Diablo® III

No gear Diversity? Everybody gears the same...

Ok, so this has been pissing me off in this game. What defines a good geared person in this game is whether he has a good roll on the SAME item as everyone else.

Let's take a barb for an example (Cause i know most about them). Well if people don't gear this way already, this is most likely the goal for their endgame.

Main hand: Everyone wants an Echoing fury with crit and socket, but usually people end up with 1 of them unless they are rich... (Main reason for Echoing fury is better than anything else is that the bonus attacks per seconds applies to offhand)

Offhand: A rare Weapon with as much dps as possible with these stats: Crit dmg, socket, Lifesteal, Str(+vit possibly).

Boots: Ice climbers with movement speed and high mainstats, if they want movement speed and cant afford: IK boots. If not, they buy Ice climbers without movement speed then.

Pants: Here are actually 2 choices for someone aiming for endgame. Blackthorns pants to aim for enough survivability, or Inna's pants for most dps, aswell as the MS, IAS, etc.

Belt: No questions asked unless u have trouble with Reflect... Witching hour.

Chest: IK Chest. No questions asked.

Gloves: IK gloves, to get 2set bonus from chest for allres, and they roll more strenght than any gloves out there.

Bracers: Lacunis with crit ofc, and rares for a cheaper "temporarily choice"

Shoulders: Well here are 2 possible choices aswell, High mainstats rare or Vile wards.

Head: Mempo of Twilight (If you can afford it with crit)

Neck: I know of no good legendary neck for barb, so easly a trifactor + average DMG with mainstats would do.

Rings: Here you more or less actually have a choice, either buy a rare, or pull some luck out of your butt to get these stats on a hellfire ring: IAS, CD, CC, Average dmg, Mainstat <- pretty much it mainly.

.... All i try to say is that this pisses me off, because if i want to be as strong as i can, i MUST aim for these items, and these items only. I know the crafting stuff comes out too, but it is barely any different from normal rares... -.-

Everyone wants the same stats, same items, high rolls. People don't really get to choose between many epic items, and the armour can't even be upgraded/altered any other way than sockets. Atleast that is true if u want to max yourselves out. Same goes for skills tho, there are few available, and most people use the same few.

I don't know if you took your time to read this, but i kinda just wanted to share this with you guys and hear your thoughts? I am not a developer so i have no intention on coming up with ideas to change this, cause it is not my job, but i think there should be atleast a little more diversity, no?

Peace out.
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I agree. There's far too little diversity in this game, including (but certainly not limited to) gear. It's the same for Monk, although there are a few more slots with options than the Barb has, apparently.

In other news, Jay Wilson quit his post as game director for this game the other day. We can hope the next game director bring with him/her some fresh ideas, and introduce more good items to choose from. Perhaps a new redesign of the legendaries is in order? The already good ones should stay as they are, but the ones that no-one uses, those who always ends up as Brimstones, should be redesigned in a way that makes them as good as the already good legendaries, but still different. Different in a way that you have to make a hard choice which one you prefer on YOUR character. Like for example the Mempo of Twilight, it comes with 8-9% attack speed. What if the Helm of Command came with similar main stats as Mempo, but had xx-xx% critical hit damage as a guaranteed extra stat. Dps-wise you'd end up in the same ballpark with both, but you'd have to choose; do I want more attack speed or do I want more critical damage? And you'd have to choose based on your own preference, and by what best fits your play style and your preferred skills.

It doesn't really take too much fantasy to come up with ideas for diversity far better than we have now. Let's just hope some of those ideas finds their way into the game sooner or later.
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Bad itemization is bad.
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Agree, it's like clones party with minor DNA distortions. Main reason is bad itemization. Particularly legendary items are of two types: a must have ones and "100% brimstones". Those brimstone legendaries feels like they exist just to fill the gap, not for some reasonable purpose. Unbalanced affixes, CC, CD, IAS are crucial while specific affixes like "chance to ", special item skills simply are not worth even to consider. Basically, yes, there's no diversity at all, what is actually boring. Sadly this issue been mentioned in other threads, but dev team didn't care, because of their own vision what is fun/good and what's not. Maybe new game director will go in right direction, if not, then RIP D3
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Gotta say i agree with all of you 3 :D I admit this is an old topic, but through out the game's timeline this bad diversity becomes more and more clear, and more frustrating aswell
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18/01/2013 23:54Posted by Pzycko
Gotta say i agree with all of you 3 :D I admit this is an old topic, but through out the game's timeline this bad diversity becomes more and more clear, and more frustrating aswell

To be honest, I was pretty much annoyed by the itemization by like.. level 30-40.
No procs, no oskills, no Uniques, no nothing punk.
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There needs to be builds that don´t benefit from crit and crit damage and high attack speed (everybody gears for these). i think they´re attempting to correct this, but the steps so far are small, such as improving rubies to give out more average damage.

it would be fun if thorns was actually good, or if pickup radius was actually a damage stat for some spells. same thing with healthglobes, what if there´s was a skill that allowed you to detonate healthglobes, and this damage would be increased by your health globe heal. :P
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Yep.. I like playing this game but the reasons why I do so are wrong.
I like this game because;

1 Its a game from Blizzard, best PC gaming company ever with Bioware and Interplay. I know Bliz has skill and money to fix their product

2 Its a Diablo game, core of it will always be good.

And now about the subject.. I am no computer game designer BUT even I can easily understand that almost all the choices they made concerning about the itemization were bad.

How on earth they come up with this? Were was the guy who would have said " umm guys.. wheres the faster cast ability,hit recovery, really different builds and skills." And even if you exclude Throne of Baal, Diablo 2 had much more variety between different classes and builds.
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I guess I'm missing something here... you're complaining that every hero is essentially aiming towards the BiS items? There's a reason the items are BiS, it's because there isn't anything better, or they wouldn't be BiS.
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19/01/2013 01:47Posted by Meteorblade
I guess I'm missing something here... you're complaining that every hero is essentially aiming towards the BiS items? There's a reason the items are BiS, it's because there isn't anything better, or they wouldn't be BiS.


I think it's more like this: "Best in slot items have very similar stats"

While Diablo 2 had many best in slot items for different specs, most of the uniques had relatively different stats. And there were procs and such. Diablo 3 has a boring centralized itemization, and thus pretty much everyone needs exactly the same stats.

I mean, Diablo 3 has very few specific affixes that are only useful for some builds.
To provide an example: In Median XL my mid-level meleesorc main attribute is dexterity, she needs elemental damages, life steal, weapon-damage procs, etcetera.

My elemental Sorceress has energy as her main attribute, and needs things like Fire-, Lightning-, Poison-, Cold- spelldamage/- enemy resists. Other useful things are reanimates for meat shields, Energy Factor to spell damage, and such.

They need pretty wildly different stats.

Hypothetically place them in D3, and they need the exact same stats. Weapon damage is everything, they both need Energy (intellect), and while they might have a few different stat preferences, most are the same.

TL;DR Items have way too few different affixes, stat priorities are way too similar for everyone, and items are plainly boring.
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This was a problem in D2 as well which has sadly persisted into D3. The top end people (they are top end though so not everyone) all use 90% the same gear. They never really fixed that in D2 either. In a way it was when they buffed legendaries in D3 that caused this, before that most were curiosities at best.
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Excuse me, is this the same game company that made WoW? (yes different game but same logic...) or let me ask this way, which of Blizz's game there is something you called "gear diversity"?
Edited by Everhate#2715 on 19/01/2013 03:57 GMT
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19/01/2013 03:57Posted by Everhate
Excuse me, is this the same game company that made WoW? (yes different game but same logic...) or let me ask this way, which of Blizz's game there is something you called "gear diversity"?

what

D2 has gear diversity. WoW has a little, but not really.
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Ok, so this has been pissing me off in this game. What defines a good geared person in this game is whether he has a good roll on the SAME item as everyone else.

Let's take a barb for an example (Cause i know most about them). Well if people don't gear this way already, this is most likely the goal for their endgame.

Main hand: Everyone wants an Echoing fury with crit and socket, but usually people end up with 1 of them unless they are rich... (Main reason for Echoing fury is better than anything else is that the bonus attacks per seconds applies to offhand)
->>> SKORN +LS

Offhand: A rare Weapon with as much dps as possible with these stats: Crit dmg, socket, Lifesteal, Str(+vit possibly).

Boots: Ice climbers with movement speed and high mainstats, if they want movement speed and cant afford: IK boots. If not, they buy Ice climbers without movement speed then.
->>> Zunimasa Boots (+all ress if u can afford) cause that 8% is a great bonus dmg on black weapons

Pants: Here are actually 2 choices for someone aiming for endgame. Blackthorns pants to aim for enough survivability, or Inna's pants for most dps, aswell as the MS, IAS, etc.
->>> Agree

Belt: No questions asked unless u have trouble with Reflect... Witching hour.

Chest: IK Chest. No questions asked.
->>> Tall Rasha Chest (+ all ress if u can afford)

Gloves: IK gloves, to get 2set bonus from chest for allres, and they roll more strenght than any gloves out there.
->>> or any other random yellow glove with STR/IAS/CC/CD

Bracers: Lacunis with crit ofc, and rares for a cheaper "temporarily choice"
->>> Stronggard with high mainstat + vit

Shoulders: Well here are 2 possible choices aswell, High mainstats rare or Vile wards.
->>> Agree

Head: Mempo of Twilight (If you can afford it with crit)
->>> Agree

Neck: I know of no good legendary neck for barb, so easly a trifactor + average DMG with mainstats would do.
->>> STR/IAS/CC/CD

Rings: Here you more or less actually have a choice, either buy a rare, or pull some luck out of your butt to get these stats on a hellfire ring: IAS, CD, CC, Average dmg, Mainstat <- pretty much it mainly.
->>> Agree

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You have a point but i disagree with you at least for tree reasons:

1. There are people who do not go only for DPS. DPS is for farming faster but not really the point of the game especially after the patch where ehp will matter to. Is true that if you want to go for dps you do not have so much choices but if you go for balanced builds there is a build deversity.

2. The stats of some items or bonuses are underestimated for some unexplained reason. lets take sky splitter for example or a spear with increased attack speed. people tend to follow other builds instead of thinking a unique built.

3. Did you tried to play double or triple set????
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The big problem is that in D3 it all boils down to pure damage; whether you're summoning a rain of frogs, spinning with an axe like a lunatic, or firing crossbows and throwing mines.

All your skills, almost all of your usefulness, rely how much DPS you can dish out, and, of course, there are optimal methods of doing so, hence why everyone is building crits + attack speed.
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This is because:
Their are very few items that give a huge boost to skills (ignore the poxy 3-10% or whatever, I mean 30%+).

All player stats are gained from their gear and not from player assigned stats points (as per D2), so there no option to develop your player stats one way and gear stats another at even a simplistic level, never mind chasing gear for specific skill stats. There are no level to skills either, and without levels, there is no place for +skill level items, just the minimaland boring +little bit of damage%, or -tiny cost or +tiny crit chance % etc.

The nearest we have to item diversity in this is maybe WD sacrifice build, barb throw, wiz cm-freeze and barb ww, wiz meteor - because each of these builds need slightly different stat focus and maybe a huge skill boost focus. If we ignore the skills that just need huge crit and huge ias, then there isnt much left in terms of diversity.

Also some build which should be viable are not beuause you cannot usefully stack enough skill cost reductions (or other skill bonusses) to make them work in a manner that compares to other builds. Even the barb throw build (50% damage boost from gear combined with -9 cost) eventually start to fall far short of the real dps acheivable with best rare gear and especially other builds.
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PvP will change that. I already see many different builds on different classes. And it's not only about having less gold to gear. Today I've seen dh with small dps (75k), but !@#$load of hp/res (around 500-600AR, 1700vit and lots of %life, so alot of hp) and 2k life regen. It was harder for me to kill him, than a tanky barb. On the other hand you see alot of high dps "I 1shot you" DHs. Same goes for other classes.

Also the fact, that when dueling you need different builds for different opponents, so you end up playing many different builds.

In case of PvM, you can't really make up anything revolutionary. You need minimum ehp to survive, as fast movement speed as you can and as much AoE dmg as you can. And there are few item types that fulfill this requirement the best.

PvP gives you many more things to consider: having less dmg with autoaim skill, or go for huge dps, but harder to hit. Rely on mitigation, or try to avoid hits all together. Also the skill items in Pvp might be much more useful.

Just after few days of PTR you can see the big difference in ppl play style and builds, imagine what will happen after a month or two, when more and more strategies and builds are explored.
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They made legendary's better than rares because everyone was outraged legendary's sucked so much at the release.

Also why are you crying? Depending on your budget you can buy w/e legendary with w/e stats you like. You dont like the looks on the legendary's? Then appeal to Blizzards good side and ask them to put in a transmogrification option much like in WoW instead of writing yet another whiney post based on bs.

Last part of your post is best. "I really have no idear how they can improve this but ye i don´t like it, right?".
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