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My thoughts would be;
You can't kick someone in that "zone" up until the boss pull. Sure, you may wipe due to poor tanking, low dps, poor healing but you'll be able to see who was responsible and remove them. This means you're not insta-kicked during trash, have an opportunity to do the boss and can be removed if you're not cutting it. After hitting AFK timer you're given 30 seconds grace time - after which you're removed from the group/raid as you're clearly AFK. If you don't contribute to the encounter you're not entitled to roll on the loot. If you didn't do damage to the boss, didn't tank anything, didn't heal then you forfeit your loot. This prevents instakicks but also doesn't protect the culprits. I'm sure it's not foolproof but either some or all of it could be incorporated. |
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Edited by Marbury on 20/06/12 15:22 (BST)
Intentional griefing in LFR should be a bannable offense. Yes, a ban.
Just now, I joined a run at Spine. A Priest, Yumadbra from Shattered Halls, DPSed all corruptions until 20k HP, saving them all until the last tendon where he killed them all. Trying to get everyone to do a barrell roll on LFR is nearly impossible though. Blizzard should allow us in-combat kicks and they should investigate these matters and deal with it in a harsh matter. You can't have this type of behavior running rampant, YOU as developers need to do something about it. Checks and balances. http://i47.tinypic.com/2lc7jvt.jpg http://i47.tinypic.com/sxmww7.jpg http://i47.tinypic.com/2n0sf3q.jpg http://i47.tinypic.com/4ibyuf.jpg http://i46.tinypic.com/zu095u.jpg I've had it with certain people intentionally ruining the enjoyment of others and Blizzard claiming they are not responsible. Everything in the game is owned by Blizzard, hence they should enforce social rules. All these elaborate kick rules are unnecessary. Ban the offenders. It's that easy. If you're being antisocial, out there to ruin others their afternoon as your only goal, then you should not be playing an MMO. Ban them for days, weeks, lifetime: I don't care. Ban them. |
So you're supporting the idea that anyone who wants to kick you because you may roll on their loot should have the right to do so, with you being in the wrong. It is impossible to determine with any algorithm whether a malevolent action is intentional or due to lack of knowledge. To enforce what you're suggesting would require Blizzard to have the majority of LFR runs monitored by GMs, which would mean a heavy increase in costs, which is a no-no. |
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I've had many dungeons the past few weeks on an alt where the healer refused to heal me the tank for no apparent reason or i wouldn't go straight to the end of the dungeon instead of doing the additional bosses and we were unable to kick as either they were pulling the mobs so we couldn't kick or they were protected by the 4 hrs of unkickable and i think its just wrong.
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LFR is (mostly) full of retards. Which comes as no surprise when they make it so easy that a blind-folded monkey can probably complete it. So you will unavoidably get a huge amount of complete !@#$%^-s trying to be funny.
And i do apologize to any monkeys reading this. |
Someone has done their media training. Successfully dodge the actual points in the OP, whilst presenting a totally reasonable yet irrelevant viewpoint. Chapéu |
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What does GMs do about people who join as 2 and make sure that they wipe the group continously. One only need to be the tank for that to work.
This prevents the kick from being possible as the other one can just decline it all the time. Encountered this so many times lately, there must be something to be done about it. I wait 7 days for a ticket which i cannot respond to when i am not here. But i was informed that it would be looked into, the chat itself was a clear proof of how they acted. Quite frankly starting to piss me off that i eventually have to leave and get a dungeon debuff 30 minutes because of someone being a douche and my server doesn't have a fast ticket response. |
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Also didn't see Terraforms post.. so yeah. Guess this is more of a question, to what does the Gms do about such situations?
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The delay is partially in place to protect players from being kicked for frivolous reasons. Make a somewhat more smarter system, to be honest~ There is more afk/rude/grief kind of people than groups abusing it to get rid of whoever they want, but really though: You can do better than that. |
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Edited by Norsilian on 02/11/12 09:49 (GMT)
I was in a instance yesterday with 2 other guild members which happen to be good friends of mine on skype chatting we had a tank healer and dps having a good time we come to a instance with 2 warlocks the one goes afk at the start and stays that way from the start of nexus all the way to ORMOROK that is the giant rock boss so a lnog time to be AFK really thats the third boss in. I cant kick him then when it allow me to do so i click yes my two friend click yes the one warlock says no and the vote fails he then told us "Slacking is Fun" and continued to do nothing for the entire instance you can see why this is very annoying on our parts and yes i agree with the other statmants if there is a "trouble maker" he can just keep attacking mobs and not clicking on loot so he cant be kicked very very very annoying to say the least
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Edited by Sharein on 02/11/12 10:29 (GMT)
The delay is partially in place to protect players from being kicked for frivolous reasons. Thing is, players are hardly ever kicked for "frivolous" reasons. Your word against mine, but from my own experience, what you say is a very rare exception. Most players are pretty lenient when it comes to gear and underperforming, as long as there is an apperent reason for it and most players do not want to wait on a replacement. If ever, the current implementation of the votekick system protects people who aim to abuse the system. For instance, when you have a disconnected player early on, you cannot get rid of a misbehaving player after a votekicking the dc'ed player and you pretty much give griefers and ninjalooters a free ticket to continue their abuse at the expensive of the rest of the party. The current votekick system protects slackers, griefers and abusers. |
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The delay is partially in place to protect players from being kicked for frivolous reasons. You can decrease the "delay" to 10 minutes, it wouldn't hurt anyone but the griefers. |
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Except when its the griefers who initiate the kick. Either way, the system can and will be abused. If you don't have the delay in place, you'll get the system abused to remove players for no good reason. If you do have the system in place, the players who get removed for frivolous reasons will eventually get to play and enjoy the game but the same system which prevents them from being shut out also means another class of people can abuse the system. EJL |
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Experiences vary. I see it happen quite often. Most players are pretty lenient when it comes to gear and underperforming, as long as there is an apperent reason for it and most players do not want to wait on a replacement. Today. Players get less tolerant...not more.... towards the end of the Xpac. They have an expectation that everyone will have been in the game and as experienced and well equipped as they are. The current votekick system protects slackers, griefers and abusers. And also protects those who may be kicked because the rest of the group wants a quick easy run. Or the warrior wants to kick the second plate wearer so he can get the drops. Or the "ninja" who needed on an item noone else wanted. Or the No1 DPSser who got kicked after a wipe when the No20 DPSser complained he was doing no damage and initiated a kick. Or the party member who got kicked because he questioned the looting policy used by the gang of guildies. Or the warrior who gets kicked for not healing (seriously - I have seen that happen). And so on. EJL |
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It is hard to change the Votekick system in a fair way.
I would only use Votekick against: - long DC. That is: player has connection problems and DCs. After waiting a few minutes the party checks whether the player managed to reconnect and resume playing with us. If not, a Votekick follows. If there is a tough boss (mostly in Heroic instances), we wait a few minutes; - offensive behaviour. You would also Votekick tanks and healers, but that can be disadvantageous: it will slow down the run due to having to wait for a new tank or healer. Tolerating arrogant tanks and healers will speed up the run. Unfortunately some tanks know that and can happily continue their behaviour; - in a few cases poor tanking; - in a few cases poor healing; - poor DPSing only in case of raids and a few bosses that have a party's total DPS depending AI; - ignoring tactics that was giving by one of the other players. For me the most serious reason which would justify a Votekick is insulting, offensive language to one of the other party members. That is more seriously than making mistakes in a dungeon. |
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The delay is partially in place to protect players from being kicked for frivolous reasons. I rarely see a kick and when I do it is a legitimate jerk -.- They also happen to have the kick immune timer but likely the 2 I ran into had 15 minute timers. They were kicked the second it was up. I hear so meany stories about Bots abusing it. I really think it does more good then harm to remove the immunity. The only immunity I see that should be in place is possible kicking before end boss. |
The delay is partially in place to protect players from being kicked for frivolous reasons. Its time to think why people react like that? Maybe because LFG and LFR gave them the chance? Maybe because people dont care about anything because they are strangers among strangers in dungeons? You helped those people grow with LFR and LFG and now you say what? |
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+1 to this thread. Tired of all the protection on troll and griefers.
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