World of Warcraft®

Dear Blizzard, please add a big fat gate in front of Rahj in Halls of Origination.

Also to players with 2-3 epics who think they are so good and don't need to CC trash mobs, because "cc is for nubs" as i was told today by a mage.

The one who is effected the most is the healer when you can't even be bothered to interrupt that mob aoeing everyone, and they have a harder time to keep people up.

"Selfish players wanna do all bosses". Goes both ways, i prefer to vote and do what majority of the group wants.

And I bet you wanted to kill the other bosses out of the goodness of your heart and totally not self-interested amirite?

I will always kill the boss if someone needs it.

if only the part of "completing a dungeon" was actually killing all bosses for the daily valor points.

I will always kill the boss if someone needs it.

if only the part of "completing a dungeon" was actually killing all bosses for the daily valor points.

And if the majority doesn't need it?

20/04/2011 18:43Posted by Greytooth

"Selfish players wanna do all bosses". Goes both ways, i prefer to vote and do what majority of the group wants.

Agree with this but OP has a point with his last statement .

But it has nothing to do with skipping bosses

it's not always about if u 'need' it or not... im surprised that some people only see parts of this game as something necessary, not as something fun.....

On my tank i always ask beforehand if they want to kill optional bosses aswell, usually HoO, if they do not, I will run the instance with them for my valors.
If they do so, I will immediately drop the group and let them do it with it a new tank that can be bothered to do it.
If they say they do not, but in reality when we get to the optional bosses, they say they want to do all bosses, basically, lie. I will go AFK by the amount of time it took us to clear to our current point of backstabbing, anywhere from 15 to 30 minutes, I shall stand there and do nothing, if they decide to waste my time, I shall waste their time aswell. If the time runs out I will drop the group. If by some chance I get votekicked out I will instantly requeue to HoO or random dungeon by cheating the system by logging in and out and declining invites till I get the same dungeon and deliberately waste their time as they all wasted mine, tho we had a verbal agreement at the start of the run. If I get votekicked out, do not worry, I have 4 tank classes, all heroic geared, I will do the same.
And thats how life goes in WoW

On my tank i always ask beforehand if they want to kill optional bosses aswell, usually HoO, if they do not, I will run the instance with them for my valors.
If they do so, I will immediately drop the group and let them do it with it a new tank that can be bothered to do it.
If they say they do not, but in reality when we get to the optional bosses, they say they want to do all bosses, basically, lie. I will go AFK by the amount of time it took us to clear to our current point of backstabbing, anywhere from 15 to 30 minutes, I shall stand there and do nothing, if they decide to waste my time, I shall waste their time aswell. If the time runs out I will drop the group. If by some chance I get votekicked out I will instantly requeue to HoO or random dungeon by cheating the system by logging in and out and declining invites till I get the same dungeon and deliberately waste their time as they all wasted mine, tho we had a verbal agreement at the start of the run. If I get votekicked out, do not worry, I have 4 tank classes, all heroic geared, I will do the same.
And thats how life goes in WoW

imo that is one very nasty attitude

On my tank i always ask beforehand if they want to kill optional bosses aswell, usually HoO, if they do not, I will run the instance with them for my valors.
If they do so, I will immediately drop the group and let them do it with it a new tank that can be bothered to do it.
If they say they do not, but in reality when we get to the optional bosses, they say they want to do all bosses, basically, lie. I will go AFK by the amount of time it took us to clear to our current point of backstabbing, anywhere from 15 to 30 minutes, I shall stand there and do nothing, if they decide to waste my time, I shall waste their time aswell. If the time runs out I will drop the group. If by some chance I get votekicked out I will instantly requeue to HoO or random dungeon by cheating the system by logging in and out and declining invites till I get the same dungeon and deliberately waste their time as they all wasted mine, tho we had a verbal agreement at the start of the run. If I get votekicked out, do not worry, I have 4 tank classes, all heroic geared, I will do the same.
And thats how life goes in WoW

Yea by the end bosses they can usually kick you instantly anyways so enjoy your extra hour.

On my tank i always ask beforehand if they want to kill optional bosses aswell, usually HoO, if they do not, I will run the instance with them for my valors.
If they do so, I will immediately drop the group and let them do it with it a new tank that can be bothered to do it.
If they say they do not, but in reality when we get to the optional bosses, they say they want to do all bosses, basically, lie. I will go AFK by the amount of time it took us to clear to our current point of backstabbing, anywhere from 15 to 30 minutes, I shall stand there and do nothing, if they decide to waste my time, I shall waste their time aswell. If the time runs out I will drop the group. If by some chance I get votekicked out I will instantly requeue to HoO or random dungeon by cheating the system by logging in and out and declining invites till I get the same dungeon and deliberately waste their time as they all wasted mine, tho we had a verbal agreement at the start of the run. If I get votekicked out, do not worry, I have 4 tank classes, all heroic geared, I will do the same.
And thats how life goes in WoW

Yea by the end bosses they can usually kick you instantly anyways so enjoy your extra hour.

What hour ? The votekick timer of doing absolutely nothing is like 7 minutes or so, and you might have missed the part about having multiple tanking chars that can cheat dungeon queue to get into the same grp ? Aside from that there are plenty of ways to keep me in combat to prevent the votekick, such as clear some trash, upto a boss, for example HoO, pull boss, reset it, rinse and repeat till the group troll timer runs out ?

If you just started doing heroics, skipping bosses is not the best option. But if you have done the same heroic dungeon around 30 times already ... you just want to get out from there quickly. I mostly do what majority want to do, unless I am tanking ... then I do what I pretty much want.

20/04/2011 18:50Posted by Yurizan

I will always kill the boss if someone needs it.

This.

Taking a vote is NOT a fair system because everyone in the group is now locked out the current instance for 24 hours. This has no effect on those who want to skip, but a massive effect on those who are trying to farm the boss. They cannot just leave and find a more accomodating group, can they? And since leaving right at the start will give them a deserter debuff, that's not fair either.

Five minutes out of your life, just to help a fellow player kill a boss he needs? Sheesh, anyone objecting to that is a loser.

Incidently I have NEVER seen a group skip a boss if one plyer asked to kill it. On all skippable bosses, tanks usually ask if the PUG wants to skip or not....just ONE person saying no should be reason enough to kill it. And always is in my experience.

I will always kill the boss if someone needs it.

if only the part of "completing a dungeon" was actually killing all bosses for the daily valor points.

And if the majority doesn't need it?

If just 1 player needs the boss, then thats good enough reason to kill it. There is a pretty big difference between "needing loot from one boss" and "wanting a 2 min faster run for my precious VP lulz".

A player isnt selfish for wanting to kill one boss in a instance he signed up for. Never.

A player is selfish for wanting to skip a boss that one other player needs loot from. Always.

21/04/2011 13:39Posted by Lugosi

Five minutes out of your life, just to help a fellow player kill a boss he needs? Sheesh, anyone objecting to that is a loser.

This a thousand times.

I think there is also a bit of a difference if a player asks.

"Hello can we please do Boss X, since i need item Y from it" vs "Can we do all bosses pls, need JP".

1st question shows some effort - the person has already researched what he wants. - Usually gets to do the boss.
2nd question just shows greed in terms that the person wants to drag all others along for some random points that he could get by queuing up for another dungeon.

Also to players with 2-3 epics who think they are so good and don't need to CC trash mobs, because "cc is for nubs" as i was told today by a mage.

Mage is kind of right.

The thing about CC is you are doing it for the Healer, no one else. One mob less dealing damage makes the Healer's life easier. However, for tanks (and DPS to a lesser extent), CCing makes their job HARDER. Making sure not to break CC distracts you from doing your proper job. If the CC is near the main target, tanks have to hold back on their AOE threat abilities and so are not tanking as well as they could.

So, really, CC should be avoided unless you absolutely need it, imo. And with recent nerfs to Heroics, plus everyone over-gearing them, CC is rarely needed. Hence, as your Mage "friend" said, it's for noobs.

20/04/2011 18:36Posted by Yurizan

The one who is effected the most is the healer when you can't even be bothered to interrupt that mob aoeing everyone, and they have a harder time to keep people up.

Wind shear is a lovely spell. Yes, it costs mana, but it's off the gcd. It is also a lot less damage on the group, which probably saves you mana and time in the end. Trying to make random people interrupt is just futile.

Tanking can become very easy if 1 or 2 appropriate mobs are CC'd. I disagree with the statement that CC would make tanking harder, provided you know how to use the tools available to you - perhaps it's different with other classes, I only know warrior tanking - to separate the CC'd mobs from the "active" ones. When I run an HC with mediocre DPS and proper CC is applied, mobs go down very fast one after another, healer very rarely has to drink, and a relaxed atmosphere is maintained.

@Castrovalva
No offense, but if I really somehow had to connect the word "noob" in context to either:
A. knowing how to apply proper CC, position and separate mobs so you can go all out, or
B. knowing how to pull the whole pack and press one button to AoE,
I think I 'd know what to choose.

OT:
I run optional bosses when someone asks for it. Sometimes I 'll even ask upfront. Sure, it doesn't benift me, and I might see precious seconds of my life doing other people a favor go to waste, but my hopes are set on living longer than playing WoW. Then again, it's personal and everyone should make that out for him/herself.

Edit: Typo

A player isnt selfish for wanting to kill one boss in a instance he signed up for. Never.

A player is selfish for wanting to skip a boss that one other player needs loot from. Always.

Wanting four players to do something for you that they don't want to is selfish. It doesn't make a you a bad person and I'll happily help do a boss if somebody needs a specific item, but you need it and four other people don't. If you try to make them do it when they don't want to, it's selfish. You only have your interests at heart.

Explain how making four people do something they don't want to for a specific item that you personally need isn't selfish?