Topic
Blizzard need to come clean on the future of 25 mans
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Quote from US Forms (Yes surprisingly they have '25 man's are dead' threads, No unsurprisingly they also get ignored by Blizzard).
As others here have said (including myself) it is very noticeable that Blizzard won't even touch this topic with a 10 foot pole and hasn't done for a very long time. They were very quick at diverting questions even remotely involving the raid sizes at Blizzcon - particularly about future sizes - and we have had so many of these threads for so long it can only be intentional. Pretty much my thoughts. Blizzard steer away from ever commenting on 25vs10s balance. Their last statement was 20 months ago. It does sound that this is political. e.g. It will upset people so they're going for the safety shot and keeping their mouth shut. Personally I think this is fairly disgusting behavior to keep stringing people along till MoP. It's also the sort of crappy attitude that has soured a lot of people's previous good opinions of Blizzard this x-pac. So Blizzard. Rather than stringing us along until some press conference in March. Why not drop it on us now? Start showing the old Blizz we all used to love. As opposed the 'Slick Marketing Machine (tm)' that you've now become... |
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Well the problem is no matter what they say or do on the topic, people are gonna say they lie, they failed to do it, or they are biased in some way. Honestly, that is more hassle and rage than it's worth.
Besides (though I might be wrong on this one) I do believe they stated they want to continue the current politic of semi-balanced 10 and 25 man being semi-equal. |
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as long as they don't do anything stupid like make the raid locks like icc then i will be happy. Yeah, yeah yeah... Spoken by someone very happy with the death of 25 man raiding. They did something stupid by dumping the raid model in Wotlk, to the absolute disaster we've got at the moment. Or do you think Cataclysm is anything but a big failure? |
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Isn't it unanimously agreed by the community that 25man having access to the prestigeous titles would be the best course of action ?
IMO, post these on tech / community support forums. Won't get a reply here. GRATS ON 60 |
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Wow there dudes.
The basis of this thread is not to discuss the old 25vs10 stuff. We've got a ton of them, and it's to discuss the fact that Blizz don't dare comment. Are afraid to comment. A bit cowardly, I think so... 25 man raiding has pretty much gone down the crapper. So it would be nice to hear Blizz's current thoughts. Rather than wait for some press conference in mid-march.
62, keep up man. |
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very much this!!. If i do not like to raid 25 mans and Blizzard once again go back to the seperate 10 / 25 lock outs with 25 having better loot / titles etc. Do i come here and cry Blizzard are killing of 10 man raiding? IT is a choice that people took to go to 10 man, grated some people were forced into it due to their guild chaging to 10 man for whatever reason but they were never forced to stay in that guild. Any issues of 25 man guilds dying off on any server are probably more related to server population more than blizzard "killing off 25 mans" I like 10 man raids a lot more than 25 mans, if they change it back i will come here and cry and shout and QQ all day about how they are killing 10 mans.....what answers do you think i will get? As for difficulty, I belive that 10 mans are harder since the 10 / 25 man merge due to raid comp and the inability to carry anyone while progressing ( not that you can carry someone in 25 mans but there is a larger margin for error) but those are issues for blizzard too look at and should have been done a lot sooner. TL:DR - I like 10 mans over 25 mans, it is a choice that people made when given the option |
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Edited by Azriyel on 22/02/12 23:00 (UTC)
I have spoken about future 25 man raids since wotlk end when shared lockouts were introduced (and not even implemented yet), and by now I've run out of steam. I feel like saying : told you so. No point winding myself up again over this.
And I think Blizzard has exactly decided what to do with it, but to delay unsubs they just wait with announcement.
And its perfectly fine for you to have people, who like to 25 man to be forced to do 10 mans for the easier and faster progression. What hypocrite are you? You gear, mount and gain vanity items faster in 10 man. But keep being celf centered since its fine for you. |
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Edited by Cargalst on 22/02/12 23:08 (UTC)
I have spoken about future 25 man raids since wotlk end when shared lockouts were introduced (and not even implemented yet), and by now I've run out of steam. I feel like saying : told you so. No point winding myself up again over this. Honestly, I do believe you are overreacting a little bit. While definately not what it used to be, 25 man raiding is far from dying. I would say it would be ok to get separate achievments and/or titles to reward the extra logistic hassle, but in the end you will always have 10 and 25 man guilds. And in the end, no matter what, there will always be more of 10 man ones (unless Blizzard brings back the idea of 10 man being inferior from the get-go). Besides 10 man progression is not entirely "easier and faster". Sure, there are a few fights harder on either setup, but in the end DS has been one of the most balanced raids to come out on both difficulties. Definately regarding the two most important fights, though other ones count too obviously. |
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OP go on youtube and watch the newest weekly marmot from tankspot he explains pretty clearly why it is not completely true that 25m in dying, even better heres a link for it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8d3moE1ux8w&feature=g-all-u&context=G20e543fFAAAAAAAAAAA |
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Edited by Lorac on 22/02/12 23:16 (UTC)
We re forced to raid 10s m8, it has to work both ways you know. At least according to the company's initial statement, they did it so people (and i think that those that like 25 and they re not paragon caliber players are also people) can raid at the size they prefer. Look around you, 90%+ of 25 people teams downsized or disbanded, and people are stating in all tones that are forced to raid 10s. Are you blind or smt? You shouldnt be forced but its oki for others to be eh?
M8, a large % of the 10 manners would go back to 25, but they don't want to play a game and feel like the vilage fools. Trying more for less. At last would you quit with that biased argument about choice? Something that they should clearly think about doing is to implement one size raids and focus on designing quality content. But if they do that people would stop fighting fake wars maybe and start noticing if the game is good enough maybe with dragon soul type raids. Hope MoP will bring smt better in quality, but also do smt about this horrible raid model that they came up with for Cataclysm. |
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OP go on youtube and watch the newest weekly marmot from tankspot he explains pretty clearly why it is not completely true that 25m in dying, even better heres a link for it: Oh Keep up with it dearie. Can't any of you 10 man fanboi's read. I've already commented on it in another thread. (http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/3371667243?page=8) Lore has the benefit of being a 'net celeb. I doubt he has to spam SW every 15 minutes everyday trying to keep recruitment up. And if you read the comments, he's pretty much being flamed for being out-of-touch. The guy absolutely has not clue at all. I think Lore has a long term aim of being a Blizzard CM one day. And his fence-sitting certainly indicates this. |
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Edited by Cargalst on 22/02/12 23:23 (UTC)
Honestly Lorac, your statistic "quotes" are a bit funny to say the least. Noone can ever say how many 25 mans guild downgraded, how many of those did so willingfully or from the lack of people, how many people from 10 mans would prefer 25 mans (or vice versa), how many people are "forced" to go 10 mans... Honestly, some obviously are a part of one of such groups, but do mind there are also people content with how things look currently.
And implementing one raid size... Depends how much that would be I guess, but I would say what we have now is ok-ish. Forcing 25 man guilds to kick some people or 10 man guilds to spam recruit (no matter who they take) isn't a good solution either. EDIT: And Boodara, honestly... If your guild EVER had to spam trade, that is an entire story in itself. If you are at least semi-good guild on your server, people know that. And if you are recruiting, chances are among the usual bunch you will grab a great player or two every now and then. While being world x'th guild definately helps, recruiting is pretty much same for everyone. |
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Edited by Reeno on 22/02/12 23:27 (UTC)
OP go on youtube and watch the newest weekly marmot from tankspot he explains pretty clearly why it is not completely true that 25m in dying, even better heres a link for it: That entire video is based on the assumption that the difficulty & effort:reward ratio's are the same across both formats, the former of which is disproven by kill count on various tracking sites, personal comparisons of running both and word of mouth and the latter which is mathematical fact of less loot PP on 25 (Tokens, ragnaros hc mount ect). Just another fence warmer. [Edit] - Quoting Marmot "Alot of people would rather do 10 than 25 man", My responce is would that still be the case if prior ratio & difficulty were balanced to the point where there wasnt a "path of least resistance", since alot of people simply seek this and nothing more. |
OP go on youtube and watch the newest weekly marmot from tankspot he explains pretty clearly why it is not completely true that 25m in dying, even better heres a link for it: And at least 90% of that is made up by people or a completely wrong understanding of statistic. Which I can make too btw! The 10 and 25 man efforts are pretty close in DS, although they had a few hiccups in previous tiers. |
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Edited by Aaniel on 22/02/12 23:40 (UTC)
Yes because youtube comments are made by the most sensible and unbiased people in existance /sarcasm |
