Wizards again at bottom?

Wizard
From looking at the leaderboards, I see wizards may be the weakest class yet again.

In 2.1 nobody wanted a wizard in group play on high grifts, in 2.2 Tal Rasha made them decent, but now they're at the bottom of the leaderboards again.

Is it just a slow start, or time for wizards to skip yet another era?
It's not a slow start.
Though, it's funny now, everything folds after the PTR disaster.
I call it then : BARBLO ... and here we have it :Stupid barblo !
People wont even accept to group if there's not 1 monk and 3 barbs (which stands for barblo 3)
The leaderboard is only gonna get funnier by the day.
This is the first season of rolling a Wiz for me. I've already got one out of season but it's my character with the least amount of gear / played time, so thought I would give it a try.

I'm not really concerned about the leader boards and playing the Wiz has been a lot of fun so far :)

Just thought I would throw that in there so if there is someone considering rolling one, they aren't put off too much by this post.
Dude, who cares?

The game is enjoyable again. I am having a blast with my Delrasha Wizard and I don't care about leaderboards, I play to have fun.
well I care ... Barblo is a good name for it ...
Barblo! +1
It's just a shame that every patch seems to leave some class greatly underpowered. And maybe it's just me, but wiz gets to be that class more often than others. Anyway, whatever the case, there's nothing to fear, barb is here.

Finally. I do agree it's about fun, and that leaderboards are not all that matters (me being a wiz :D)..

Good luck to all, have fun
Here is what actually happens in PTR (imho)...

(1) when patches start there is imbalance
(2) people shout about it a lot in forums
(3) the devs correct imbalances as much as possible, but perfect balance is impossible so there is probably still a bit of imbalance (not to mention things everyone overlooked, like how everyone over looked "sever" builds for over a year)

Then here is what happens in the first week of seasons...

(1) the players who really want to grind a ton of paragon and do GR65 in less than a week pick the class they think is best for that task
(2) some of those players accomplish their objective

Look at the top wizards. They are all paragon 500-550. Look at the top barbs and monks. Quite a few are over 700. Keep in mind that the exp required for 550 paragon is less than the exp to go from 650 and 700. The players who are getting 64 on barbs have likely been playing about 2-3x as much as the top wizard (or just playing smarter in exp grinding groups).

IMO all the leaderboards are showing us is that the majority of players dedicated enough to play Diablo 3 over 15 hours a day for 5 days straight over teamspeak with other players like them have mostly decided to roll barbs and monks.

You saw the exact same imbalance at the start of last season. At the end there was one of every class in the top 16. One of five classes in the top 5.

I'm not saying that this season is as balanced as last, but that I think any actual imbalance is being amplified to appear much greater because of how top players pick the classes they play.
02/09/2015 07:40Posted by Hepcat
I'm not saying that this season is as balanced as last, but that I think any actual imbalance is being amplified to appear much greater because of how top players pick the classes they play.


Well, don't you think that there are usually good reasons why top player pick the classes they do? And doesn't that lead to the conclusion that most top player not picking wizards this session is because the class is not competitive?
The leaderboards were designed for competition within classes, not amongst classes. Otherwise, it would imply that all the classes are perfectly balanced and there is 0 discrepency between classes, which is utterly impossible.

It's really too early to know how everything will pan out anyways. Obviously though the diminishing returns on CC hurt the wiz class a lot.
02/09/2015 13:43Posted by Fenrir

Well, don't you think that there are usually good reasons why top player pick the classes they do?


They likely have good arguments for perceiving barbs/monks as the best options. But often these decisions are made by how the barbs/monks look on paper or how they are perform while in PTR. Often things that look good on paper aren't all that great in real life and changes happen between when PTR starts and when patch goes live. Their arguments may be valid, but we can't be sure until more dedicated wizards catch up in playing hours. We also can't be sure about the extent of the imbalance.

I would say this though: a lot of people were crying that the sky was falling when they saw the CC nerfs. From my playing with wizard using calamity, stun bubbles, and APD though, the changes didn't feel that significant. I just had to alter my style a bit to go back and forth between groups while CC resists cooled. I certainly went up quite a bit in GRs between 2.2 and 2.3, not down (but can't say remotely how significant the change was because I didn't try pushing).

I also saw a lot of people crying that Vyr's was terrible when it first hit live... basically people try it for a second and if they can't figure it out they give up or assume it's not going to ever be great. The players who are going to be clearing 68-70 with Vyr's late in the season aren't even trying to clear that now, they are farming gear, experimenting with builds, and griding exp.

02/09/2015 13:43Posted by Fenrir
And doesn't that lead to the conclusion that most top player not picking wizards this session is because the class is not competitive?


No. Sometimes even top players jump on a bandwagon only to find out later that they had the wrong one. It has happened a lot in Diablo 3 in the past and it has happened with lots of professional athletes as well. Pros see another pro do really well with XYZ gear, they in turn buy XYZ gear. Soon everyone buys XYZ gear and uses it and everyone wins with XYZ gear. Much later, through research and testing, people discover that XYZ gear actually has some flaws and there is much better gear available.

At the start of last season Firebird builds were topping the leaderboards. This is because a few players had a lot of experience with Firebirds and got to a high GR with them quite fast. I saw many people believing FB was the best build for season 3. Then things shifted. Slowly, more and more Tal wizards crept up the leaderboards and more and more players started to switch. By the end, Tals was owning the boards.
02/09/2015 13:43Posted by Fenrir
Well, don't you think that there are usually good reasons why top player pick the classes they do? And doesn't that lead to the conclusion that most top player not picking wizards this session is because the class is not competitive?
Already on PTR people have mentioned that the Cube does lower the time to gear competetively and that Paragon becomes more important.
Barbs and Monks have been found to be the best option for XP farming.

I have seen more than one streamer, mentioning they will start with Barb or Monk and later return to their main class.
Others do play in 4 groups with B/M.

So I would think not many care about cross class competion but simply want to have the best preperatino for their competetive runs.
01/09/2015 10:03Posted by Buki
Dude, who cares?

The game is enjoyable again. I am having a blast with my Delrasha Wizard and I don't care about leaderboards, I play to have fun.


I don't care too much about the leader boards, I just want to clear as much as possible.. However due to the state of wizards it's nearly impossible to find a group beyond the GR55 public games.
It's a Blizzard game. Name one Blizzard game where melees aren't majorly overpowered compared to casters.
and when DH were ruling the leaderboards with marauder? or when wizzard with god knows what? then it was good right?

so stop whining...
24/09/2015 02:23Posted by Arcanis
It's a Blizzard game. Name one Blizzard game where melees aren't majorly overpowered compared to casters.

Heroes of the Storm. Casters have a little advantage there.

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