all your skills and everything unlocked. Diablo III has no problem with that.

You lose all your gear, but you get much much more stronger ones with godlike stats from the very beginning. Everyone gets those. Damage scale can be controlled this way, so noone get's 1 hitted because bad item balance, and skills are easier to balance (from Blizzard's perspective) than items, because those effect all classes and all players, including the economy.

There are NPCs you can "buy" PvP gear from, for totally free - it's equally strong compared to the good one you get at start, but made for different builds. Totally should be in Diablo III.

You get points in PvP for scoring (capture), kills, helping (heal, buffs) others, and you can spend these points at the mentioned NPC for a higher tier gear. How I imagine this in Diablo III: you level up your "PvP level", and when you reach a point (let's say PvPlv10) you unlock the next tier. You can buy the new items, and once you bought a piece, that will be free in the future but only for that character.

So, what we got?
Equal chances
Skill based fights, it matters if you are smart, got good reflexes.
Easier balance for Blizzard: all they have to care about is PvP gear (equal for everyone in the same class) and skill balance. The economy can't be fixed, deal with it, and if it poisons PvP, Diablo III is totally dead.
Ladders and scores will show how good you are, instead of how rich you are.
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29/11/2012 13:53Posted by Armorpiercer
separated PvP gear = tons of cry here immediately from RMAH kiddos..


don't care, pay to win will be an instant failure.

i didn't necessarily mean separate gear just as someone else pointed out it would have to be normalized, thus making those shiny oranges that people with too much money buy wont give them a ''i win'' button, if that happens PvP will not take off.

you forgot the possibility for PvP RMAH/AH same as HC is separate


Maybe, if RMAH is allowed and its not separted and gear is not normalized then blizzard will gain a very bad reception from the pvp crowd from more than just Diablo players.

If that's not enough, i am certain that Blizzard will implement additional modifier that would reduce damage against other players.


don't hold your breath, there typical ''Resilience will fix it'' stance will not be tolerated a second time around.
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Most high end geared players can do 1-2 million dps in burst damage for at least a few seconds, some the very best geared can not only maintain that for many seconds but go even higher.

Recently there has been several Benchmark kills of bosses and ubers on MP10, starting with Azmodan, and if you see the gear of those who kill Azmodan on MP10 (138 million hp) in 20-30 seconds, then they all have very high AR, solid HP and have sharpend their skills, passivs and gear towards as much damage output as possible in as short a time. It is not hard to get up there, you just need the right gear and big weapons.

Most players can push it to 90-95% mitigation with 60-80K hp (maybe pass 100K), but even at 95% and 100K hp, a 1 million damage hit takes you 50,000 hp down, and 2 of those kill you.

So yes, PvP will at this point in time be something that potentially will be over in a few seconds, be it from an invisible DH, be in from a jumping beserker Barb, be it from a bunch of angry birds.

Blizzard needs to adress certain elements of damage dealing and mitigation, but also certain skills, and if they are and how they are we can only guess at. I for one believes that the 30% passive damage reduction bonus Barbs and Monks get is unbalanced versus other players, Detox believes that damage versus players needs to be lowered because of the instant kills regardless of protection scenarios, and others have put light on other issues which are either unbalanced or problematic towards PvP.

What Blizzard will do about the numerous issues that PvP will rise, we can only wait for. But unless damage is directly adresses, PvP combat will for some be over in less than a few seconds.
Edited by Cottonface#1659 on 29/11/2012 16:12 GMT
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Community
29/11/2012 13:49Posted by Menkoro
So not a whine about PvP, just curious about how it would work out once it's released. :)


Nothing wrong with being curious :-)

There is not much info available yet on how PvP will feel like in Diablo III, but I am sure that things should become more clear after the PvP blog has been posted... it should hopefully not be too long before it is ready:
https://twitter.com/Angryrobotics/status/273136341758402560
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FYI.

http://i.imgur.com/6eIX2.jpg

hehe
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Soon in Sweden means 1h up to 6 days.
I have learned that Soon has no meaning in the rest of the world, especially on the internet, it means "in the future".

I do also think that information on PvP is welcome, but people will be upset if there is no releasedate. People will remain people and complains all the time even if the information provided is excellent.

Blizzard have surprised me many times with super fast news and fun facts.

Running a D3 PvP site, this is really good news and hopefully we, the small sites, have the chance to glow this time.

Thanks.
Edited by Enkeria#1978 on 29/11/2012 16:25 GMT
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Community
FYI.

http://i.imgur.com/6eIX2.jpg

hehe


Hahahaha... that almost made me snarf ;-)
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29/11/2012 16:27Posted by Vaneras
Hahahaha... that almost made me snarf ;-)


Damn, I miss SnarfQuest :)
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29/11/2012 14:21Posted by SaltyDaveIV
Check Guild Wars 2 - it has the most balanced PvP in online game's history.


Have you gotten an EEG recently ... Was it FLATLINE ????

GW 2 will fail harder n worser than GW 1 , and this poor product D3 , also the smell of 1HKO in the upcoming PVP is so strong as of late , cos all of the rage that there has to bee PUVPE gear in D3 and no DR in PvP by the obviously blind majority of players that has remained here as of now , i think 1.1 ( what was the promised patch number for the PUVPE patch ) will be the final nail in the coffin about this game , and Bli$$ard in general , and I say - it was about damn time & bring it on . Albeit , this hopefully will serve as a wake up call for all other companies to stop producing half-@$$t products just cos they have a certain name in the bizz
Edited by ivomnik#1381 on 29/11/2012 17:29 GMT
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like wow, you pop all your cd and the duel last 5 seg
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Sure, if everyone uses the offensive gear required to speedfarm, which is the current end game, yes we would 1-shot eachother. But that's probably not the best setup for PvP, But I can probably get quadruple my ehp at the cost of halving my DPS at the current AH prices. At least in theory that should double my output damage before dying.

I think successful PvP will require a lot tankier gear than people wear today, that will also make the fights more enjoyable (longer).

I don't want to turn this into another PvP-gear thread, but people with surely want at least 2 sets of gear, successful PvP players will surely even have multiple PvP sets to counter different opponents.
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29/11/2012 16:13Posted by Vaneras
So not a whine about PvP, just curious about how it would work out once it's released. :)


Nothing wrong with being curious :-)

There is not much info available yet on how PvP will feel like in Diablo III, but I am sure that things should become more clear after the PvP blog has been posted... it should hopefully not be too long before it is ready: https://twitter.com/Angryrobotics/status/273136341758402560


So you actually saying that we wont see LADDER anytime soon...

I never played action RPGs for their PVP , even if it was a plus i did it for fun and that alone.

I dont know what you thinking or what your ideas are ( not you personally Vaneras , im talking about developers and this Jay Wilson ) but if i judge from previous ideas , which led diablo 3 near to destruction , im not so hyped about them...

LADDER / Expand itemization / Social aspect of game >>> PVP arenas at the moment. Why again you doin the WRONG move the WRONG moment....? I dont get you people seriously.
Economy is dying day by day more people quiting as we speak , many of them wont consider come back if nothing major changes and with economy being in such a mess.

Im wondering who is making all those bad decisions 5 years now. Is Jay Wilson again?
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as i say be4 bliz need to add buff potions that balance the players ,each chart with a different potion,the potions wll craft at npc with all craft materials(books ,gems, gold and all salvage) , the potion wll have cooldown that u have to act in a strategy when to use it.
to do pvp gear its a bad idea after all its a game that base on a drops .
and the other advantage is that the AH wll wake up with this idea -gold sink(as well gems salvage and so)
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