Expansion - revisit old bosses in endless dungeon?

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They don’t want just more Alkaizer runs.


Essentially this.

The Endless dungeon would need to have a random layout, properly random mind you, like keep depths, sewers, etc.
The other thing an endless dungeon would need is constant variance, taking themes from each act in a random order. Like act 1 caves, or cathedral, then an act 2 sewer or VoA style dungeon, then maybe Act 3 keep or crater level, then an act 4 spire map.

Maybe fill every map up with a few elites and maybe a stronger elite or champ pack at the end that has maybe 5 or 6 affixes? I don't know, just throwing ideas out.

But basically the idea is, I can go in to the endless dungeon, play for as long as I like without leaving the game, and then exit when I need to log off.
Most important of all though, the dungeon needs to be different every single time you go in, so it's never "scripted". Scripted is boring. Random is good.


Maybe fill every map up with a few elites and maybe a stronger elite or champ pack at the end that has maybe 5 or 6 affixes? I don't know, just throwing ideas out.

But basically the idea is, I can go in to the endless dungeon, play for as long as I like without leaving the game, and then exit when I need to log off.
Most important of all though, the dungeon needs to be different every single time you go in, so it's never "scripted". Scripted is boring. Random is good.


Endless dungeon might be great, but what about people with less powerfull computers..
That thing would take a lot of RAM, unless you mean that when you die, it's all over for that spesific dungeon?(aka content that's behind also goes off the RAM)
I think there should be loading/checkpoints and if you die you start from there.
And difficulty should increase after each point, like mp0, mp1..etc but without increasing mobs health, only damage.
I think it would be tricky to implement an endless dungeon without making it an "Instead of" rather than an "As well as".

What you don't want is a new mode which makes the current game a 1-60 journey and then never played because the endless dungeon provides all the xp, gold and legendary farming that you need to get to p100.

With the suggestions above, I would see no point playing any of the acts anymore. I see that as a bad thing.

At the same time, if you remove xp from the endless dungeon then it would probably never be played and just become a "bit of fun" for a few hours then seen as useless. like brawling.
Something like X hero siege in warcraft 3 is what i'd find fun. The idea could be combined with the endless dungeon, even why not an endless amount of mobs attacking you while you're protecting a building or some lore character? This is just something that struck me now and i'm not really expecting anything, but feel free to share your opinion about what you think about it :P
I think it should be a status thing, with a present every 5/10 levels. This is the same as a web based mmo I used to play a while ago.

Mobs should start at A4 inferno MP0, by level 5, you're maybe at MP1. at level 10, perhaps MP1.5

etc etc until say level 60 is MP10 and level 100 is MP14

Perhaps every 5 levels, you get 3 resplendent chests so it's worth doing other than just a status thing.
Perhaps every 10 levels you get a room full of treasure goblins that never portal, because that would be utterly hilarious.
24/05/2013 14:23Posted by Chuckle!@#$
I think it would be tricky to implement an endless dungeon without making it an "Instead of" rather than an "As well as".


True, such a dungeon would have to be a choice and not a replacement!

There are several things that would need to be taken into consideration, but it is still nice knowing what people have in mind exactly when they talk about wanting an endless dungeon :-)
What about farming regular game; you have chance to find a "Map/portal to secret cave/dungeon" (like classic caves with chest or two on 2nd lvl in it)
24/05/2013 14:23Posted by Chuckle!@#$
I think it would be tricky to implement an endless dungeon without making it an "Instead of" rather than an "As well as".


This kind of thinking is why the game is so bad.

''looks at how people ignore killing boss's and only farm trash''

We want something to look forward for when we are working on our characters. MP10 was never the answer.

True, such a dungeon would have to be a choice and not a replacement!


If it's just a choice then it's going to be a waste of time developing it to be honest.

Anyways...

This is my idea for the endless dungeon.

First of all to unlock it you need to get 4 keys doing the final boss of every act, you would need to have 5 NV for them to drop.

You finally found the 4 keys now you were able to unlock lvl 1 dungeon, you get to the end of dungeon lvl 1 and you see a door for the next dungeon lvl, the door says that you need to kill xxxx to find the key to open the next dungeon level.

Example: Dungeon 2 door/gate/portal tells you to find some specific gems in Act 2 and a key from some random boss in the same Act, it won't tell you which boss so you will want to kill all the boss's in Act 2 till you find the key. (still need 5 NV for the gems/stones/whatever and for the key)

Dungeon 5 door/gate/portal tells you to find some other random stones and a key from whatever act.

etc..

etc...

You get what I mean with unlocking the doors from the endless dungeon. This would mean that you would still be doing old content.

It would also be cool to find a rare mob in the category of 'Legendary' (with 5 affix or maybe special abilities like boss abilities?) that would have higher chances of dropping legendary items, it would be some kind of a mini boss. (not talking about it being at the end of each dungeon level, you would need to find him in each dungeon level so people wouldn't just try to rush to find the door to the next level. After killing it you won't see him anymore in that dungeon level anymore or maybe make it so it won't have the extra higher chances of dropping legendary item so you can still fight him if you want!)

Also make each dungeon level huge!

The higher the dungeon level the higher the difficulty (some confusion here, what I mean by difficulty would just be a slight increase of health and perhaps some white mobs sometimes having 1 random affix) and more mob density as well, also the higher dungeon lvl the better stuff you will find or more frequently.

We could also have some kind of reward that would unlock some kind of stuff?
help with some ideas here :)

this is what I have in mind...

lvl 5D increases movement speed by 2%
lvl 10D gives you 10 stat points that you could use wherever you want
lvl 15D increases pickup range by 2
lvl 20D increases movement speed by 2%
lvl 25D increases mf/gf/xp by 10%
lvl 30D reduces damage taken by 2%
lvl 35D increases movement speed by 2%
lvl 40D out of ideas
lvl 45D out of ideas
lvl 50D increases pagaron cap lvl by 10, gives you 15 stat points
....
....
....
lvl 100D increases damage by 5% increases attack speed by 5% increases movement speed by 4% increases paragon cap lvl by 10

If not stats maybe like some glowing enchants for our stuff. I don't know..

This is just some random ideas... this would make me excited about unlocking more stuff.

or....

just more MF/GF everytime you unlocked a new dungeon level.. but that would seem boring and not exciting... and MF/GF is never something that you are looking forward or excited of getting it.

PS. Sorry for my english :)
So, to get a little more clarification on this idea, what exactly is it you have in mind when you think about an Endless Dungeon? What is it that you would like to see or find in such a dungeon? And also, what kind of gameplay and goals would you want and aim for if you could play in an endless dungeon?

Well i guess that when you enter such a dungeon every new level of it, as u progress, should bring up better challenge for the players, followed by better rewards, and so on as u progress to the next level. Anyone ?
24/05/2013 15:44Posted by Gladiator
I think it would be tricky to implement an endless dungeon without making it an "Instead of" rather than an "As well as".


This kind of thinking is why the game is so bad.

''looks at how people ignore killing boss's and only farm trash''

We want something to look forward for when we are working on our characters. MP10 was never the answer.


Surely you don't think that blizzard would release an update which would render every other part of the game utterly pointless?
24/05/2013 15:50Posted by Chuckle!@#$


This kind of thinking is why the game is so bad.

''looks at how people ignore killing boss's and only farm trash''

We want something to look forward for when we are working on our characters. MP10 was never the answer.


Surely you don't think that blizzard would release an update which would render every other part of the game utterly pointless?


Edited my post, my idea won't make you ignore the other part of the game, it makes you do the other part of the game to keep unlocking new dungeon levels.
Endless Dungeon:
Random map generator, not necessarily underground/tower tilesets (since it's a magical place and all) so you can shuffle tilesets from all acts into it. Also mix mob types from all acts in maps (think d2 max difficulty baal dungeon).
Upon death the dungeon resets to lvl1.
Gets progressively harder (say, every 2/3/5 levels which correspond to 30m of gameplay the MP equivalent goes up by 1, unlimited).
MF/GF goes up along with the MP equivalent.
Every 10/15/25 levels which correspond to 150m of gameplay there's a treasure room (chests or goblins, goblins can get away so if someone rushes for the treasure rooms but doesn't have the damage he won't be guaranteed a reward).
Monster/elite density never more than an underfarmed region of the game so the goto place for quick farm runs is still in the acts.

Pretty much.

edit: Another idea and couple of points.
Idea part, could design levels of the dungeon with a goal oriented approach, eg an arena level where the goal is to kill all monsters and only then will the exit appear, or a winding pathways level where you need to click all switches etc. Treasure levels could have gatekeepers (incorporating the bosses idea from OP) leading into chests or the aforementioned treasure goblins to provide the barrier to rushers.
Also about hardcore characters, this would be the ultimate badge of honor. Died (level reached xxx is a record!). Max level characters in d2 used to have duels tournaments when they were about to retire (or they could ignore those and keep on farming, remember safe efficient farming would still be found in the regular acts more than the dungeon).
24/05/2013 15:57Posted by Gladiator
Edited my post, my idea won't make you ignore the other part of the game, it makes you do the other part of the game to keep unlocking new dungeon levels.


SUPERB IDEA!!!
Love it!

Randomise the requirements for each dungeon. Each dungeon has increasingly difficult requirements.
You have to play the normal game in order to progress in the endless dungeon.

Perhaps if a requirement is items that can drop, you CANNOT use items purchased from the AH. e.g. if a requirement is 1 rare spirit stone and 10 flawless ruby's, you cannot use the AH!

onto a winner here I think (in my opinion, of course ;))
I really don't like the idea of increasing the difficulty as you progress down the endless dungeon, especially as an HC player.

I see an endless dungeon as something I could go into on whatever MP I choose, like you do now, and just keep going til I need to quit.
If the difficulty ramped up, I'd get to a point I'm not comfortable doing, and have to quit and restart the game, and to me, that's the most horrible thing about this game, the need to quit and resume all the time.

However, adding increasingly difficult requirements to open a new level (or every 5 - every 1 level would get tedious very quickly unless the levels are HUGE) would be fine - just so long as the game remembers how many you've unlocked.
Some really cool ideas in this thread... I share interest in a lot of them too.

I remember in d1 when you first entered the cathedral and slowly progressed down intot the depths. I never thought it was going to end, and every 5 levels the theme changed a little and it got darker and more creepy the lower you got.

That had a brilliant feel to it! Obviously it did end, but it gave that great feeling of progression.

The endless dungeon (if added) in my view would need to have this progressive feel to it. As suggested before in this thread, it could get harder and harder as you get through every stage. I also think it should definitely go down and make it feel like we're progressing towards Hell itself.

It would only reset back to stage 1 when all party members had left the game. I can see some epic nights where you get together with 3 other friends and try to get as far through the endless dungeon as possible.

This should be a choice and just an addition to the current game we play. When there's more things to do it gives the game more legs to stand on. When we have a tough choice of what to do in the game each night it makes the game better and deeper.

i think adding one (random) of the old bosses every 15 levels or so would just give that extra bit of excitement too. Almost like finding loot, you don't know which boss you may be coming up to next.

Some secret random areas in the dungeons would be cool too. Something that makes us want to explore the caves, like opening a chest which opens a secret door to a bunch of treasure gobilns and their secret stash. (could be a once in a while event) and would make player want to open more chests in hope of finding something...

Stuff like that :P

As mentioned above by the dude with the name that might get banned :D you dont want to make the other parts of the game not worth playing... so how you go about this would require some kind of crazy board meeting you might have there :P edit: or go with Gladiators idea above
Challenge just like it was said on Archon's stream . Every level ahrder and ahrder I WANT TO KNOW HOW FAR CAN I GO .
What I'd like from an endless dungeon in one word: VARIETY

So, the status quo as it exists today is that every player knows in advance how the game will progress. Act 1, it's Woods, then Cemetery crypts for NV, then on to Woods and Fields for farming.

Act 2, it's Sewers, then Mines for NV, then onto the Oasis for farming.

Act 3 it's Keeps for NV, then onto Korsik, or Sin Hearts for farming.

With an endless dungeon, you'd hopefully have a nice mix of everything without the requisite NV buff farming before hand. Playing with the same idea of farming in mind, but not knowing what's going to be next, other than a general idea that each level is progressively more difficult. Since (for some silly reason) MF is capped, why not add a 1% MF/GF bonus to each level until it hits the cap? Note that this buff would be based on how many levels the actual character has completed, not how many the party has completed (to avoid abuse).
24/05/2013 14:37Posted by Ivan
Something like X hero siege in warcraft 3 is what i'd find fun. The idea could be combined with the endless dungeon, even why not an endless amount of mobs attacking you while you're protecting a building or some lore character? This is just something that struck me now and i'm not really expecting anything, but feel free to share your opinion about what you think about it :P

I like this idea.

There was also this other map in warcraft 3, the name i forgot, there'd be 4 straight lines for you and your opponents with waves of mobs coming out of them, becoming stronger each turn, and the side that would lose out first lost. Maybe a good idea to incorporate something like that, at least with the stream of mobs
What I would like from and endless dungeon would be... an end.

No, but really, let's imagine dungeon like we've already described, with special requirements to unlock each I dont know 20 floors, random secret locations as an incentive to explore, very slightly increasing in difficulty.

Now, what if it wasnt endless, but, don't know, 2000 floors deep, with something REALLY awesome at the bottom. A boss who would drop granted 5 legendaries and a special item, some sort of charm to greatly boost the character. Of course getting there would be nearly impossible and the boss himself would be damn hard, but I would love to strive to get there once =).
My suggestion more concretely. The motivation for it is the need for challenge and variation.

An NPC that´s there, just like the PvP NPC, which will appear in all acts at the base, who can portal you to an area, much like diablo´s realm, where waves after waves of a pack of 20 white mobs and 1 rare/champion pack appears, with a powered-up (hp + dmg * (0.1*wavecountnumber) = x% of normal in inferno difficulty) former or current boss appearing once every 10 waves.

We would be able to do this on all MP levels, scaling accordingly. It will provide difficulty for those who stick around beyond the "flow" state and want a challenge to refresh them, perhaps start a new game after they had a break, and reward: in the form of magic find increases scaling with a buff that increases by wave, perhaps NV scaling up to infinite, but only whilst in the dungeon.

Even the most insane geared would not be able to go past a certain level, for example 100.
There'd be a competitive element for players that crave it, without creating a ladder for them. Combined with the reduced droprates on legendaries, but higher qualities, that we're all looking forward to, I think I wouldn't log out anymore apart for my studies if this were implemented.

This will be a fun way to have fun with your friends, brag in your broadcasts how far you have gotten.. Awesome :D

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