Double Tornado - Act 3 with 900k, Guide out - PART 2

Barbarian
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First off thanks alot of this awesome build! It really brings back the fun to this game :)
Im currently farming act 3, but I am not as comfortable as I would like. I'm having problems with spear throwers, shamans and succubus's mainly since they keep running away, also those big guys with maces can easily cause problems.

I was hoping for some input on which gear to improve or what to focus on to improve my gameplay.

* More crit chance. 38% with shout is a bit low - it will be more pleasant with 45%+

* Your AllResist is indeed a bit low. More would help.

* Your weapons are a bit rubbish. Those +70% crit dmg gems are nice and all, but they will only be giving you ~10% more DPS - turning a 730 DPS weapon into a ~800 DPS weapon. A no-stat 1050 DPS weapon would be a substantial improvement!

* Alternatively, go get a weapon with +cold damage (see my post above describing the benefits). Use this for the mobs that try to kite you, or those hard-hitters.

* You have an unnecessarily large health pool; you could lose ~15k health and be fine. Bear this in mind when hunting for gear with more AllResist.

Also, and I don't mean to be rude, but your gear is actually great already. If you're having problems it may be due to something you're doing wrong, rather than gear.
(Reposting this on this page so it has more visibility)

Just wanted to chime in and say that a +cold damage weapon in your mainhand helps enormously. It causes every single attack to snare the enemy by a considerable amount. This means that it takes an enemy a far longer time to get through a tornado than it does normally, which means your tornados will land many more ticks than they would normally (therefore more damage and more healing for you). There are various implications:

* It helps fix one of the biggest problem areas in this build; enemies that try to flee. Because the enemy runs slowly, your tornadoes usually land more hits, so you are far less likely to end up fury starved. Furthermore, many fleeing enemies seem to STOP running if they take sufficient damage, so they kite you less in the first place

* If you are undergeared, it is far easier to kill using only sprint's tornadoes when they snare enemies. Great for very hard-hitting enemies

* If you want to skip champion groups, the snare means they abandon their chase much quicker than usual

The +cold damage weapon must be in your mainhand for the snare to occur.
12/07/2012 16:28Posted by Nerull
Does the +cold dam have to be on your mainhand or can it be on your offhand aswell ?

Works, but on offhand you'll only slow with WW I think, whereas on mainhand it'll work for Sprint's tornadoes too.

12/07/2012 17:11Posted by Hairy
The +cold damage weapon must be in your mainhand for the snare to occur.

Even with WW?
I don't know how long the debuff is though, could be worth it if it's about ~2s or more, hitting all enemies with WW from time to time to keep them slowed.
hey guys i was just wondering how important ias is.
Now my question is, is better for example a 820 dps axe with no ias than a 750 axe with 10%? (other stats the same)

Once again thx dino for this !@#$ing awesome build :D
Thanks for the answer :)

I Will try to get more ress and crit and lowering my hps then.

The cold Dam really sounds good, but it makes it even harder to find a weapon i guess.
About the Extra crit Dam on weapons i thought that was really important aswell as lof, but i guess not as important as dure dps.

And Btw a siegebreaker -> cydia -> azmodan is about 1 to 1,5 hour for mé but with 5-6 deaths. Would like to get that Down.
Besides Ruthless and Weapon Mastery, do you guys use Tough as Nails/Nerves of Steel or Superstition as the 3rd passive?

I was using the passives to boost my Armor since people were saying that you want 10 Armor for every All resist (i.e., with 700 AR you should have 7000 Armor...so my armor is a bit lower than my AR). But I switched to Superstition due to a couple ppl's suggeston from previous threads about extra resist and fury generation etc. BTW I use Overpower/Crushing Advance.

Although the extra fury is nice, I think(?) I die more with superstition.
Interesting finding this thread as kind of stumbled into this build looking for some way tio exploit high crit chance - my barb is only lvl 46 in act 3 nm, 5K dps with 31% crit chance and +293% crit damage (borrowed an 80% crit gem of my lvl 60 wiz) with 300 or so life on hit - its doing a nice job of chewing up pretty much everything.

Not using wrath of the berserker as the useful rune is level 60.
12/07/2012 20:04Posted by Nerull
The cold Dam really sounds good, but it makes it even harder to find a weapon i guess.

Not at all. Cold damage has lower damage than the other elemental types; this means the absolute MAXIMUM dps a +cold damage weapon can have is ~850 DPS, so the weapons are often very cheap. Just grab a decent +cold damage weapon as an 'alternate' weapon to switch to when facing those annoying enemies that try to run! :)
Does anyone know the answer to my question about ias 4 topics above? Would be nice to know pls
Besides Ruthless and Weapon Mastery, do you guys use Tough as Nails/Nerves of Steel or Superstition as the 3rd passive?

I was using the passives to boost my Armor since people were saying that you want 10 Armor for every All resist (i.e., with 700 AR you should have 7000 Armor...so my armor is a bit lower than my AR). But I switched to Superstition due to a couple ppl's suggeston from previous threads about extra resist and fury generation etc. BTW I use Overpower/Crushing Advance.

Although the extra fury is nice, I think(?) I die more with superstition.

If dual-wielding, the "vitality gives armour" passive is better than the 25% armour one (which is better for a shield).

As far as Nerves of Steel vs Superstition, I would suggest just giving them both a try and seeing how it feels. With recent gear I calculated Nerves of Steel was giving me -17.5% damage taken from ALL sources, vs -20% from superstition on magic only, but it will be different depending on your gear. Choose what you think is most important!

If I'm farming easy stuff, I definitely recommend swapping that last passive to Unforgiving - it really removes ALL fury issues (but, unfortunately, 'easier' != better).
hey guys i was just wondering how important ias is.
Now my question is, is better for example a 820 dps axe with no ias than a 750 axe with 10%? (other stats the same)

Once again thx dino for this !@#$ing awesome build :D

IAS is included in the DPS so it won't boost your damage, it depends on what you need :

More DPS will give you ... more damage, obviously. :P
More IAS will give you more fury generation and more haling, so you'll have an easier time surviving and keeping WotB up, but you'll do a bit less damage (in your example).

If you already don't have any big problem surviving or generating fury, you can skip IAS entirely.
12/07/2012 22:30Posted by Akara
Does anyone know the answer to my question about ias 4 topics above? Would be nice to know pls

You're essentially deciding between 10% more damage and 10% IAS. Personally, I'd go for the IAS; 10% faster attacks means 10% more fury and 10% more LOH benefit. I view it to be more important to keep the build rolling more comfortably than to do a bit more damage.
Probably won't be very useful for those who read the threads, but I posted a video explaining how the build work, since I skipped that entirely and only explained how to play in the previous one :

http://youtu.be/aJOLG9BDHkQ
hallo Dino :)
I use superstiton instead of NoS and in my opinion this is better choice. in this moment i have 64k life and 5k armor buffed and in act 3 I very rarely die :) important to have a lot of life and LoH and act 3 becomes a simple :)
Also it´s very important that you take your off-hand weapon into account because tornado tick frequency depends on the aps of the last weapon you swung,


That's very interesting. one question though, does it take into account WW swings ? I mean, does WW attack change the 'last weapon you swung' ?

If the former is true then we should only aim at maximizing aps on both weapons. Otherwise we can just max aps on the main hand, then hit a barrel once and then never hit anything with a 'normal' attack again to keep the max number of ticks on the sprint tornadoes.
Yes Whirlwind alternates weapons which is visible on the character screen, which means the "last weapon swung" part is also applied. Nice idea there, but it´s only applicable to a sole Sprint build (without Whirlwind).

Actually for a tornado only build, maximizing aps (meaning tick breakpoints) on the off-hand is the beter option while maximizing damage on the main hand. So a heavy hitting main hand with an off-hand that gives you more tornado ticks.

That would work like this: swing with your 6% weapon IAS off-hand dagger (1.8285 aps) and afterwards your tornado hits will do main hand (mace for example) weapon damage and get 18 ticks instead of 13 ticks, improving the tornado damage by 38.5% :)
12/07/2012 17:11Posted by Hairy
Just wanted to chime in and say that a +cold damage weapon in your mainhand helps enormously.

I ran with a cold dmg MH for like a week and it was good but it also got annoying when I was farming and trying to kite elite/champion packs together and they were slowed down causing me to lose aggro if I didn't zig zag when sprinting. Got a new MH without cold recently and I havent noticed a negative impact on my killspeed. As long as youre WWing in tight circles mobs should be in tornadoes continuously anyways. I would kinda like cold in my offhand though so it would just be triggered by ww and not tornadoes.
Intersting - I thought everything was based on what weapon you had on the main hand?

Im using dual mace (one cold with 600 LoH, the other normal with 100% crit) at the mo for crit chance boost, but does it make more sense to go with mace on main for the crit boost, then something fast on offhand?
Recently had some fun using this build in hardcore. I love to dual wield and run half naked in the middle of tons of mobs in inferno hardcore. I'm not really sure how but I did manage not to get killed so far and I slew Belial.

I uploaded a video here : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vUPQYIBteng

For those who don't speek french, I obtained an achievement during the fight : "Armageddon Extrème" wich means "Inferno Hardcore". So in the case you don't trust me AND care in the slightest, it's a proof this kill is indeed a hc one.

P.S : Inferno difficulty is called "armageddon" in french. The word "hell" in english comes from scandinavian "Helheim" wich means "the realm of Hel" (Hel is a scandinavian goddess).
In french we already use the latin root to mean "hell" and it's called "enfer". Changing difficulty to go from "enfer" to "inferno"... well that's just the same thing. That doesn't sound that epic.
this good for offhand?

http://i.imgur.com/6tKs1.png

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