Isn't it about time for purchase orders on the AH!?

90 Orc Death Knight
16950
I do not approve of this idea since I've played Runescape. They use this system and they have "clans" instead of single players ruling the entire economy and they also trick people into joining their false clan to buy stuff so the price of the item rises, which is very, very easily done.

I love the system, I really do, but it's soooo easy to exploit.

Also, this system is for extreme amounts of items, as there is in Runescape. To make this viable on WoW, you'd have to link every single server to the very same AH. That would however be a great way of repairing the server economy on smaller servers.
Edited by Sporck on 23/12/2012 14:04 GMT
Reply Quote
There's no need to replicate what's done in Runescape (copyright problems aside). All we need is a simple ordering system. If I want 10 Rotten Tomatoes and either they are not on the AH or I don't like the prices there I place an order with a 12, 24 or 48 hour duration, offering a specific price. If Joe is in a hurry to get some gold, sees my order and is willing to sell at my price he fulfils my order. Keep it that simple and it'll be harder to exploit.
Edited by Panamat on 23/12/2012 15:49 GMT
Reply Quote
90 Dwarf Hunter
0
Yeah this is a good idea! Lets shove it into the game. See if anyone whines, and remove it if they do!
Reply Quote
86 Draenei Hunter
2155
Say a "buyer" is putting up 200 iron ore up and will buy them for 500 gold, a seller sees that there is 200 iron ore up for sale on AH for only 300 gold. He then buys this and is about to sell them to the "buyer" for a 200 gold profit.

What the seller doesn't know is that the "buyer" is also the seller that had put up the 200 for sale as well. And as soon as he sees that his iron ore got sold, he will just cancel the purchase order and the guy who was looking for a profit, ends up with 200 iron ore that he may have to sell for a lower price than what he paid for it.

Then it serves them right for falling for it. Anyone would know that a seller would automatically cancel their order and sell to someone who is buying higher than their sell price. You can also see who posted the order so if the buyer and seller were the same, it's an obvious scam. Scammers who do this often fall foul of their own greed, if someone else with the goods can fill the order without buying off the AH first as many probably would be able to, the scammer ends up paying over the odds for it, without even getting rid of the ones they already have and now they have twice the amount of items to get rid of at a considerable loss.

No different to entering a sales order for a low price by mistake and having someone buy it before you got a chance to cancel it. It's your own fault for not being more observant and checking the price before you posted it.
Reply Quote
67 Orc Warlock
11235
I am not sure if it's mentioned, but this also opens for scamming as well.

Say a "buyer" is putting up 200 iron ore up and will buy them for 500 gold, a seller sees that there is 200 iron ore up for sale on AH for only 300 gold. He then buys this and is about to sell them to the "buyer" for a 200 gold profit.

What the seller doesn't know is that the "buyer" is also the seller that had put up the 200 for sale as well. And as soon as he sees that his iron ore got sold, he will just cancel the purchase order and the guy who was looking for a profit, ends up with 200 iron ore that he may have to sell for a lower price than what he paid for it.

Good remark, probably the same account shouldn't have a sale and a buy order at the same time. Like you can't buyout your own auctions today.
I think the original suggestion included that buy orders are not revokable. I don't know what hurts more, for having irrevokable buys, what to do when you see an auction 10% more expensive than your order? Sit it out and risk it selling, or buy it and risk to buy twice?
Reply Quote
67 Orc Warlock
11235
23/12/2012 14:03Posted by Sporck
To make this viable on WoW, you'd have to link every single server to the very same AH. That would however be a great way of repairing the server economy on smaller servers.

I would love that. Small realms like Terenas (horde) really suffer from fluctuation of demand and supply. Greatly.
Not the entire university though, just a few realms. Downside of too many realms are:
- you get undercut more
- it gets inconvenient to buy (you get "item not found" messages)
Reply Quote
90 Blood Elf Priest
6905
wouldnt change a thing and add complexity to a simple mechanic
Reply Quote
90 Undead Mage
6900
Or just put an limmit on all AH gold price you may ask for your mats , fair but not over priced . Its just ripping off the hard earnd gold of most player's . I dont mint y wanna earn some gold , but please keep its fair enough and not 1000 g for something that is 5 g ingame . Real live is allreaddy expencive enough ;o
Reply Quote
90 Goblin Death Knight
5855
20/12/2012 13:41Posted by Taepsilum
I’ll share the suggestion with the devs, but I suspect this isn’t something new to them, we’ll see.


Try to share this one as well:

- Refine the search option so not all items that ends with "cloth" show up when look for wool cloth or linen cloth for that matter (gotta go true 9 tabs of single stacked cloth to find any linen on AH for example).

- For common trade items like cloth and ghost ore, create a rule that doesn't allow people to make single stack offers on AH. If people want to sell there 400 cloth id rather see em do in stacks of 5 or 10 (would make more sense anyways) than the large and currently increasing numbers of single stacks being sold (cloth being a perfect example on my realm). (and with rule i obviously mean game restriction, not like a write rule i needs to be coded ><)

I am sure not every one is going to like this, and i think the major focus should only be on common items. Cause its logical to sell rare things in small amount, but do we really need Windwool Cloth to be in single stacks creating like a whole lot of bull to browse to to get the thing we wanted in the first place a stack of 5 or 10 ??

And the OP his idea is indeed great, but from my point of view only if it has stack limitations and or a refined search feature, else you get another 500 pages of single stack orders for windwool.

*PS: yes i realize there are addons out there for these things, but i use a lot of addons for other things and i like to keep my game a little more basic, i dont see why blizzard can not try to put some more of those type of features into the game itself. I dont need 100 extra function like AH addons, i just like to be able to filter my search and get the AH cleaned up of those idioticly inceasing numbers of single stacks for commonly dropping items.

Just my 2 cents, hope some one reads it that can sends true my mssg, the suggestion box ingame is often way to small in terms of characters to put all info in there properly.

*PS2: For low population servers there should be another solution, like merging realms etc that has been mentioned time after time. CRZ is not working like intended and proll has more loop holes\bugs that it does good to low pop servers (from what i read atleast). Linking the AH on a global base would seem cool but think about it, would you on the low pop server really want to compete with some one that has 10/20 friends around him helping him to scam \ manipulate AH to there hand ?? When you are facing a AH on your own, or with very little numbers you wont be able to face up against the large pop servers trying to fight out who is best on AH sales (cause that will be WoW wide battle than if they get linked, all E-Peens on the same market is going to be verry bad for all prices). Again just my 2 cents, but plz dont ever link all the realms to 1 AH system.
Edited by Bufudk on 23/12/2012 19:31 GMT
Reply Quote
85 Draenei Shaman
0
This does actually help towards solving a major issue Blizzard wanted fixed - people out in the world. If there's a way of advertising for the want of "15 x elemental fire" for a decent price, you may well have a couple of extra people out in world trying to collect them. Multiply this by 100-1000 offers for items on the AH and that's quite a chunk of extra use of the world.

Have the items have a fixed duration, you want X item, you offer a decent price for it or your money is stuck on the AH for the next 4/8/12 hours, it would make the market MUCH harder to manipulate.

It actually adds a whole extra layer of "stuff to do" in game. Don't have anything you really MUST do or bored - go farm for some (probably) guaranteed cash.

It'll have the world PVP folks rather happy too as there'll be more ganking targets around.
Edited by Brethrenn on 23/12/2012 20:00 GMT
Reply Quote
90 Human Priest
19470
Personally I must say I kind of like this idea, not sure if it would be that easy to implement tough.
Could be something like a simple WTB AH tab, and I supposed a timer would need to be associated with the purchase order as well.

But to be honest I think we would see some sort of reversed undercutting between buyers.
Let’s imagine for example:

Player A: Wants to buy 10 Fight Club at 1337 gold each.
Player B: Sees Player A’s offer and decides he wants to buy 10 Fight Club at 1338 each.
Player C: See’s all the available options and sells to the “highest bidder” = Player B.

I would still have a few concerns though, this would probably bring excessive complexity to the AH, because for example, if you are a seller, you are probably going to end up doing some extra work, not only you will have to check the current AH prices from other sellers (competitors), but you would also check the buyers offers against one another and against the current sellers prices in order to find the option that would benefit you the most.

Buyers would see a similar competition to sellers when they face constant undercutting. This would probably create a certain frustration because when you are a buyer, chances are you need those items more urgently than when you are a seller, since sellers only get gold.
So the sense of urgency from buyers would probably work against the success of this implementation.

Still I think this is a good idea and I’m probably exaggerating a bit when I speculate about the possible consequences. We just need to make sure that ideas are sound before we spend resources on them, we need to be sure that not only they would work, but that enough players would actually benefit and experience better gameplay because of it.
I’ll share the suggestion with the devs, but I suspect this isn’t something new to them, we’ll see.


This is how a market does and should operate. You don't get any closer to a perfect market than this. This is how price setting works. supply and demand combined with willingness to pay. This is not negative consequences.
Reply Quote
90 Night Elf Death Knight
4810
Paying 5.800 for dancing runeweapon makes me go *WTF* i pvp like i have money to afford that for a single enchant. People over overpricing way to much in this game. i like too see this in wow *now!!
Reply Quote
60 Blood Elf Mage
10970
I'd definitely like to see something like this implemented, though with enough regulations to prevent abuse. Just as the game has evolved over time, I firmly believe that the auction house needs to as well.
Edited by Solbranthius on 24/12/2012 02:55 GMT
Reply Quote
90 Blood Elf Monk
8155
There's no need to replicate what's done in Runescape (copyright problems aside). All we need is a simple ordering system. If I want 10 Rotten Tomatoes and either they are not on the AH or I don't like the prices there I place an order with a 12, 24 or 48 hour duration, offering a specific price. If Joe is in a hurry to get some gold, sees my order and is willing to sell at my price he fulfils my order. Keep it that simple and it'll be harder to exploit.

Have the items have a fixed duration, you want X item, you offer a decent price for it or your money is stuck on the AH for the next 4/8/12 hours, it would make the market MUCH harder to manipulate.

It actually adds a whole extra layer of "stuff to do" in game. Don't have anything you really MUST do or bored - go farm for some (probably) guaranteed cash.

Indeed Panamat and Brethrenn.

Thanks again for all your input and suggestions guys, please keep them coming. It is greatly appreciated and lets Blizzard know what you think!

This is something that needs to be seriously addressed. I don't have a problem with people playing the AH, I'm sure at some point we've all seen something going for cheap and put it back on for a bit of profit and competition is good... But that all changes when you have some players sat undercutting and manipulating the market 24/7. Some of which don't even actually play WoW, their sole aim is to dominate your AH!

On our realm, for example, there's a guy trying to run a Cartel. You're not allowed to name and shame on the forums but go and check out the "Busy Sellers" tab of your own realm on Undermine Journal... this should make it pretty obvious who your main AH players are:

Undermine Journal EU:
https://eu.theunderminejournal.com/

Things change, in my opinion, when playing the AH like this stops your average player from using the AH to make gold! This kind of AH play ruins medium-to-low realms! After all, who wants to stay on a medium-to-low realm where you're almost always undercut within minutes/seconds of posting your own auctions?

The Auction House system is currently very one-sided in favor of those who wish to try and dominate it... its about time this was changed!
Edited by Daftmonk on 24/12/2012 15:17 GMT
Reply Quote
90 Blood Elf Monk
8155
Don't think it will work .
You can make orders to buy a item at 100g. but if the one that sells it wants 150g, he won't sell it to you.
So bascially nothing changes....

Just because one person isn't willing to sell the item/mats to you for 100g doesn't mean that someone else won't. Of course there may always be people asking for items/mats for far less than they are worth, and maybe it is fair to say some of those orders will never be fulfilled.

Panamat also made a very good point earlier on in this thread:

Screening activities by market players are easy to spot. They usually use tiny increments, for example undercutting something posted at 10,000g by 1g. If the most that players are willing to pay for that item is 5,000g other sellers have no way of knowing and it will take weeks or even months to discover the right price undercutting at that rate. Players genuinely interested in finding the real market price of an item typically use increments of at least 1% and a minimum bid price that's at least 10% below the buyout price.

Usually the market price is set by players manipulating the market, resulting in some goods being far overpriced. Another benefit of Purchase Orders is that they should help to show more or less what other players are willing to pay.

At least having Purchase Orders gives players more options, mainly the option to instantly sell their items/mats instead of never selling them because someone playing the auction house is constantly undercutting them at grossly inflated prices.
Edited by Daftmonk on 24/12/2012 18:47 GMT
Reply Quote
90 Dwarf Paladin
0
Currently selling auctions at their right price is hard and time consuming or requires a lot of addons (that require time to set up well), this also deters most people from crafting, resulting in sometimes ridiculous prices or even complete lack of some items in AH. Also small pool of items make price easy to be manipulated and volatile to very big jumps in the moment 1 person decides to buy everything out. My full support to this idea.

Also remove limit of listing auctions for max 2 days, it is very irritating that you have to relist them so often. Even doing this at maximum mailbox refreshing speed of 50 auctions/60 seconds (that requires various well set addons to do, i can only imagine pain for people with loads of stuff with not so sophisticated addons that i have) it takes me 30-40 minutes to relist my stuff, it is getting annoying.
Edited by Silverfling on 26/12/2012 13:04 GMT
Reply Quote
56 Pandaren Monk
7335
Great idea, EVE online has a place order option on the AH and it works great. Part because the AH there is not interconnected
Reply Quote
90 Blood Elf Monk
8155
Thanks again for your messages of support/feedback for the idea guys... please keep them coming!
Reply Quote

Please report any Code of Conduct violations, including:

Threats of violence. We take these seriously and will alert the proper authorities.

Posts containing personal information about other players. This includes physical addresses, e-mail addresses, phone numbers, and inappropriate photos and/or videos.

Harassing or discriminatory language. This will not be tolerated.

Forums Code of Conduct

Report Post # written by

Reason
Explain (256 characters max)
Submit Cancel

Reported!

[Close]