Diablo® III

So where do all the unid legendaries come from lately?

I am seeing people selling unid legendaries, especially Echoing Furies, like mad nowadays. Also on ebay there are some auctions with like 30 of them at once.
Where do they come from? Is there a new dupe out there? Or is it just the outcome of massive botting?
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Mass botting, If they were duped they would be all the same when ID'd.
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07/05/2013 14:11Posted by Player
Mass botting


Pure speculation.
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Massive botting indeed.
Botters actually give themselfes away by posting it in the trade/general chat, yet Blizz is doing nothing against them (as always).

There are too many different bots out there (I won't name them) just google it and see for yourself.

Gold profiles, Class specific, Item farming, AH snipe, etc. etc.
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People saying mass botting underestimate the amound of active players D3 has
And also the amound of trash other people are willing to buy
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07/05/2013 14:26Posted by Vijs
People saying mass botting underestimate the amound of active players D3 has


I don't underestimate number of active players in D3. If we estimate 5% of players bot with an average 10 bots each thats 10 bots for each 19 players. Players on average might play 2 hours per day while bots on average 16 hours. From these assumptions there will be 4 times more bots than players playing at any 1 time.

From a botters point of view selling unids is much more efficient than id'ing. For people running 50+ bots identifying all theres legs, figuring out the market price for each one is quite a task and on average wont be more profitable. Selling them all in big batches is little effort and will be more likely profitable in the long run.
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07/05/2013 15:04Posted by Player
I don't underestimate number of active players in D3. If we estimate 5% of players bot with an average 10 bots each thats 10 bots for each 19 players. Players on average might play 2 hours per day while bots on average 16 hours. From these assumptions there will be 4 times more bots than players playing at any 1 time.


So where do these numbers come from aside from pure speculation?

With the new 1.07 drop rates, legs drop a lot. At paragon 40, with an additional 90% mf from gear I find 1-2 legs per hour playing casually. I can imagine someone who plays at MF cap and speedfarms a couple hours a day can easily find 100+ legs per week (I wouldn't call that fun, but I'm not judging).

Plus, it's also possible there's people who are flipping unid's, in which case you will see the same item being advertised multiple times.

And if you really want to speculate without any sort of proof, you could also speculate there are hackers that have found a loophole to create unid EFs out of thin air.
Edited by Daeley#2333 on 07/05/2013 15:19 BST
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I am seeing people selling unid legendaries, especially Echoing Furies, like mad nowadays. Also on ebay there are some auctions with like 30 of them at once.
Where do they come from? Is there a new dupe out there? Or is it just the outcome of massive botting?

Simply it's someone who is taking the time spamming trade channels and forums and buying them one by one. Once he collected 30 of them, he sells them for a higher price.

It is really easy to sit around spamming "WTB unid EF", or watching for "WTS unid EF".

07/05/2013 15:04Posted by Player
If we estimate 5% of players bot with an average 10 bots each thats 10 bots for each 19 players.

First, I don't believe the number of bots is even 0.1%. But since I don't have facts and you don't have facts we can both be wrong.
Second, 10 bots are counted as 10 players (because you need 10 accounts to use 10 bots). So 5% of 20 players is 1 bot. The math behind 5% means 10 for each 19 is totally wrong.

Third, most bots don't farm legendaries. They farm gold by running hell at MP 10. Then they use the gold to for AH flipping (buying Legs cheap and selling them for higher prices or in RMAH). Check this out: http://www.diabloprogress.com/rating.stat_lifetime_kills

You will see characters with high amount of kills, never finishing inferno, stacking "Gold and Health Pickup Radius", "Movement speed" and "Gold find" on their gear playing DH with Ferret Companion Rune.

The reason is simple, it's easier to write a bot that farms hell because in hell everything dies in one shot while in inferno there is a bit of decision making needed that's not easy for a bot.
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07/05/2013 16:11Posted by Grendizer
They farm gold by running hell at MP 10


They farm Crypt of the Ancients at Mp1 at Inferno.

A decently geared Wizard can bot it, by casting Blizzard every two steps with a life steal weapon, impossible to die at Mp1 because of the LS, even when frozen because of the DoT LS.

Elites die in a matter of seconds under Blizzard.

Zone is predictable layout.

Zone has really nice density with solid leg drop rate.

Zone drops a considerable amount of gold for 2 minutes of botting.
Edited by marsovac#2732 on 07/05/2013 16:29 BST
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To get 100+ legs a week you'd need to farm 5+ hours every day. A small portion of those legs will be good enough to sell as unids. Maybe in a week you can get a few echoing furys, a witching hour and some others if you're lucky but many people are selling 100+ of every good leg. They sell them at a competitive market price meaning flipping isn't really an option.

Maybe hackers can produce unids out of thin air but that is speculation, botting is not.


Second, 10 bots are counted as 10 players (because you need 10 accounts to use 10 bots). So 5% of 20 players is 1 bot. The math behind 5% means 10 for each 19 is totally wrong.


I estimated 1 player in 20 uses 10 bots this means we have 1 bot player to 19 legit players. This means we have 10 bots to 19 legit players.


Third, most bots don't farm legendaries.


Why would people only bot gold when they can easily get legs at the same time farming mp1 on inferno. I would guess most people who bot now do it for fun not making money (like they did in d2) and its much more fun coming back to their bot and seeing what legs it found than just checking its still working at farming gold in mp10 hell.
Edited by Player#2244 on 07/05/2013 16:52 BST
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07/05/2013 16:35Posted by Player
They sell them at a competitive market price meaning flipping isn't really an option.


This. Never see any shifts in prices, they are pretty solid.
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Simply it's someone who is taking the time spamming trade channels and forums and buying them one by one. Once he collected 30 of them, he sells them for a higher price.

It is really easy to sit around spamming "WTB unid EF", or watching for "WTS unid EF".

I want to elaborate a bit on this, it's actually quite an interesting concept.

Let's consider the cost of selling something. Every sale has a transaction cost, the value of the time we spend making the purchase. In the auction house, the cost of making a transaction is negligible. However, for transactions outside of the AH, such as unidentified items, there is a cost associated with it.

People who flip unidentified items are essentially employing themselves as transaction-cost reducers. By announcing that they're buying unidentified legendaries for X, they stock up on them in bulk. It's easier to sell an unidentified item or two to a guy announcing that he's purchasing them than it is to go out and find a person who buys them. As such, people are more willing to sell to him than they are to start finding customers themselves. In terms of pure costs, this translates into them being willing to sell it to him cheaper because he saves them the trouble of finding someone to buy them. This means that he can buy them for a bit less than their actual value.

When he then goes on to sell them again, he makes another announcement. The same thing then happens: People are offered an easy transaction. If they want to purchase it, they don't have to make an announcement, they don't have to be the ones to initiate contact. This means that he can sell them for a little bit more than their actual value.

As such, if we call the Value X and the transaction costs TC, he's buying items at X-TC and selling them again for X+TC meaning that he's earning 2*TC per item flipped. Now, I'm not saying that the transaction costs are high. He's not going to double his investment with each sold items or anything like that. However, even if the transaction costs are as low as 5.000g (something people can easily farm in the time it would otherwise take to arrange a purchase themselves) he'll still be able to earn half a million gold by reselling fifty items.
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Blizzard- 0 / Bots 100000000
And alot of people will say:Don't use the AH,etc whatnot,why shouldn't i?Because people that don't do nothing flood the economy with thousand and thousand of items every day? No ty,Blizzard should take action.

PS:won't play a game controlled by bots,waste of time,it's the same as trying to outrun a car or even a bike.
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Im pretty sure no matter what game you play out there that is actually good your gunna be playing a game controlled by bots...there's a bot for just about every game out there, so I wouldnt complain much about it or simply stop playing PC based games, Im sure with the release of the console version of the game and the expansion we will all see the number of bots reduce in numbers. I dont think there will be a way to bot on console (I could be wrong) Especially right after release because the bot developers will most likely will need to update the bot program. now if blizz is smart they will inject a newer undetectable version of there bot detection system this wont be an easy task for the bot guys to figure out. I really hope Blizz thinks about this with the new patch and expansion comming up because like you i dont like playing a game with a bunch of bots running around, its not fair to the economy of the game.
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People saying mass botting underestimate the amound of active players D3 has


I don't underestimate number of active players in D3. If we estimate 5% of players bot with an average 10 bots each thats 10 bots for each 19 players. Players on average might play 2 hours per day while bots on average 16 hours. From these assumptions there will be 4 times more bots than players playing at any 1 time.

From a botters point of view selling unids is much more efficient than id'ing. For people running 50+ bots identifying all theres legs, figuring out the market price for each one is quite a task and on average wont be more profitable. Selling them all in big batches is little effort and will be more likely profitable in the long run.


Actually this happens. Botter farm the gear, sell it in mass quantities at a discount to a flipper who knows market values and can move it all fast, rinse and repeat. This is actually what I did after the rmah dupe because you had to run the scrip to flip from gah to rmah after that fateful day. My GAH completed tabs are ridiculous looking with all the sale transactions at 2-100 mil.

I would buy 100-300 pieces a day and hope to get a few in the rmah and move most of them thru gah in hours, not a day, but hours. The goal being to sale them to low end GAH flippers.

I should add the all my main suppliers are no longer logging on and haven't for two weeks now.
Edited by dawgiestyle#1127 on 23/08/2013 21:24 BST
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