Let's get rid of the 10 minute stat debuff on ress

90 Human Priest
9075

Lol wow punishment for death is fine. I remember in Final Fantasy Online where you lose experience upon death, you can even level DOWN.


This! It always makes me laugh when people are like omg I can't wait to get a mount, or general complaining about travel. Yeah try running from Jeuno to San'doria mother!@#$er!

But yeah instead of making the death penalty more betterer, it'd be nice to be able to fly to our corpse in Pandaria already. The amount of times I've been unable to get to my corpse because I've accidentally dismounted throughout my wow career is ridiculous. In fact that's the only time I ever res sickness. Inconveniant when I have something planned like a raid or a dungeon. Just for a limitation which is only applied to a different island which doesn't follow lore continuity (afaik) is a pain.

tl;dr stop whining and moar fly death stuffs
Edited by Shinikage on 27/11/2012 15:58 GMT
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26/11/2012 17:04Posted by Daishan
By "very weird place" you mean large chunks of Panda land especially anywhere near the cloud serpent dailies.


That is something completely different, any time a player is forced to resurrect at the spirit healer while doing quests or anything usual, we will take a look and adjust graveyards or the resurrection functionality if we verify that it happens when players aren’t purposely going out of their way to get into weird inaccessible paths.

So if there’s a specific place, like around the Cloud Serpent dailies area where you might be forced to resurrect at a spirit healer, that can be considered a bug and devs usually fix those by either moving the graveyards, creating new ones or flag them to auto-res players who release in those places, we prefer to do that as we’re still hesitant about adding ghost flying to Pandaria.
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90 Human Warrior
14365
Least we get the stats back after 10 minutes :D
Old game i used to play, DAoC, your stats were reduced and you had to pay a healer to recover them, got pricey after a while.
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90 Tauren Druid
13335
27/11/2012 16:14Posted by Taepsilum
By "very weird place" you mean large chunks of Panda land especially anywhere near the cloud serpent dailies.


That is something completely different, any time a player is forced to resurrect at the spirit healer while doing quests or anything usual, we will take a look and adjust graveyards or the resurrection functionality if we verify that it happens when players aren’t purposely going out of their way to get into weird inaccessible paths.

So if there’s a specific place, like around the Cloud Serpent dailies area where you might be forced to resurrect at a spirit healer, that can be considered a bug and devs usually fix those by either moving the graveyards, creating new ones or flag them to auto-res players who release in those places, we prefer to do that as we’re still hesitant about adding ghost flying to Pandaria.


Well, that would certainly be very helpful, as it would probably put an end to the whole "need a flying mount while corpse running" thingy. There really are a couple of places around Pandaria where this happens a lot (it quickly comes to mind the area where Major Nanners and a daily quest mob are, which can be quite annoying, especially in a PvP realm). Would it help to compile the places where it often happens and report them in-game, or here?

Still, the whole death system feels outdated, and it could certainly benefit from some more iteration and tweaking.
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90 Tauren Druid
16705
26/11/2012 14:39Posted by Kinoo
and if you log off the buff will still be there on login.


Log out in an inn or major city and the debuff will expire as usual.
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90 Night Elf Druid
11705
As some people have mentioned the idea of losing some of pur shiny loot on death could be a viable option. Similar to Asheron's Call I used to play way way back in the day. Could go something like this.

You get killed and when you hit release you are brought back to life at a graveyard but you have droppped an item or two that you were wearing. You then need to loot your corpse to reclaim your items.

If you are unable to or do not wish to get your corpse, your items will be mailed to you after say 30 mins or something. Or if you are in a hurry you can pay the spirit healer a fee to have the items mailed straight away.

I think this would keep a decent penalty for getting killed and could even add to WPvP as people call on guildies and friends to help them get to their corpse thats being camped by a bunch of Horde scum.
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85 Human Paladin
7965
No, I second the motion of removing death penalties or any other artificial form of time wasting.

Mind you I'm the kind of person who enjoys dungeons/raid with no trash mobs and thinks that rep tabards should return to the game whilst the valor cap should be removed completely, so please feel free to disregard my opinion.

Alternatively, could we have servers for people in full time employment where all the grindy bits are removed from the game? You would have to prove employment through tax codes or contracts and all timed achievements (i.e. world firsts) would not count.

Again, feel free to disregard my opinion.
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86 Draenei Hunter
2155
I think the penalty can be too harsh at times. While you're questing, you can res and go make a coffee or something while you wait for the debuff to drop. However, on a PVP server, a far higher level camping your corpse means you are forced to res at the graveyard or be one-shot again and face the run back again. When you do res at the graveyard, you stand no chance against someone of your own level. This is one of the many reasons I don't play on a PVP server.

While it's fine to say there should be a penalty to make players more cautious about dying, if you are ganked in a single shot by a high level, it's not like you can actually stand a chance of staying alive by fighting back for that half second.

On a PVE server, I really don't see the point. You res, waste 10 minutes and carry on. It's not like it's really a big deal, more like an unnecessary inconvenience. Sometimes, you've died through no fault of your own, you are fighting a mob, another joins so you get caught up in a 2v1 and sometimes can't move because you're being stunned constantly and a boss comes close enough to one shot you. That happens in the Plaguelands a lot, I got killed twice on my Warlock, once by the boss trying to do "Amidst Death, Life" because I got jumped by two or three mobs that had me tied down in battle. Run back res and get killed again because my health is too low and I couldn't get far enough from the mobs and stay within range of my corpse to res, summon my Voidwalker to tank for me and get my health up again as well before they attacked. Res at the graveyard, went and made a coffee while the res sickness wore off and then tried again. Didn't really want the coffee, so it went cold, I just wanted to do something to waste the time. Like I said, an unnecessarily annoying waste of time more than a punishment for dying.

If you must create something that punishes you, make it cost in gold to res at the graveyard. It saves the time wasting and creates a gold sink too. However, remove any penalty on a PVP server because costing in gold would create more corpse campers.
Edited by Tiarama on 27/11/2012 18:02 GMT
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90 Worgen Hunter
7805
That is something completely different, any time a player is forced to resurrect at the spirit healer while doing quests or anything usual, we will take a look and adjust graveyards or the resurrection functionality if we verify that it happens when players aren’t purposely going out of their way to get into weird inaccessible paths.

So if there’s a specific place, like around the Cloud Serpent dailies area where you might be forced to resurrect at a spirit healer, that can be considered a bug and devs usually fix those by either moving the graveyards, creating new ones or flag them to auto-res players who release in those places, we prefer to do that as we’re still hesitant about adding ghost flying to Pandaria.


I don't get what the hesistation is to not allow ghost flying in so many areas, including pandaria. Not having it tends to mess things up.

There was this one quest I was doing for one of the Tillers NPCS (it wasn't a daily, it was one of the friends quests) where I had to fly up onto the cliffs to the north and deal with some of those hoppy virmen-type things. One of them has a knockback I was unaware of at the time, and it knocked me off, and I fell and died on some sort of rock outcrop. When I did the corpserun, my ghost was on the ground, and I was THIS close to being unable to rez at the corpse: || . If I'd had a slightly different landing spot I wouldn't have been able to get close enough. It took a while to find a place that could just barely reach it for the rez.

Another time, check this out it wasn't even Pandaria - I was in Mount Hyjal on one of my DKs (max level was 85 at the time, he might have been like 79 or something). I had some kind of death near the edge of Mount Hyjal. My ghost appeared at a spirit healer in a different zone - I can't remember if it was Ashenvale or Felwood. And there was no spirit flying there - what a mess that was.

Another time I died at the edge of Wintergrasp and my ghost appeared in Sholozar Basin. It didn't let me fly, I couldn't get the corpse (this was when I was using my USA wow character, not one of my EU ones, for the sake of accuracy).

This other time while I was leveling around the beginning of Cataclysm, pretty sure this was in Ashenvale, there were some mountains or something in between the graveyard location and my corpse and I couldn't find a way to get to the corpse. It's like I ran and ran and it was as though, nowhere I could go would lead to there. It was a little crazy.

It's rare that I take a rez off of a spirit healer but those times that it happened, it was almost always because of something like this - being unable to get to my corpse + ghost flying would have fixed it.

I noticed that the Resurrection Sickness debuff doesn't de-increment its timer when you log out. Best of my memory, I logged with it in Stormwind once and then when I came back on later, I still had it. I can see where that has a value in world pvp because you could have like, people just logging out and keep rapidly re-logging various alts within a 10 minute cycle. But i'm not on a pvp server and don't do world pvp. So to me it's eyesroll when I get this thing, I just have to tab out a while or do whatever for 10 mins. And it's not like I did something taht seems that it deserves some time-out penalty, it's just normal stuff but with a problem to where the corpse isn't accessible.
Edited by Hoskuldur on 27/11/2012 18:06 GMT
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87 Night Elf Warrior
9440
27/11/2012 16:14Posted by Taepsilum
So if there’s a specific place, like around the Cloud Serpent dailies area where you might be forced to resurrect at a spirit healer, that can be considered a bug and devs usually fix those by either moving the graveyards, creating new ones or flag them to auto-res players who release in those places, we prefer to do that as we’re still hesitant about adding ghost flying to Pandaria.


Why exactly? If it doesn't increase the speed of the player, I don't understand why Blizzard would be hesitant to add it. In fact, the CM at the US forums actually stated adding this feature is being discussed (http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/6893519708?page=2#39).

To go back on topic: imo res sickness should stay. It is a relatively small penalty to resurrect without retreiving your corpse.
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90 Night Elf Hunter
18285
I do agree that dying in game shouldn't be meaningless, else alot of players wouldn't bother to get better at playing etc. losing at a game is still losing, and with an MMO the only real loss is to fail at killing something and it kills u instead.
I generally don't use the spirit healer that much, but those few times i have its almost always been because i couldn't physically get back to my corpse because of stupid placement of graveyard and/or lack of ghostflight

I really don't understand why blizz is 'hesitant' to give us back ghost flight. i mean really what is the big deal? ghost movement is already nerfed (the guild perk might as well just be removed now tbh, its so damn pointless having a 10% move increase that you barely feel).

things like the cloud serpent dailies, its just stupid. You do a quest to 'challenge a student to a duel'. When you attack them, like any normal duel you can't ever kill them (they stay at 1hp and complete the quest), but they can freely kill you? wtf...
and then to add insult to injury, you get a GY thats on a tall spire of rock in the middle of the ocean with no way off it. you get a choice of either rezzing with the spirit healer and sit there waiting for 10mins as you'd have absolutely no chance at defeating the student in your weakened form (their hard enough when yer not half dead), or jumping off the cliff in ghost form, and crawl-floating north all the way to sri-la village and round back down to the arboretum, which since ghost move was nerfed takes... about 10mins -.-

I like the idea of changing rez sickness in that sense, to being something that means we can still play (without being massively nerfed for 10mins and being basically unable to hit critters...), cuz most of us will just afk for it, chat to mates or w/e.

also, for the love of the light, give us ghost flight back! heck, make it something we have to pay for to unlock (maybe the spirit healer could teach it for a fee... ).
also, either remove 'quick and the dead' perk (and give us something actually useful, like say, mass summon!), or un-nerf it a bit so that it actually feels vaguely useful (25-50% would be good) again.
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90 Night Elf Druid
5085
27/11/2012 14:22Posted by Xyio
If the ress sickness is the problem...why not use it as a 10 min break, get food, get drinks, go to toilet...and there 10 min further and sickness is gone.

BUT I PAY WTF THIS IS A RIPOFF

(disclaimer: parody of average wow playing retard)
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80 Human Rogue
9205
The death of a character should be something important, the death penalty is there to make sure players don’t disregard it, in my opinion it’s actually already too easy and too fast to resurrect.
It’s because of the penalty and the lost time when doing a corpse run, that players will be more cautious about their character.
If you decide to resurrect at the spirit healer, it’s because either your character died in a very weird place (and you should be more careful), or you just don’t want to corpse run.

I think we should all be glad that there’s no experience loss as death penalty, that would probably be a bit too harsh, but I do think we need something to keep death from being meaningless.

We’re always open to good and new ideas of what that might be; as long as it’s not “removal of the death penalty”, feel free to chip in ;)


On balance I think I agree with the OP.

You rarely find yourself unable to reach your corpse (dying on the proto drake daily in Storm Peaks and having your corpse half way up a mountain is the only example I can think of) but there are times when recovering your corpse is a very long trip or ressing puts you in a whole heap of trouble. A long run, ressing and getting killed immediately is a pretty unfun experience.

Corpse running in raids is an interesting point, maybe heroics too when they were designed to be challenging. The design of a raid is that you will wipe the first few times, maybe many times on hard progression bosses (all relative and a matter of opinion of course) and the lost time is a factor - less time playing, more time doing, well, nothing really.

I agree that death should not be meaningless but as your equipped items take a 10% durability loss there is a penalty. The 10 minute stat debuff simply stops you playing for ten minutes and on cold reflection that feels a bit punitive.

Why not make there a cost to using the spirit healer based on your character level or limit it to a number of times a day (1,3?).

There are ways to inflict a penalty for dying without a loss of game time for corpse running or (the bigger penalty but less frequently encountered) an effective ten minute lock out.
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90 Blood Elf Priest
8605
When i was playing a hunter on Alli side for the first time I remember vividly what made me quit for two years.

I had died in a a cave full of mobs and after corpse running a couple of times i decided to just take the spirit ress.

Not really understanding what -75% stats would do to my toon back then, i tried to keep questing. And as you'd guess kept getting me !@# handed to me. As I hadnt started with anyone, and had no guild id never really found out the effects of taking a spirit ress. And deciding it was too much effort i quit, I imagine the toon would still be there if i ever remembered the account name/password.

So in a way the RS lost blizz 2 years of Subs off me
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- World of Warcraft
90 Gnome Mage
2110
27/11/2012 16:14Posted by Taepsilum
or flag them to auto-res players who release in those places


Does this happen in Outland ? I'm always terrified to drop/blink over the edge by accident.
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90 Undead Rogue
0
Ressing at the Spirit healer really is the easy way out. And the punishment is the ress sickness.

Honestly, i dont even get why people are whining. The graveyards have increased ten fold compared to the old days. You're never walking for long.
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Why not make it dependent upon where you res., and why you died.

e.g. alliance ressing in horde territory should get the full defbuff. Ditto Horde in alliance territory.
Reduce the length of the debuff for those in contested territory, and removing it completly if you die in your own or a sanctuary.
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90 Undead Warlock
1995
I don't really have a problem with the penalties. It adds minor inconvenience to death without going overboard. (in fact, I get annoyed when people whine over a group wiping. It's just a wipe! Res, regroup and move on!)
The thing I DO have a problem with however is dying in an instance in outlands and the graveyard being miles away from it! Not just that, but due to LFD and the fact that it teleports you straight into the instance I have no bloody clue how to get their manually. Therefore I'm wondering around like an idiot until someone kindly rezzes me or I give up and leave the PUG. It's ridiculous! The Outland dungs are the only ones where I've had THAT much trouble finding the entrance to the damn instance.
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90 Blood Elf Rogue
8640
Why would XP be a penalty its just silly, one of the reasons i fell in love with WoW was.. ok i was on the phone fell of a cliff, no biggie ill click on the ghost lady, have a smoke and come back to resume playing.

Lets say you are leveling and out of pure boredom I decide to bring my lvl 90 character to lets say blasted lands where you are questing, I proceed to kill you over and over again, you loose 25% of your XP everytime i kill you after 5 minutes you lost a level, after a hour you lost a few... While this might not be a problem in particular for you who can bring a high lvl toon any new player would probably not care enough about the game to play it......

Or let us say you are in the jade forest again leveling, have just dinged 86 and proceeded to karasang wilds, boom I gank you you loose a set % of ur XP , you de level and any quest you might have been in progress of is no longer available to you.....

Another thing worth noting is that death in WoW is a common thing and it seldom relates to skill, what if you are questing on for example a rogue you kill a quest boss and the mobs around it, it is your first toon(or not even that , you are experienced) but the high ammount of players pushes the respawns and you realise that there are 3 mobs spawned on you, who make quick work of you simply cuz you just did a challenging fight, you dont have your cooldowns and are low on HP... thats not skill, good or bad thats just bad luck....

What if you are killing a rare, are low on HP and I jump on u and kill you? I didn't succeed cuz Im a better player,I just took an advantage and got a easy kill.. what could you have done in order to stop 1 or 2 players from the oposing faction from flying over and deciding to have "fun" with you... you shouldn't be crippled for it....
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90 Blood Elf Rogue
8640
27/11/2012 20:56Posted by Zazkya
or flag them to auto-res players who release in those places


Does this happen in Outland ? I'm always terrified to drop/blink over the edge by accident.

was doing a BT transmog run the other night, bugged out and dismounted in the twisting nether, between Shadowmoon Valley and HFP, walked to the edge of HFP as it listed my corpse there and ressed fine... so dunno? maybe :D?
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