Forcing us to LFR to have succes in normal mode.

MVP
90 Human Death Knight
10665
02/11/2012 13:55Posted by Monkylord
I have limited time in the evening after work and i would rather focus it on my guild than on some mouth breathers who lack the mental capacity to move out of huge purple puddles and gaping holes.

If you state that Blizzard is "forcing" you to do Raid Finder, that suggests you're unable to do normal mode raiding without LFR loot. Which provides amusing context for your above statement.
90 Blood Elf Paladin
12735
02/11/2012 13:51Posted by Draztal
If you're going to quote Zarhym's reply, quote the full paragraph, please:


Why when quoting out of context makes him get a point across. >.<

I am just glad Blizzard employees hare more sympathetic and have a broader understanding of their players.
MVP - WoW, StarCraft II
90 Worgen Druid
9180
Why when quoting out of context makes him get a point across. >.<


Ah, some things never change about the Internet, eh? :P

02/11/2012 13:49Posted by Mikra
A tip is to use four healers for that fight, that is what we did.


Is that 10-man, or 25-man? Our guild used 6 healers for the 25-man version.
Edited by Danellos on 02/11/2012 14:00 GMT
100 Troll Hunter
16930
02/11/2012 13:54Posted by Zeruge
People who say LFR is mandatory in order to progress in normals are wrong. I haven't won anything from LFR and my gear level is now 487. I'm currently ranked #1 Elemental Shaman for Garalon on World of Logs, so I must be doing something right, right?


But you still ran it for a chance to upgrade some slot and valor, correct? I won 2 lfr items last week and i replaced them in a matter of days, but i still ran it 3 times. The thing is a lot of us dont want to run it AT ALL.

02/11/2012 13:58Posted by Doomsinger
If you state that Blizzard is "forcing" you to do Raid Finder, that suggests you're unable to do normal mode raiding without LFR loot. Which provides amusing context for your above statement


No. It doesn't provide amusing context. I ran normal before i ran LFR. I still ran LFR simply because i wanted to replace some of my blue items with epic ones. The time i wasted on LFR i could have spent recruiting people or something more useful.
Edited by Monkylord on 02/11/2012 14:05 GMT
MVP
90 Human Death Knight
10665
02/11/2012 13:38Posted by Monkylord
Blizzard will keep forcing Real raiders with the scrubs... i mean "casuals"

02/11/2012 13:59Posted by Monkylord
I still ran LFR simply because i wanted to replace some of my blue items with epic ones.

I struggle to reconcile the apparent contradiction here. Is the colour of a few pixels really that important?
90 Pandaren Shaman
9485
People who say LFR is mandatory in order to progress in normals are wrong. I haven't won anything from LFR and my gear level is now 487. I'm currently ranked #1 Elemental Shaman for Garalon on World of Logs, so I must be doing something right, right?


But you still ran it for a chance to upgrade some slot and valor, correct?

I ran it for some gear upgrades yes; the valor, no.

But the fact that I didn't get any upgrades means it can't be mandatory.
Edited by Zeruge on 02/11/2012 14:12 GMT
90 Blood Elf Paladin
12735
02/11/2012 13:59Posted by Monkylord
No. It doesn't provide amusing context. I ran normal before i ran LFR. I still ran LFR simply because i wanted to replace some of my blue items with epic ones. The time i wasted on LFR i could have spent recruiting people or something more useful.


Then why don't you?
02/11/2012 13:59Posted by Monkylord
But you still ran it for a chance to upgrade some slot and valor, correct? I won 2 lfr items last week and i replaced them in a matter of days, but i still ran it 3 times. The thing is a lot of us dont want to run it AT ALL.


Then don't. It's obvious that you are well beyond the skill level of any player posting here and that you'd rather not play with "mouthbreathers", as you so elegantly and politely put it in your previous post. So, by all means, open Vent, repeatedly tell your guildmates how awesome and uber skilled you are and run with them Normal and Heroic raids, but the attitude you display towards players running the Raid Finder is completely unacceptable and needs to go.

There's a code of conduct when posting on these forums, so please, stick to it.
90 Blood Elf Paladin
12735
But you still ran it for a chance to upgrade some slot and valor, correct? I won 2 lfr items last week and i replaced them in a matter of days, but i still ran it 3 times. The thing is a lot of us dont want to run it AT ALL.


Then don't. It's obvious that you are well beyond the skill level of any player posting here and that you'd rather not play with "mouthbreathers", as you so elegantly and politely put it in your previous post. So, by all means, open Vent, repeatedly tell your guildmates how awesome and uber skilled you are and run with them Normal and Heroic raids, but the attitude you display towards players running the Raid Finder is completely unacceptable and needs to go.

There's a code of conduct when posting on these forums, so please, stick to it.


O_o

**** just got real!

Makes me wonder if he will quote that anytime soon!
Edited by Azura on 02/11/2012 14:22 GMT
100 Troll Hunter
16930
02/11/2012 14:19Posted by Draztal
But you still ran it for a chance to upgrade some slot and valor, correct? I won 2 lfr items last week and i replaced them in a matter of days, but i still ran it 3 times. The thing is a lot of us dont want to run it AT ALL.


Then don't. It's obvious that you are well beyond the skill level of any player posting here and that you'd rather not play with "mouthbreathers", as you so elegantly and politely put it in your previous post. So, by all means, open Vent, repeatedly tell your guildmates how awesome and uber skilled you are and run with them Normal and Heroic raids, but the attitude you display towards players running the Raid Finder is completely unacceptable and needs to go.

There's a code of conduct when posting on these forums, so please, stick to it.


Spoken like a true CM. Naming and Shaming garnished with thread derailing.
5 Dwarf Hunter
0
Blizzard is hiding from the fact that there are blockages in current Normal raiding progress. Every boss is tuned for maximum buffs and if you are missing one you will require extra item lvl to make up for it. And that is hard when you only have like 4 raid bosses to work with like is with Elegon. It is an overtuned fight atm for its gear lvl if you dont have all the buffs. The best way to beat that fight is to go LFR and get the 476 weapons on boss AFTER Elegon. The chance of getting 476 weapons in HCs is way to low and you can go for months and months and never get them.

I dare any person to go to World of logs and compare the bosses in Vaults. The success raid for Elegon is under 5% for 10 mans while beeing well over 10-15% for all other bosses - even the last one. That should be very obvious that its overtuned - and the best way to beat him is to get items from 6 bosses in LFR rather than wait once every week for the 4 bosses in normal.

And the main reason why 10 mans are strugling on that fight ? Because most casual guilds do not have the luxury of running a perfect setup of all buffs - including a buff that ONLY 3 specs in the ENTIRE game give.
Edited by Primus on 02/11/2012 14:38 GMT
100 Human Paladin
17895
i had ilvl 461 when i killed the Stoneguards the first time and so did the rest of the group. I don't quite get the arguement "clearly we need better gear because we can't down this boss" when its just the skill of the group and NOT the gear. Sorry, lads.
Edited by Vjnzen on 02/11/2012 17:08 GMT
MVP
90 Human Death Knight
10665
02/11/2012 14:32Posted by Monkylord
Spoken like a true CM. Naming and Shaming garnished with thread derailing.

There's a difference between "naming and shaming", and discussing previous posts in the same thread. This is a discussion forum, people are allowed to quote and refer to earlier posts. 0 / 10, try again.
5 Dwarf Hunter
0
02/11/2012 14:34Posted by Vjnzen
i had ilvl 361 when i killed the Stoneguards the first time and so did the rest of the group. I don't quite get the arguement "clearly we need better gear because we can't down this boss" when its just the skill of the group and NOT the gear. Sorry, lads.


No - you did not have 361 itemlvl. Thats a lie - 461 would be more like it.
MVP
90 Human Death Knight
10665
02/11/2012 14:36Posted by Primus
Thats a lie

The word is 'typo'. Be less melodramatic.
90 Blood Elf Mage
0
02/11/2012 14:34Posted by Vjnzen
i had ilvl 361 when i killed the Stoneguards the first time and so did the rest of the group. I don't quite get the arguement "clearly we need better gear because we can't down this boss" when its just the skill of the group and NOT the gear. Sorry, lads.


Do you mean 461? Otherwise kudos to you!
MVP - WoW, StarCraft II
90 Worgen Druid
9180
02/11/2012 14:36Posted by Primus
i had ilvl 361 when i killed the Stoneguards the first time and so did the rest of the group. I don't quite get the arguement "clearly we need better gear because we can't down this boss" when its just the skill of the group and NOT the gear. Sorry, lads.


No - you did not have 361 itemlvl. Thats a lie - 461 would be more like it.


I am pretty sure that was a typo. Last I checked, the "3" is right next to the "4" on most keyboards.
100 Tauren Warrior
14760
Let's be honest here: normal mode raids ain't doable in ilvl 460 gear and without a voicechat program and DBM addon for the average Joe raider !
Even the top guilds run Galleon and Sha and crafted gear and bought items from RMAH the first weeks.
If a Blizzard employee comes here telling us LFR gear is not needed for the average raider to clear Normal modes, he is lying !

Normal modes will be nerfed, calling it here !
90 Worgen Druid
5045
And the main reason why 10 mans are strugling on that fight ? Because most casual guilds do not have the luxury of running a perfect setup of all buffs - including a buff that ONLY 3 specs in the ENTIRE game give.


Which buffs are that? A hunter can actually give lots of buff that people don't think of.
Blizzard is hiding from the fact that there are blockages in current Normal raiding progress. Every boss is tuned for maximum buffs and if you are missing one you will require extra item lvl to make up for it. And that is hard when you only have like 4 raid bosses to work with like is with Elegon. It is an overtuned fight atm for its gear lvl if you dont have all the buffs and the best way to beat that fight is to go LFR and get the 476 weapons on boss AFTER Elegon. The chance of getting 476 weapons in HCs is way to low and you can go for months and months and never get them.

I dare any person to go to World of logs and compare the bosses in Vaults. The success raid for Elegon is under 5% for 10 mans while beeing well over 10-15% for all other bosses - even the last one. That should be very obvious that its overtuned - and the best way to beat him is to get items from 6 bosses in LFR rather than wait once every week for the 4 bosses in normal.


Elegon is a very complex fight. There're many things to be aware of, experiment with and so on. But once you master them all, he goes down relatively quickly. It just takes time to adapt to all the mechanics that encounter has. Don't give up!

Having said that, the current buff system should allow most 10 player groups to get all the buffs (at least the important ones) as long as the composition isn't terribly strange. If that's not the case, I'd say please point it out and we'll let the developers know about. It might be that it is indeed an oversight or that in fact they don't expect raid groups to necessarily have that particular buff.
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