Guild destroyed by Game Master intervention

90 Gnome Mage
10555
Because no rules were broken doesnt mean that nothing wrong was done, on that we will have to agree to disagree.
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90 Night Elf Druid
13445
So you 'know' he's a GM because his Facebook account says so? Gimme three minutes and I'll suddenly work for Blizzard (according to Facebook) and have made a sandwich to boot! Not exactly definitive proof.

It doesn't matter if he knew you'd be returning or not, the policies state that, after 30 days of inactivity, guild leadership is allowed to be handed over to someone else. If you know you're going away for 30+ days, and intend to return, the best solution is to hand leadership over to someone who you can trust to be active in that time period, to uphold the standards you have for the guild, and to hand leadership back to you on your return. Or you can take the risk and hope no one petitions for it.

You still haven't clarified what cheating occurred. Maybe he was a bit sneaky, but he didn't do anything wrong as far as you've told us.
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90 Gnome Mage
10555
He has broken no Blizzard rules I agree.
He has taken over our guild without permission of the guild membership and refuses to relinquish it. We have been inactive as a guild for some time being home to alts and soloists taking advantage of the perks noone has ever asked him to take a leadership role he decide to do this himself without breaking any rules but certainly not with anyones blessing eitherI dont suppose that means much to you but to the people that have been playing together for 5 years it means rather a lot, as it would seem at this time he is in no mood to discuss this new found power.
As I have said sometime you dont have to break the law to do wrong

I could offer you proof if you wish, but we have to do it by personal message and you can independently verify that its the truth how about that then that would remove that doubt from everyone ?
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for him to get permission to take over the guild off blizzard, then he must have been the most active highest ranking player still playing in the guild. that gave him permission to do so, im afraid he dosent need yours nor anyone elses permission.
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90 Gnome Mage
10555
Yes you are right. Thanks goodness for Blizzard rules
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90 Night Elf Druid
13445
If all he has done wrong is take leadership without asking permission, then I have to say I don't see the problem.

If you had cared about the guild, you would have promoted someone before going inactive for such a long period of time, instead of leaving them at the mercy of whoever comes along, with no leader is sight.

If others had cared about the guild, they would have discussed it and tried to work out a way to get you back to promote someone (if possible) or to petition for leadership to be transferred and put forward the case for who they as a whole agreed would be best.

As it is, he was the only one who cared enough about leadership of the guild to look for it.

Maybe he's not the choice of leader favoured by the rest, but they gave him permission by not caring until it was too late. Same as all those people who never bother voting complain about the current government, and yet it's their own fault that they never bothered doing anything about it until the chance was passed.
Edited by Kaytie on 23/06/2011 16:30 BST
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90 Gnome Mage
10555
Kaylie Noone had a problem it was an inactive guild he took advantage of that situation theres wasnt anything that needed to be cared about we were all on the same page as far as where the guild was (well apart from one).

Why would you assume I didnt care about the guild before becoming inactive ? There was nothing that a leader needed to do, another member had moved a character to another guild and wanted an alt to be promoted so they could invite and get bank access on their account which was in hand.

As for the person that has taken control they care so much they didnt ask the opinion of other before petitioning, they have refused to discuss another leader despite the wish of his membership, that shows no care or concern for the guild just selfishness or powertripping he did care yes but not about the guild about himself. The reason none else did this was because there was no need to not becuase they didnt care.
Edited by Sandjumper on 23/06/2011 16:40 BST
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Customer Service
Before this thread gets too out of hand let me just state that the player who is now in control of the guild Sandjumper does not work for us and is not a Blizzard employee.

I am sorry to hear that the guild guidelines you and your fellow guildmates set up have been ignored, but as the control was given to the longest running highest officer after 30 days, you will have to take this matter up with the new Guild Master.

I wish you all the best in getting to a satisfactory conclusion. :)
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90 Gnome Mage
10555
Sir with respect you are wrong he works in Houston as does his wife another member of our guild and now second in command by coincidence her name is on the Starcraft box as a CS representative and the picture appears on our guild website you should maybe look at the time some of these characters achieved their original collectors edition pets 2 years after the game was released the day the started working for blizzard. Maybe you thought I meant they worked for European Blizzard. They continue to represent the company with some dubious qualities. I will continue this further away from this website I really didnt want to go here but please dont say that I am not telling the truth I have no agenda to slander Blizzard.
Edited by Sandjumper on 23/06/2011 19:35 BST
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Customer Service
I am very sorry Sandjumper and I didn't mean to imply that you were misleading us, but in some cases it is possible that players tend to exaggerate stories in order to appear more connected to Blizzard than they actually are. My investigations into the player who was originally promoted to GM after you showed that they weren't an employee.

I have however taken the extra information you have given me on board and I appreciate you taking the time to clarify the situation. :)
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90 Gnome Mage
10555
I am glad we have that straightened out, you said the player who is NOW in control of the guild. That is the person we have a problem with he is the one holding the guild to ransom and initaited the switch and refuses to discuss a solution with the guild, he actually told me and the guild that it happened automatically when the guild leader had been inactive for 30 days is that correct ? I guess as a GM he knew the rules better than us players and used to his advantage, so still not impressed. We have written as both concerned guildmates and as concerned customers over the continued treatment of our guild by one of your representatives, yes no rules were broken in game but ask near anyone in the guild and none feels that this is fair and that noone apart from him wants him as our guild leader and noone will help us becuase they are blinded by rules and unable to see fair play. but I am glas we cleared up our misunderstanding I hope to hear from someone in Authority soon over the situation and their opinion of their employees conduct and what many of us consider poor moral and ethical values in regard to others
Edited by Sandjumper on 23/06/2011 20:23 BST
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90 Night Elf Druid
13445
23/06/2011 20:21Posted by Sandjumper
he actually told me and the guild that it happened automatically when the guild leader had been inactive for 30 days is that correct ?

Incorrect. A member of the guild needs to make a ticket, reporting that the guild leader has been inactive for longer than 30 days, and then the GM who reads the ticket - assuming the length of inactivity is correct - will promote the highest ranking active player (not necessarily the ticket-maker, but it will frequently be). I've done it myself a couple of times with bank alt guilds led by friends who I knew had quit the game, and one of them had been inactive over a year before I sought a change of leadership, with nothing happening automatically in the meantime.

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23/06/2011 20:21Posted by Sandjumper
I hope to hear from someone in Authority soon over the situation and their opinion of their employees conduct and what many of us consider poor moral and ethical values in regard to others

only problem with that is the wowconcernseu@blizzard.com is for EU staff. as EU and US games are treated as seperate entities, i expect US staff would not fall under the jurisdiction of EU moderators
you could check if there is a similar US address
as a player he has done nothing wrong, and therefore i would expect nothing to be done to him
Edited by Allanonn on 23/06/2011 20:47 BST
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85 Night Elf Hunter
0
Ok so Blizz have the policy that if a GM character does not log on once every 30 days a member can open a ticket to have the guild master removed from that position and have leadership given to the highest ranking member that is active? How the heck is that able to be the case when Blizz have the policy that everything in the guild bank is the propety of the GM and that as long as the GM does not violate the ToS they can do what they like with the guild, yet last time I read the ToS there was nothing in there about you only being able to lead a guild as long a you log in with the GM character every 30 days, also why can a GM cannot declear that a guild is no hold for a set time without the risk of being userped, for exsample in June and July in most of europe 16 year olds have exsams they need to take and revise for and if you had a guild thats raid team(s) consisted so heavly of this demographic that it was unable to raid because the players had ro revise a GM could not just say "look these exsams are far more importent the guild is on hold and me and most of the officers will not be on as we are studying" without fear of comming back aftet that time to find the guild hijacked?
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90 Night Elf Druid
13445
They don't have to play, they literally have to log on once in the thirty day period of like thirty seconds, and that resets the timer. Plus, as I suggested, if you're not able to do that - say you're heading to No Internet Land, or subs are running out and won't be renewed for over a month - then you should promote someone who you can trust to behave responsibly and hand it back when you return.

They want to avoid guilds dying just because one guy quits without passing the torch. Thirty days is a pretty long time to not be logging on at all, and even if your guild is taking a break from raiding, it's unfair to those players who are members and not of the demographic to be incapable of logging at all during that period to have zero contact with guild officials. You do have a social responsibility as a Guild Leader to take care of your guild. You don't have to do what the members want, but you have to at least be visible so that they can contact you if there's an issue they want to discuss. Even during exam times, it's not unreasonable to have five minutes free somewhere in an entire month.
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85 Night Elf Hunter
0
They want to avoid guilds dying just because one guy quits without passing the torch. Thirty days is a pretty long time to not be logging on at all, and even if your guild is taking a break from raiding, it's unfair to those players who are members and not of the demographic to be incapable of logging at all during that period to have zero contact with guild officials. You do have a social responsibility as a Guild Leader to take care of your guild. You don't have to do what the members want, but you have to at least be visible so that they can contact you if there's an issue they want to discuss. Even during exam times, it's not unreasonable to have five minutes free somewhere in an entire month.


My point was how can Blizz say to a GM that they must be around to deal with the guild and its issues atleast once every 30 days and at the same time say that they can take the entier contence of the guild bank sell it and then Gkick everyone without any repecusions?

Its a bit contredictery saying "you must be online atleast once every 30 days to run the guild" and then say "oh you can do anything you want with the guild bank and boot any member you want for any reason".
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My point was how can Blizz say to a GM that they must be around to deal with the guild and its issues atleast once every 30 days and at the same time say that they can take the entier contence of the guild bank sell it and then Gkick everyone without any repecusions?

Its a bit contredictery saying "you must be online atleast once every 30 days to run the guild" and then say "oh you can do anything you want with the guild bank and boot any member you want for any reason".

because its THEIR game. that seems to be a point a lot of people either forget or just plain ignore. If blizzard decided that a guildmaster had to log in every 10 days or another member could ask for a new GM, then that would be their decision
like it or lump it, if u want to play the game, then u agree to go by their decisions and their policies
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85 Night Elf Hunter
0
because its THEIR game. that seems to be a point a lot of people either forget or just plain ignore. If blizzard decided that a guildmaster had to log in every 10 days or another member could ask for a new GM, then that would be their decision
like it or lump it, if u want to play the game, then u agree to go by their decisions and their policies


I get that they get to make the rule they want, I am just pointing out that is is stupid and unreasanable to have such contredicotry policys, like how they say they want players to self regulate as much as possiable with their intervention and then ban naming and shaming meaning that its impossiable to inform others en-mass of the misdeeds of players.
Edited by Arivael on 24/06/2011 14:35 BST
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naming & shaming is not allowed because half (if not more) of the time it is hacked accounts that are doing the botting/farming etc. if that person was named & shamed then when they get back they would have a very bad rep and possibly not be able to join a good guild/get into pugs etc etc. hence why naming & shaming is not permitted
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85 Night Elf Hunter
0
naming & shaming is not allowed because half (if not more) of the time it is hacked accounts that are doing the botting/farming etc. if that person was named & shamed then when they get back they would have a very bad rep and possibly not be able to join a good guild/get into pugs etc etc. hence why naming & shaming is not permitted


Where did I say that I did not understand the reasons for the policy, all I said was that telling players to self-regulate and then preventing them for doing so was stupid, also botting/gold selling are very bad exsamples of what I meant, I meant more along the lines of a GM taking the whole contence of the guild bank and using it for their own gain (and thats within the rules so Blizz will not do anything about it) and when this is discovered by the guild can they go to the forums and make a post warning people that GM X of guild Y has done this and should not be trusted, no they cannot.
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