StarCraft® II

Hiya,
Watching the replay, lots of minor points that all add up.

You floated too much gas early on with no way to spend it. Either find a way to spend the gas or don't make two assimilators so early. If you take the build you're doing, I would simply drop the second assimilator until a bit later and get an extra gateway earlier. Alternatively, you could throw down an earlier forge for a fast +1 upgrade.

Get upgrades, you waited until the 12 minute mark then built two. When they finished building at the 13 minute mark, you didn't start upgrading until almost the 15 minute mark despite having easily enough resources. I would say drop 1 forge when your second base comes up, and make sure you upgrade when it completes. Start a second forge + council (if not already down) when your second upgrade is halfway through.

If you keep that fluid you will be at 2/2 with 3/3 coming up at the 15 minute mark. The terran had awful upgrades too, and you would have rolled him.

It seemed a lot of buildings went down with no real purpose, ie. they didn't get used as soon as they completed.

You stopped probes for a long while, then when your third completed you rallied all three nexus to the third then continued production. The reason you don't stop probes is so that when a new base comes up, you can just take a lot of probes over immediately.

Attacking wise, when you reached his base. You decided to attack the command center, whilst it would be a very nice kill, you need to weigh if you are actually going to be able to kill it and what kind of damage you will take. Command centers have a lot of health, and you were continually being attacked from the high ground. Poking up the ramp would have been a better choice, unless he was moving the CC away from his base.

You got a pretty early templar archives, but then did nothing with it. I personally prefer going colossus until the third base is up, then adding an archives *unless* you want to go zealot\archon, which you didn't :)

Anyway, hopefully something of interest there.

I honestly thought that this elitest BS would die down eventually.. anyway, st.fu and go practice, your record this season's been terrible so far.

See what I did there? I brought something into the conversation that had nothing to do with the topic, stupid isn't it?

You're platinum, so anyways my record this season is better than yours troll.

Sarcasm is obviously lost on you, never mind ... I should know better than to expect any kind of wit when speaking to someone whose best argument is "lolz your not masters".

I can try to give you some advice, I'm only silver though so not so experienced.
I have given up on collossi first in PvT because I feel it gets shut down hard because investing in collossi in the early game is so expensive that you won't be able to get any upgrades.
What I've been doing now has been working out a lot better.
I open up 3 gate, hold off early pressure and expand. Saturate main, add gates, double forge and twilight council. Start double +1 and charge, then get templar archives for storm and HT/archon. Use all the extra CB's on the upgrades. When it's safe take a third, add a robo bay and for 2-3 collossi. Your army is mainly zealots/archon/collossi/HT and some stalkers here and there (just for the vikings though).
I feel that getting good upgrades early on really helps because upgraded zealots are just TANKS when fighting against lesser upgraded terran units.

Dear Terrans, how do you lose to Protoss?

I let the timer reach 15 mins +.

I just realised even in z v t ive never beaten a terran within 15 min :O

Try the roachbane allin that people were doing prepatch. Not that hard a build to do tbh but you need to make sure they don't scout your gas count or bane nest or they'll really bunker up hard if they know what they are doing. Banes are mostly for dealing with his army and supply depots. Never use them on SCV's unless they're surrounding a hellion or something cause you need to keep his unit count low.
Usually wins or loses the game by 12 minutes.
Or hold off a mega cheese proxy 2 rax while sending two lings to his main. That won me a game in 8 minutes.

Psi Storm is your friend in those cases :P

-Surive till the 20minute mark, on 3 bases.
-Get 3/3 attack and armor
-Get 4 Colossi and 8 HT
-******
-Profit.

-Surive till the 20minute mark, on 3 bases.
-Get 3/3 attack and armor
-Get 4 Colossi and 8 HT
-******
-Profit.

Not to mention allin off 2 base every couple games just because

http://drop.sc/198866
Here's replay, i made HT's. Didnt help at all. Same shyt still. it feels like mm is invincible. It's so frustrating, i am trying as hard as i can, while terran is just chilling, massing mm :(

You need to be careful when you engage enemy, Both your fights, your zealots was stuck in the back and your sentry/stalkers was in the front.

16/06/2012 17:29Posted by Greenknight

1 mistake by Terran and the game is over, Toss make a mistake lose entire army NP just warpin 25 Zealots as a mineral dump.

25 zealots will just get kited and die and the protoss can´t replace his gas units. So the game is over for him as well.

This notion that lategame is harder on terran than protoss is a myth kept alive by people repeating it over and over until noone dares contradict it.

Zealot kiting isn't something that happens in lower leagues.

Zealot kiting requires a lot of APM in lower leagues that players just don't have.

Zealot kiting basically means 0 macro for it's duration, giving the (equally low level) protoss player a huge edge since the zealots only really need to a-move.

Protoss have a huge edge here that can't really be approached bny Terran untill the skill level gets to ridiculous heights, at high master and GM level. There's a good reason why Terran is the least played race after silver - It's not that people give up, it's that to keep up your basic mechanics need to be better than an opponent in the same league, imho.

I dont know if anyone told you this - always try to be +1 armor compared to his weapon.Example - 1 armor - 0 attack upgrades.Use Sentry's Guardian Shield, and with +1 armor you actually have 3 armor which negates most of marine damage.Also use force fields to prevent marines kite your zealots - not a "must do" if you have decent amount of stalkers.Be carefull because of drops at like 10 min mark.My advice is to always go for HTs instead colossus, because of few reasons:

1) Vikings are much easier to build for Terran, since they always have starport when your RF is done;
2)Vikings needs no micro, just A move and they automatically attack colossus;
3)Most of the Terrans dont have Ghost Academy at that time, and ghosts needs some decent micro to deal with HTs, because Terrans must run, and while doing that, while ghosts are still behind, to EMP your army, primarly HTs, and also snipe them.

And dont forget to build some Immortals, since they counter both Marauders and Tanks.

Small pokes at start makes your opponent play more defensively, combined with some warp prism harass in same time, will bring you way ahead.

EDIT: Positioning and choosing where will you fight is very very very important.Against Terran always try to fight on open areas, while against Zerg try to force him fight you on narrow areas.GL.

I dont know if anyone told you this - always try to be +1 armor compared to his weapon.Example - 1 armor - 0 attack upgrades.Use Sentry's Guardian Shield, and with +1 armor you actually have 3 armor which negates most of marine damage.Also use force fields to prevent marines kite your zealots - not a "must do" if you have decent amount of stalkers.Be carefull because of drops at like 10 min mark.My advice is to always go for HTs instead colossus, because of few reasons:

1) Vikings are much easier to build for Terran, since they always have starport when your RF is done;
2)Vikings needs no micro, just A move and they automatically attack colossus;
3)Most of the Terrans dont have Ghost Academy at that time, and ghosts needs some decent micro to deal with HTs, because Terrans must run, and while doing that, while ghosts are still behind, to EMP your army, primarly HTs, and also snipe them.

And dont forget to build some Immortals, since they counter both Marauders and Tanks.

Small pokes at start makes your opponent play more defensively, combined with some warp prism harass in same time, will bring you way ahead.

EDIT: Positioning and choosing where will you fight is very very very important.Against Terran always try to fight on open areas, while against Zerg try to force him fight you on narrow areas.GL.

Agreed that HT are better than colossi, however there are few issues (in lower leagues). First of all, HT require more micro than colossi. A colossus-stalker deathball is pretty much an a-move attack force (without blink, and at lower league level), whereas HT requires you to place storms, keep your army together (because HT are that much slower), etc...

Secondly, if your opponent gets off a good EMP (or lucky), then your HT are rendered pretty much useless, whereas at least a colossus still has some residual value.

I would always suggest HT over Colossi, but at a certain level of play, where players a able to split them up properly, and place some decisif storms. Colossi are, imo, better for the lower leagues because they sort of take care of themselves.

Dear Ryusei, how are you still in silver league?

18/06/2012 14:54Posted by Doppelganger

Dear Ryusei, how are you still in silver league?

How are you still in gold. I'm sure your arguement is the exact same he would use.

18/06/2012 14:54Posted by Doppelganger

Dear Ryusei, how are you still in silver league?

Cuuuuz im not that good, to be in better leagues?

Dear Ryusei, how are you still in silver league?

How are you still in gold. I'm sure your arguement is the exact same he would use.

My point was it's super easy to go on forums and give your opinion on the general metagame when you're still in a league where virtually any strat can succeed
I guess it takes a smart person to figure that out ;(

P.S.: I'm kicking plat asses everyday, I shouldn't stay in gold for very long my friend

set macro goals, like at 10min mark you shall have 90 - 110 supply (with colossus or HT) double upgrades and ready to take a third. If you manage this, you are masters (literaly) at macro, and you will win all your way to high diamond - masters: as P you don't really hit a wall in diamond like T, so macro alone should get you to masters.

(there is a huge difference between a master T and a regular diamond T, but not so much difference between master and diamond P)

1 thing, Get Colossi and High Templars, unless you have less than 50 IQ, and can't storm, an average amount of Zealots will kill the Terran, if you have AOE of any kind for Protoss. Remember to have your high templars close.

Zealot kiting isn't something that happens in lower leagues.Zealot kiting requires a lot of APM in lower leagues that players just don't have.Zealot kiting basically means 0 macro for it's duration, giving the (equally low level) protoss player a huge edge since the zealots only really need to a-move.Protoss have a huge edge here that can't really be approached bny Terran untill the skill level gets to ridiculous heights, at high master and GM level. There's a good reason why Terran is the least played race after silver - It's not that people give up, it's that to keep up your basic mechanics need to be better than an opponent in the same league, imho.

If the zealots are being kited and the protoss does not focus on his army so that he can use his AOE effectively then the chargelots will just die and terran will win the battle costeffectively. If he does spend his APM on the fight then he will not be macroing as much either.

The point is that it is not enough for the toss to just a move because without AOE he cant really beat terran.