Diablo® III

Blizzard - please implement this to stop all botting

- Diablo III
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I'm guessing Bliz have already considered this idea then Vaneras?

Also where have you been this week it feels like you've been off else where :(

Anyway do you have any information about possibly future ideas to prevent the bots?

Also any sneaky info on patch 1.0.7 ;)

Finally if we don't see you again before Christmas, Merry Christmas.
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20/12/2012 12:21Posted by Vaneras
Yep, I know many would not mind this at all (chosing the lesser evil and all that), but there are people who would be very annoyed by a CAPTCHA system like the one suggested here


Well, maybe, but come on, if you have to type in a few letters every 2 hours or so (of every hour) why not? It indeed is the lesser of two evils but I consider all the botting as a far bigger problem.

If because of this there are no more botters/cheaters I would say: install it tomorrow. It really a small inconvenience compared to the immense benefits imo!

Oh, and by the way: Happy Christmas to you Vaneras and all your colleagues!!!
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Given most players would never see the CAPTCHA, and legitimate players who triggered it would have the frequency of it reduced to once every couple of days, I fail to see how that is annoying compared to the annoyance of having the game's economy destroyed and cheaters running rife.
Edited by FuriousGeorg#2102 on 20/12/2012 12:36 GMT
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CAPTCHA are easily breakable with the current state of OCR/ICR.

They need to adjust their Bots to recognize only this particular kind of D3 captcha and captcha system is defeated.

Better some other system to do that.

I for one would like random quick quests to popup and need to be solved in X amoutn of time if not you get disconnected for X minutes as punishment.

For example:

- Find SuperDuper rare monster in arreat crater lvl 2, and kill him.

After you get the quest the monster spawns, and you need to kill him in some amount of time, and he drops something cool.

Maybe not completing X quests in a row could trigger the punishment, not just one.
But not doing them at all means something is fishy about this account and is probably botting.

It could be fun and its not something a Bot can do at all.
Edited by marsovac#2732 on 20/12/2012 12:43 GMT
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There is a far simpler solution.

Dispense with the AH and bind everything to the account it dropped on.

No farcical "market" - no botters.

....and PvP means something again.
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Posts: 2,796
Bear in mind Vaneras the CAPTCHA only need appear at all if the client/servers detect activity that may be botting. And a legitimate player detected in this way, that has answered the CAPTCHA a few times, will have the time between CAPTCHA's massively increased.

So once running it will be something like, excluding the botters:
90% of players will never see a CAPTCHA
10% of players, who trigger the bot match pattern, will very quickly have it reduced down to say once every 2 days or even more.

Thanks for the feedback though.


Sure, a CAPTCHA system combined with other detection systems would be an improvement, in that legitimate players would be less likely to be bothered by it. If we were ever to implement a CAPTCHA system, this type of approach would likely be considered :-)


A question i have everytime i see a blue post is whether u have the info to answer advanced stuff concerning the game. I mean arent u a community admin? Or do u have other responsibilities aswell ?


This is rather off-topic, but I will answer it anyway as this is a question I get fairly often.

As a CM I am often privy to information regarding the development of the game, but I do not know everything of course as I am not a developer. Some of the things I know I am unable to share right now as said things are still eligible to change.

The developers get player questions and feedback from us all the time, but it is not always that they are able to answer said questions and feedback because they have not yet decided on the best way of doing so. The processes for everything the developers do are all very iterative, and this means that things can change dramatically before they reach certainty. Once the developers have made their decision on something though, that is when we can give you information and be sure that it is the correct information.

Basically what I am trying to say is that the right answer to a question one day may be wrong answer the day after, so we prefer not to give answers until we are certain that they are the right ones. I can assure you that when I do have info to "answer advanced stuff concerning the game", I will share that info with you right away.
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20/12/2012 12:46Posted by Vaneras
Bear in mind Vaneras the CAPTCHA only need appear at all if the client/servers detect activity that may be botting.


The same should happen for my idea of anti bot system. So players are not bothered by random quests if they do not behave like bots.

Repeating same run over and over would actually be fun for those guys if they get some quest from time to time :)

And bots could not possibly solve them .
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CAPTCHA are easily breakable with the current state of OCR/ICR.

They need to adjust their Bots to recognize only this particular kind of D3 captcha and captcha system is defeated.

Better some other system to do that.

I for one would like random quick quests to popup and need to be solved in X amoutn of time if not you get disconnected for X minutes as punishment.

For example:

- Find SuperDuper rare monster in arreat crater lvl 2, and kill him.

After you get the quest the monster spawns, and you need to kill him in some amount of time, and he drops something cool.

Maybe not completing X quests in a row could trigger the punishment, not just one.
But not doing them at all means something is fishy about this account and is probably botting.

It could be fun and its not something a Bot can do at all.


Such random events are nothing new.

Runescape have implemented such system to fight bots since like 2002 or so.

And guess what? The bots were just adjusted to solve those events.

Since any randomization is just chosing from a predefined set of parts an event can be composed from, you can be sure that bot developers will find ways how to 'teach' the bots to do these random quests sucessfully.
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I suppose the captcha could be activated when the player (or bot) portals back to stash goodies for sale. This would be less disruptive.
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Guys to say that a system could be defeated by changes to the bots does not automatically discount the system. This is very much an arms race and one solution will not be the be all and end all, it will need constant refinement/change.
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20/12/2012 13:21Posted by Grom
I suppose the captcha could be activated when the player (or bot) portals back to stash goodies for sale. This would be less disruptive.


Indeed, only in towns, only when no bad guys activated nearby etc, the system does not have to be that disruptive.
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The developers get player questions and feedback from us all the time, but it is not always that they are able to answer said questions and feedback because they have not yet decided on the best way of doing so. The processes for everything the developers do are all very iterative, and this means that things can change dramatically before they reach certainty. Once the developers have made their decision on something though, that is when we can give you information and be sure that it is the correct information. Basically what I am trying to say is that the right answer to a question one day may be wrong answer the day after, so we prefer not to give answers until we are certain that they are the right ones. I can assure you that when I do have info to "answer advanced stuff concerning the game", I will share that info with you right away.


If the dev's had enough in the pipeline for D3 then there would always be enough info to share. I find it hard to believe that free2play games can release new content and share new info daily when they didn't get the upfront investment from players. I do realize that they are raking in a steady stream of money as well, but so is Blizz from the RMAH. Are the dev's waiting till after the new year to make any game announcements?
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Why do you think CAPTCHA would work?

You get spam bots on 4Chan all the time, an they have a CAPTCHA system in place. Why would this be any different?
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I'm against any of such measures. And if this is soften-up for example giving plenty of time for player to answer and having this only as a reminder for an hour the probability a botter turns the screen on, notices the question and gives an answer.

It is also not illegal to play while having more than just a couple of beers. Being heavily intoxicated the ability to give correct answers isn't that good.

I have taken my own course of action regarding the bots: don't buy stuff from Auction house. Not a single item. I have broken my personal house-rule few times months back, but it was gold auction house purchases. Another rule: play only with real life friends or alone. I have broken this rule also, and I admit I had a blast while I played in a public game. This is a hard part, I know it.

But in general, following these two simple rules there's no way a botter can ruin my gaming experience.
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20/12/2012 12:21Posted by Vaneras
Yep, I know many would not mind this at all (chosing the lesser evil and all that), but there are people who would be very annoyed by a CAPTCHA system like the one suggested here


Thank you for reply.
You can put it on Inferno only.. so.. QQ-babys can play hell with no problem and real players who like this game will accept situation and play.
There MUST be some quality change. This current situation is not good at all.

btw: captcha can be triggered in "idle situation" (walking, town, after fight). Its easy to detect how many commands are in one "data pocket" going to and back from server.
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http://static.fjcdn.com/pictures/chinese_56cd2d_2159939.jpg
also remember , catpcha with cats
A bot wouldn't take note of that warning where as a human would. Plus what's wrong with a little 10 minute break?

yea . i'm sure everyone who plays videogames follow that logic of "every hour take a break"


And your telling me you could sit and play consistently for 7/8 hours straight with out even taking a break to go to the toilet?

Its something that only the most hardcore and botters would see. Being that you have sat and played a game for more time than is healthy without pausing or stopping and generally behaving like a bot.
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To be able to port to another player or use the WP's there could be a short three symbol combination. this combination is never the same. its an easy combination and the answer is given to you. but if you enter it wrong it changes. and you have to try again. a bot could not do this. a person would have to do it. no way around it. its only to port out of town not to port back.

There problem solved no CAPTCHA system needed. And it sorta makes sense to be able to fast travel there should be some sort of incantation required anyways.
I know it wont be as fast to get around as it is now but whats three extra clicks?

you click on the flag or wp, then abunch of pictures appear and you select the three picture another dialog box indicates.
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- Diablo III
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20/12/2012 12:46Posted by Vaneras
The developers get player questions and feedback from us all the time, but it is not always that they are able to answer said questions and feedback because they have not yet decided on the best way of doing so. The processes for everything the developers do are all very iterative, and this means that things can change dramatically before they reach certainty. Once the developers have made their decision on something though, that is when we can give you information and be sure that it is the correct information.


Apologies for this but that seemed like a long winded way of saying "we wont tell you anything until it's released" albeit a very diplomatic way of saying that, however the E3 stuff and blizcon stuff that we saw prior to release looked amazing and yet none of it made it into the game because the devs felt it wasn't any good or worth being in the game!

That being said almost everyone was appalled at them being cut out and things removed, some of the stuff was the primary reasons people bought the game only to get it and go "yea they lied" so obviously the stance of not telling us anything is to prevent those people from crying about it like they will.

However not telling us about the direction or the ideas you have is annoying the other lot of people so in short it's a lose, lose situation or a damned if you do damned if you don't.

What I would suggest is to let people know what areas you are working on for the next patch but don't give details, let them know that a certain part of the game might change or a certain class will be getting looked into more depth, you don't have to say we're doing x y and z with said class you can be very limited while letting people know about what's sort of going on.

I think this would help because let's be honest patch 1.0.6 was a joke and wound a lot of people up, people were expecting some proper bug fixes and possibly some skills looked at which are underpowered, people were also looked for the other classes to be brought on par with the easy mode barb which didn't happen. Had you said prior something like "Patch 1.0.6 will be very small and to address some minor issues" people wouldn't have reacted very much to it at all.

Keeping people in the loop is 101 of CS.
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I hate botters in D3 since economy is so unstable and changes due to speculation, but CAPTCHA? Seriously?
This is most annoying thing ever, I would stop playing for sure if I had to fill out some stupid forms every 30-60 minutes. Its terrible for legitimate players and botters will surely find a way around. Why just don't you add some sort of scanning feature that checks for illegal background programs. This would eliminate so called sunday botters for sure. Idk about ppl with 100+ acc that ruin economy most.
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i've wrote about that here: http://eu.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/5966447140

Why not remove botters by adding non-pause captcha? This could work like this, but other ways are possible too: while being ingame (running and farming), there will be one random notification that appears on a corner of the screen and has a countdown (for all players if there's more than one player in current game); with a message that will force player to do the easy math or something else, like picking correct picture, not just the usual "type the following" etc. (up to 30 mins to reply allowed, than disconnect) - basically a captcha that doesn't pause the game. This could be adjusted to not be a big issue for real players - pop-up once in like 6-8 hours of play - is that really a problem, when we could have reduced number of bots with better AH experience?

Accounts that doesn't reply to captcha numerous times, could be flagged and just checked for possible bot farming. It could be a part of Blizzard's Terms of Use.

Please say what you think in a post, add sticky request, give a rating to the main post.

And to all sceptics out there: this can be changed in many ways over time, to be even a safer method to determine, who actually is playing the game. If done properly, it won't be a harassment to legit players.

As to one popular reply that say NO to captcha in any form:

Bots will adjust to new security features, therefore captcha will remain useless after short period of time.


Why not change the captcha system and methods, every time Blizzard announces maintenance break? They just could change things around the captcha week by week, thus provide a better marketplace for everyone and forcing bots creators to be busy again.

If not captcha, what would you propose? The question is more about how we can fight with botting, because at the current state, very important aspect of the game - economy, is broken and Blizzard, while trying hard, is still unable to find a way to fix it. Removing bots is the key here.

edit: also, if you're interested in fixing item diversity problem, meaning - if you want best 2h, in 9 of 10 instances you'll end up with Skorn or - if you're DH - Manticore, best bracers - Lacuni, and so on, please read and write here: http://eu.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/5848176597 Thanks!
Edited by fhantomPL#1840 on 20/12/2012 14:45 GMT
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