Demon Hunter

08 Apr Demon Hunter - Vengeance Guide (Reference Tool) THIS GUIDE WILL BE UPDATED FOR FUTURE PATCHES - THIS GUIDE IS CURRENTLY OPTIMIZED FOR PATCH 7.1 This is a Simple Guide with only the most basic information. I will not go in-depth in the guide it self, but write it so it can be used as a reference sheet. Press CTRL+F and find the info you need! This guide is an adaption of Munkkys guides and is based off the Wowhead guide, MMO-C guide, Icy-Veins and the Vengeance Discord Channel Discussions. INDEX: - Stat Priority - Potions and enchants - Talents - BIS Gear List - BIS trinket list - Legendaries - Relic priority - Misc - References Stat Priority: We have 3 different stat priorities: ... POTIONS: Unbending for Survivability Prolonged Power for Trash Old War for Bosses ENCHANTS: Mark of the Heavy Hide for neck survival Mark of the Satyr for neck dps Binding of Versatility For rings - Raiding Binding of Mastery for rings - M+ Binding of Agility for cloak TALENTS: Level 99: Agonizing Flames will be the best for AoE and can be for ST. Level 100: Feast of Souls for Single Target, Fallout for AoE Survival (primarily in dungeons), Burning Alive for higher level Mythic+ Dungeons Level 102: Felblade for Learning/"surv", Flame Crash for DPS Level 104: Soul Rending is the go to, Feed the Demon can be used for Smoother Damage Taken, requires Fallout to max the benefit, Fracture is for ST DPS only Level 106: Quickened Sigils for Easier CC, Sigil of Chains for higher level dungeons/when it fits your group (this is a preference row) Concentrated Sigils for max DPS unless you have the Legendary bracers Level 108: Fel Devastation for Burst DPS/Burst Healing, Spirit Bomb for Smoother Healing and can be better for DPS if you feed into it. Level 110: Last Resort is the go to, Nether Bond for situational raid utility, and good for M+ with Necrotic , Soul Barrier extremely situational talent, only for when you have constant non spiky damage, ideally from multiple sources. BIS Gear list BIS Gear isnt a "thing" since they added War/titan forged. A general rule of thumb is to focus on main stats, but if a item is +10 ilevels, its better regardless of stats. This does not always apply for rings and necks. BIS List PRE-RAID Use this list to optimize your bonus rolls.  Kraken Hide Helm - Helya - Maw of Souls  Strand of the Stars - Advisor Melandrus - Court of Stars  Steelgazer Hide Mantle - Dargrul - Neltharion's Lair  Mainsail Cloak - King Deepbeard - Eye of Azshara  Tranquil Bough Vest - Archdruid Glaidalis - Darkheart Thicket  Compact Trifold Wristbands - Millificent Manastorm - Violet Hold  Guileful Intruder Handguards Patrol - Captain Gerdo - Court of Stars  Taut Halyard Waistband - King Deepbeard - Eye of Azshara  Warden's Martial Greaves - Cordana Felsong - Vault of the Wardens  Tunnel Trudger Footguards - Ivanyr - The Arcway  Band of Crystalline Bone - Shivermaw - Violet Hold  Braided Silver Ring - King Deepbeard - Eye of Azshara BIS List Emerald Nightmare  Cowl of Fright - Emeriss  Cursed Beartooth Necklace - Ursoc  Otherworldy Leather Mantle - Il'gynoth  Gossamer-Spun Greatcloak - Elerethe Renferal  Scarred Ragefang Chestpiece - Ursoc  Wristwraps of Broken Trust - Elerethe Renferal  Dreamsculptor's Gloves - Il'gynoth  Lifeless Buckled Girdle - Nythendra  Repulsive Leathery Pants - Xavius  Stained Maggot Squishers - Nythendra  Dreadful Cyclopean Signet - Il'gynoth  Mindrend Band - Ysondre BIS List Trials of Valor  Cowl of Fright - Emeriss  Sea Fan Pendant - Guarm  Otherworldy Leather Mantle - Il'gynoth  Mantle of the Victorious Dead - Odyn  Helbeast Skin Tunic - Guarm  Sky-Valiant's Wristguards - Odyn  Gloves of Issued Challenge - Odyn  Strand of Whelk Shells - Guarm  Sucker-Scarred Leggings - Guarm  Moccasins of Silent Passage - Guarm  Dreadful Cyclopean Signet - Il'gynoth  Mindrend Band - Ysondre BIS Trinkets Trinkets varie a LOT based on the use, and the stats. We have a wide assortment of trinkets, each with a good specific niche. A-Tier Darkmoon Card: Immortality Gnomeregan Auto-Blocker 601 (Will be nerfed in 7.1.5 - hotfixed dec. 6, change pending) Valor Medal of the First War (Will be nerfed in 7.1.5 - hotfixed dec. 6, change pending) B-Tier Bloodthirsty Instinct Unstable Arcanocrystal Shivermaw's Jawbone Majordomo's Dinner Bell C-Tier Grotesque Statuette (can be good with high ilevel on specific fights) Goblet of Nightmarish Ichor (Is B-tier in fights with high uptime) Coagulated Nightwell Residue Writhing Heart of Darkness Infernal Alchemist Stone Impenetrable Nerubian Husk Legendaries Legendaries can be seperated into two groups; best for raiding, and best for dungeons. Below they are listed for each; ranked BEST to WORST (Best first) Legendaries BiS list for Raiding Fragment of the Betrayer's Prison Cloak of Fel Flames Kirel Narak The Defiler's Lost Vambraces Prydaz, Xavaric's Magnum Opus Cinidaria, the Symbiote Sephuz's Secret Runemaster's Pauldrons Legendaries BiS list for Dungeons Fragment of the Betrayer's Prison Kirel Narak = The Defiler's Lost Vambraces Cloak of Fel Flames Sephuz's Secret Prydaz, Xavaric's Magnum Opus Cinidaria, the Symbiote Runemaster's Pauldrons Relic priority For relics, higher ilevel is ALWAYS the best choice. Only use the below list for EQUAL ILEVEL RELICS. Below is listed BEST to WORST, BEST first. For DPS: Aura of Pain (Single Target and AoE) Honed Warblades (Single Target) Fiery Demise (Single Target Burst) For Survivability: Devour Souls Embrace the Pain Aldrachi Design Will of the Illidari MISC Like i wrote first, this guide should be used as a reference tool; a quick "look up" for the most needed info. I will keep the guide updated in future patches. This post is based on guides by, and approved by Munkky. PATCH 7.1.5 is expected in January, with some small nerfs and big buffs. We can expect our Meta to be much stronger, making Fueled by Pain and Meta stronger, giving us space to choose other talents. Also adjustments to health, armor, 10% less physical dmg taken on base, and 10% less physical dmg mitigated with spikes among the changes. Weak Auras: Demonhunter Discord: The Fel Hammer: Maradum: Laste resort vs. Soul barrier argument: Feel Free to ask any questions below, ill do my best to reply to them all ASAP References and usefull links: Smørholm35 08 Apr
05 Apr Demon Hunter - Havoc in Legion 7.0.3 Welcome, To all new Demon Hunters! This Thread is purely related to Havoc speciliazation, Which is a melee dps Specialization. My intentions of this thread, is purely for all of you Demon Hunters, to take part, in the Demon Hunter Dps discussions, for the upcoming expansion. Many Thanks to all of the Beta Demon Hunter Testers, The people at Icyvein, and the people at other various of Demon Hunter sources :) Should you have more questions, you could Refer them to me, at my btag. Btag: Koukaiian#2509 ... 1.1 Stats Stat Weights Our current stat weights vary depending which final talent is selected. This means that you will likely have to run two sets of gear to be effective in all situations. If the choice is between two equal pieces the choice of the Fel Barrage piece will often be more beneficial, as pure single target encounters are far more rare than multi-target encounters. Chaos Blades ... Fel Barrage ... A more in-depth look at these weights can be found here. Please remember, your individual stat weights will vary. For optimal damage you will need to sim your own character. Gems and Enchants These will vary depending on your stat distribution. Crit will, in general, be a strong choice but diminishes in value if your haste or versatility lag too far behind crit or each other. For best results you should sim your character before gemming or enchanting in-game, as always. Food will follow the same pattern. Havoc Demon Hunters will use the Flask of the Seventh Demon and Potion of Deadly Grace.Stalliona44 05 Apr
1h Rate The Transmog Above You II Last post reached it's limit.Xávius19 1h
5h Warglaives of Azzinoth mog In my opinion, a DH that has the patience to farm BT week after week, and is lucky enough to get both of Illidan's warglaives, should have the option to unlock a hidden artifact look called the "Twin Blades of Azzinoth". Illidan's glaives, even after all these years, are still without debate the best looking weapon in the game. Why let such a nice design go to waste? Lorewise there is absolutely no reason to not let us have them. Azzinoth was just a random doomguard commander according to the lore, and the DH artifact is a much stronger weapon. Paladins get the corrupter Ashbringer skin, let us have the Twin Blades of Azzinoth.Inanis12 5h
11h Improving as a tank Hello I am "fairly" new to tanking. I was hoping for some more experienced dh tanks to check my logs and see How i Can improve :D 11h
14h Vengeance questions First: never before did proper tanking. I would be grateful for advice, to anyone who cares to offer it. I read skill tooltips and have rough idea how it all works - I've checked icyveins for talents. I want to start it because vengeance is simply better than havoc. After vengeance, havoc feels like potatomash. Like a summertrip. It's a little boring if we don't count vengeful retreat + felblade combo, but that's all the juice it has. It's like loose coffee, not strong enough. But vengeance is enjoyable and feels "rewarding". Is it possible to display aggro on nameplates or will it just come automatically? I would hope it shows all the time. Then there is keyboard buttons. Would be nice to get them a little close to my character wich camera centers on. If there is a way to avoid addons, that would be great because I dislike the idea of having manually to update them. As long as this can be roughly done that's perfectly fine. Anything else I should know about tanking? Thank you for your help in advance. (also I will probably play havoc too just for the looks, but in hopes of future glyphs and mechanics vengeance is the true road)Jacaru2 14h
17h How do you kill Hello my fellow demon hunters, How in godsname do you guys kill a paladin or a druid ? These guys are so hard to kill that the name godlike is fit for calling out how fast they kill me without any problems ? I know I had a pain killing them before with my rogue but even now with the demon hunter they just wreck in pvp ... Any tips would be appreciated. ThanksAyurox3 17h
1d Will you main DH next xpac under status quo? Will you main your demon hunter in the next expansion, If demon hunters stay as they are now? For the sake of the argument lets assume DHs lose the legendaries (cuz rng atm), but keep the first 51 artefact traits (cuz sorta guaranteed) I do not think I will unless blizz adds some more depth to our rotation, like adding armor penetration like skill(raw damage increase) or something like slice and dice (increasing fury generation). Cuz there are classes that are more attractive rotation wise when it comes to legendaryless dps.Miraeni28 1d
1d T21 changed. Eye beam increases haste by 40% now. The eye beam damage part is still awful though. Thoughts?Tahamine3 1d
1d Trash 4 pc bonus? A little confused here about Demonsbane; the 4 pc bonus works with SC, I thought DH's don't use SC, unless they need burst healing? And that SB was better in every instance almost. I'm facing the situation where I have the 2pc bonus, but also 910 gear and it's hard to say what's better, the stats of the bonus. If I get the 4pc, does SC become way better than SB? And which talent do I take then? Because all the top guides I've read said that SB is the way to go.Deseximia2 1d
2d Eye Beam Animation with the next patch Legion is out for a while now and yet the Eye Beam Animation is still broken. What I mean is the beam disappearing at around 25% channel time and reappearing at around 75% channel time. The damage still counts and everything, but the visual really bothers my. Since this is know for over a year now and eye beam will be a essential part for EVERY demon hunter with the next tier set, is there any chance to get this fixed at some point?Tisandria7 2d
2d T21 update ?? Demon Hunter (Forums) Overall - Haste increased, Mastery increased, Versatility increased, Critical Strike reduced. Felreaper Hood - Critical Strike changed to Mastery. Felreaper Spaulders - Mastery changed to Versatility. Felreaper Vest - Critical Strike changed to Versatility Felreaper Drape - Changed from Haste / Versatility to Critical Strike / Mastery. Felreaper Gloves - Mastery changed to Haste Death-Enveloping Cincture - Critical Strike changed to Haste Felreaper Leggings - Haste removed, Versatility reduced, Critical Strike increased. Depraved Machinist's Footpads - Mastery removed, Critical Strike increased, Haste increased. Sooo this is a good thing or am i going insane ?Fershie12 2d
2d T21 PTR changes worth it? Honestly the new t21 change seems quite alright and worthy of a 4 set after the haste bonus increase (to 40% after eye beam finishes casting, was 15%) for the following reasons: Let's consider 3-3-2-0-3-3-3 for a moment please. Eye beam invoques meta if demonic spec is used > 40% haste from tier + 25% haste from meta, that's a flat 65% haste for each eye beam cast (not counting bloodlust ofc). Easier to slide a couple of Demon's bite with all that haste without a huge negative impact on the overall dps if demonic appetite was specced, but that means there will be a bit of fury management instead of rng proc wait time. Meta itself resets the cooldown on eye beam if Demon reborn was specced. More haste > More Chaos strikes > More Soul Fragments > Less CD on eye beam, rinse and repeat. Haste seems to auto-cap itself, meaning that you will need much less haste and can now focus more on Crit, Mastery and Versa > more room for flat damage on gear itself for CS (C / M / V) and Eye beam (M / V) specifically. Overall I can currently maintain 58-60% meta uptime on dummy with 3-3-2-0-3-3-3 (Delusions of Grandeur and AotHG / 20% gear haste) and that will definitely increase with that drastic haste pump up. Trinkets with proc on attack and even ability usage such as infernal cinders and the new Pantheon agility trinket will now have more value. I am not a big fan of demonic spec and never was, but the latest change in the 4 set makes it seem to be worth it, and puts a bit of effort into DH rotation compared to what we have now. if equipped with 2 set from t20, blade dance CD is also affected by haste, meaning that you will have to give away the shoulders and go for Soul of the slayer ring perhaps for Chaos Cleave or Bloodlet, or even Cinidaria / Prydaz or whatever legendary of choice (but at the cost of the meta CD reduction and the extra eye beam from Demon reborn). All in all, this tweak seems reasonable and valid, especially that it puts into play a bit of effort in the rotation and cancels out one aspect of rng many people complained about.. (That was definitely not the case when it was 15% only) but now it's worth looking forward to, so we just have to wait and see with slightly higher expectations than before the change. Anyway, anyone is entitled to their opinion, so feel free to share with decency and reason. Thank you.Malicerose6 2d
3d Demon Bite / Felblade - Quality of life macro Small macro I experimented with and works its just a ease of use macro for felblade or Demons bite when only one is being used it will display and use that ability instead of having to swap around your action bars manually. Peace out ...Báráká6 3d
3d Give Demon Hunters a 3rd Spec The reasons given original about why Demon Hunters did not have a third spec was utterly ridiculous and a cop out, there are plenty of ideas out there that can give the Demon Hunter a unique 3rd spec, here a re a few ideas: 1.) 2 handed focused DPS 2.) Demon form Focused DPS 3.) Dot damage focused DPS These are only a few that i can think of just off the top of my head. My point being that leaving the Demon Hunter with only 2 spec makes it feel and literally looks incomplete. There are other classes with two DPS specs so there is zero reason not to give Demon Hunters one, stop being so lazy and treating your player base like a bunch of idiots. End pointless rant.Priamos50 3d
3d Help with dps Hi I have an issue with my dps. When I burst I can do 2m dmg. But when cds end I fall to 750k. I admit I always forget to use prolonged potion. Anyone has some info or something to fix to increase my dps? (In neck I use mark of the claw btw) Thanks in advanceMolismeni15 3d
3d new to Dh i am new with DH but one thing i want to know. how do u keep ur self alive as a DH Dps ? exempel i was questing in Stormheim with a friend whos also a DH. we did quest normaly the 3 wolfs in 102 attacked my friend BOOM got1 shooted by 3 wolfs 600k hp gone in 1 sec this wolfs was still 3 random wolfs. how hell areu supose to level up as DH when they are so qussy that 3 random wolfs can 1 shoot u ? :(Zaeda8 3d
3d Solo Nynth/Scorpy Havoc DH (dps) 7.3 When you see world first solo Gul'dan and get inspired to do something similar as a dps: It was a bit hard I'd say so hopefully it was worth the effort.Malicerose0 3d
4d Ideal stats %%% So what % should we be aiming for in an ideal world to be happy with? I’ve read previously that around 50-55% Crit but I’m not so sure about haste? I’m currently sat at 47% crit and 26% haste.. how much more should I be looking to push the haste?Izaleya4 4d
4d Does Demon Hunter Use Throw Glaive? As part of rotation? Or is it treated as Warriors Heroic Throw and basically just used for ranged threat/targeting?Deseximia9 4d
4d Twisting nether Unable to use Demon Hunter's class hall research Twisting Nether . I'm able to walk in and loot boss if someone else has summoned it. I can't summon the demon from there myself the stone to click just doesn't appear. Edit: summoned it once But i think it was a questThragohl0 4d
4d I just wanted to bring this to your attention. Here's a video showing, not only how utterly broken Demon Hunters are, but how they can be used in a bad and unfair manner. I do hope that you can put up some more path blockers here and there, because this is ridiculous...Frozdy10 4d
4d to DH or not to DH Hello all :) im struggling to decide wich class to play. Im looking for a clas/spec that ist "fast" to play, without a Boring 3 Button rotation or stuff like that and almost no downphases. The DH seems like a pretty cool class with many mobility ( also Important factor). My DH is only lvl 100 so i Cant Know if The points i mentioned above may be the case with The DH. So i hope you Guys can help me:) I think everyone here is having fun with bis DH But i dont Look for a subjective opinion. Is DH a fast paced class with a nice Rotation where you dont need just to Faceroll? If not i appreciate every class Suggestion that suits the points i mentioned. I want to Mainly Play pve Myth. + Dungeons and raid hc/myth. Thank you. PS: I like Tanking and dps. Wich way to Play Depends more on playstyle and Rotation etc.Gózul11 4d
5d Desire to make two DH's... You can make more than 1 Death Knight now, so do you think in the future you could make 2 Demon Hunters?Lilianne2 5d
6d Enlighten me, please. Heya, So last wednesday I was tanking Mythic Goroth, and the following happened: The tank got the molten armor debuff, so i taunted off of him. And at the exact same time, the boss 1-shot me. 8 Million damage. I've included the logs here: Is this some kind of bug, or did i miss sth debuff-related or sth? Thanks,Belzyr3 6d
13 Oct What about the leech stat? So, this might be a noobish question but I cant seem to find any solid information regarding how important leech is for us while tanking in PvE? My stat addons seems to rank it very highly but i dont find any information on the actuall importance/effect on any forums or wikis..?Stormbless3 13 Oct
12 Oct Crux of the Plan bugged As the title says, the quest "Crux of the Plan" is bugged as there is nobody to hand the quest into. A few other Demon Hunters on my Server are also not able to hand it in so I'm assuming this is some kind of bug that needs fixing.Lillidanx8 12 Oct
12 Oct Got em' Finally got em! I had like 6 characters each with one of the glaives. Some had main-hand, others had off-hand, but none had both. But now I finally got it! and not a moment too soon! Ready for BT timewalking next week!!!! GL to the rest farming warglaives!Artouz0 12 Oct
12 Oct Soul Fragments Spawn Locations - weird? Or intentional? This is my first time tanking with a non plate class and it's weird to me. The Soul Fragments spawn sometimes too far away to be picked up by Spirit Bomb. A lot of times I'll have 3 in range, but move slightly and it'll be 4-5. Is this intentional? Is a DH tank supposed to move around the whole time like that? Or am I missing something?Deseximia1 12 Oct
11 Oct Rate the Transmog Above You Well, since it exists in many forums, why not also for Demon Hunters? Rate the transmog of the poster above you from 0 to 10. Lord Illidan knows the way.Mudari500 11 Oct
11 Oct Need help, which item do i choose? Well, as the title says I have problem deciding which gloves are better for me - the gloves are either: iLvl 915 Gloves 1872 Agi 824 Crit 486 Vers 562 Leech with a socket in which i have a 200 Crit gem and iLvl 940 Gloves 2362 Agi 534 Haste 904 Mastery I've read somewhere at the beginning of this Expansion that using items with sub-optimal stats which are 15 iLvl higher than the current one you're using is always better - but I'm not sure whether that's true. I mean, it's 1000 Crit, right? Can someone tell me which gloves to pick, with a brief explanation preferably?Nilannil1 11 Oct
11 Oct Community: Judge My Demon Hunter Changes! First off i would like to say Hello to the demon hunter playerbase, and state that i am a relatively new member, but i feel the same problems that alot of Demon hunter players do. I have been giving quite alot of thought actually as to what i find fun and engaging about the spec and there is Quite alot. but the spec is definately not without its frustrations and faults. So i spent about a week thinking of ways to change the spec whilst keeping the class fantasy of it currently (which i think blizzard has done a fantastic job of designing) that may not make us top of the dps meter killing machines but would altleast make the spec fun and feel rewarding to play. Ill do my best to break this post down into specific problems and offer atleast 1 fix So ill get to it. Fury Generation I feel like this is the biggie for most Demon hunters and alot of mechanical problems stem from this core issue, such as *dead time* Due to the potentially bad RNG of Demon Blades which leads to a sense of helplessness is terms of your Damage potential, the feeling of ill do dps when the game allows it, a sense of feast of famine if you will, rather than making good use of your time and abilities relying on your own capabilities as a player, which then compounds to a feelings of frustrations and most importantly a limited enjoyment of the game/class. On other side of the same coin the overwhelming feeling of being utterly Global cooldown locked with Demons bite is also extremely punishing to the player and forces a high focus on the player to never miss the aformentioned global cooldown, whilst not having a feeling of being rewarded behind it as the spell currently doesnt *feel* good, again leading to Frustrations and feelings of being overworked (for lack of a better word). again leading to limited enjoyment. I spent about 3 days and about 5 hours a day (im completely serious here, i really have no life) thinking of a way to fix this issue, that would feel both rewarding and engaging to me as a player. Im not going to lie it was extremely hard to think of an answer to this that has some form of longevity to it. after quite a few ideas had been Typed up on the computer, i eventually came up with the following Idea set: Make Demon blades baseline in some itteration (Numbers would need to be tuned im sure, both damage and fury gain) Removal of Demons bite completely. Make Felblade the Baseline Generator in its current itteration, with one small change, a charge system of 2 charges. I feel with this set of changes fury generation would feel alot more smooth and controlled allowing players greater control over the spec and would feel more rewarding, as in my opinion this would be a middle ground between the 2 playstyles currently available. Where the frustrations and laggy playstyle of Demon blade's *dead time* fades out thanks to the second charge of Felblade and at the same time the feeling of feast or famine is also more controlled due to the steady flow of incoming Fury when combined with, for example Demonic appetite i feel as thought the days of throw glaive on single target would pass us by. Also the feeling of Being global locked into Demons bite would be a thing of the past and you would have much more breathing room without knowing that said breathing room has cost you potential damage gains. Finally these changes would also open room for 2 new talents to help flesh out Havoc Demon hunters in areas they dont feel completely fulfilled. Eye Beam Ok so this one will probably catch a few people off guard. So "whats wrong with eye beam?", and that would be a completely fair thing to say eye currently does its job as a burst aoe cooldown (talking about the theme of the ability not its damage). Well my issue with eye beam is not so much an issue but more of a sense of a missed opportunity to add more excitement to havoc demon hunters as lets be fair wether your think the spell is amazing or a waste of a global cooldown in terms of damage it is an iconic havoc ability that seems wasted to be used purely on AoE. So after some thought i came up with the idea make Eye beam a High damage nuke that splits damage across all targets hit (in the same fashion as the of Terror from Below trinket) with a Minor change of adding a Debuff to the target called Fel radiation which causes the target to pulse for x seconds dealing damage to all targets within x amount of yards The change would mean that Eye beam would be both useable in Single target outside of just to proc demonic and would in my opinion feel both Exciting and it would still retain the purpose of a Burst AoE spell, which in turn also adds a level of thought to the spell should i use eye beam now? should i wait for the adds to spawn? will the adds live long enough for fel radiation and anguish of the deciever to do more damage than it would on single target? Chaos Strike/Annihilation So this isnt a massive deal to alot of people, and nor to myself either but i still believe that this spell offers to much variance due to the 20 fury refunded on crit mechanic, im torn on this spell on one hand i like it alot due to when your do get the almighty crit streak there is very little in the game that makes you feel more like a god but on the other hand when you dont it just feels awful and actually quite stressful so i think my change to this would be simple Reduce the cost of chaos strike to 30 fury and crits refund 10 fury this in my opinion would still offer the moment of glory the crit chain can offer while being much less punishing and stressful if RNG is just not with you. Blade Dance Blade dance is a visually pleasing spell to use and feels good doing so. you may ask why i think there needs to be a change to blade dance its fine and yes again completely right currently its fine but again i gave some though as to how i would improve it if i could and i came up with this idea Blade Dance would now be a higher cost but would have no cooldown as its base ability (again numbers would need to be tuned). this change i feel would give demon hunters a consistant aoe option should they wish it. Whilst changing the First blood talent to reduce its cost considerably and adding a 10 second cooldown alongside increasing its damage as it does currently on live Chaos Blades Chaos blades is a talent that feels like a must have, and feels actually horrible to play without esspecially when a situation arises that ST priority damage is Key, which is quite sad as the spell is well quite frankly boring and is just a % damage increase which causes quite a Redundant choice on the Final talent tier (ST = Chaos Blades AoE = Demonic/Fel barrrage, which is a shame because i truely believe that this is the tier where the most miss opportunities lies as i will get into shortly. So a simple change to this spell. and i believe it should have happend long ago Chaos Blades is now a baseline passive effect you gain during metamorphasis.(again numbers to be tuned accordingly) And finally for my personal favorite ideas and i am truely sad that they will probably never make it into the game Tier 110 Talent Row Ok so this row is a wierd one for me because in my opinion it just doesnt make sense outside of demonic. that being we are demon hunters and the best thing about being a demon hunter is the fact that we are part demon and can embrace it fully and become a Demonic fel crazied merciless killing machine and the only talent that even remotely accentuates that is demonic. So to add class fantasy i have came up with 2 new talents for this row whilst leaving demonic well alone because that talent is a very good idea in its current form Demon Realised You fully embrace the demon within you allowing it to consume you completely realising the full Fury and Power it holds a new talent that would further augment metamorphasis but increasing Crit Strike Damage by X% as well and giving Demon blades a 100% proc chance for the duration (With an increased amount of fury gain numbers depending) Demonic union You form a union with the demonic pressence within you granting you unrivaled power a new talent that replaces Metamorphasis with a spell called Demonic union (works the same way as Grimore of service but a permanent buff) allowing you to permanetly augment Chaos strike or Blade dance to its demonic counter part Annihilation or Death sweep aswell as increasing all damage done by x% (numbers to be tuned accordingly) These are a few of my current Idea for Havoc demon hunters with a fair few more in progress, which i may post if the reception of this goes well and there is some desire from the community to hear the ideas of a no life gamer such as myself anyway if you have read this far, know that i truely appreciate it and please feel free to leave your thoughts in the comment section but please keep it civil as i want this thread to be a serious thread dedicated to making the Havoc DH the best and most fun it can possibly be. Thanks!Xieria3 11 Oct
10 Oct A comprehensive guide to fixing Havoc To start off: What is wrong with Havoc? It may sound a bit hyperbolic, but I think it is safe to say that Havoc has the worst RNG in wow history. Allow me to explain before you post angry rebuttals. It may not be the worst from a purely numbers perspective, (looking at 7.2.5 Elemental aoe 75x multiplicative variance, possible other candidates.) it is definitely a contender for the worst RNG from a design perspective. There are two main culprits here: Demon's Bite and Demon Blades. Demon's Bite is a feel-bad button, a low damage Chaos Strike that you press when you can't press Chaos Strike. Even if the philosophy of Havoc is to be low skill entry point and high skill ceiling, there currently is never a situation where you do not press Chaos Strike if you can afford to use Chaos Strike. Pooling up fury to get more Chaos Strikes does not invalidate my argument. We do have some cds but they too are hit on cd, so not much more complexity there. Demon Blades is a terrible talent, a contender for worst talent that is not a simple +5% damage talent. Demon's Bite is simply such a feel-bad button that many would rather deal with all the issues of Demon Blades. These issues being: You end up having 1 worthwile damage ability in baseline and even when you take other abilities in the talent tree to combat this, you still end up with periods of up to 15 seconds where you simply cannot press any damage abiltity. All because of the way Demon Blades is designed. (For those who don't know: Auto-attacks have a chance of giving fury) So now that the main issues of the spec are clear, some suggestions on how to "fix" it. These are me just giving some things I came up with so feedback is much appreciated and hopefully we can use my examples to figure out what the Havoc community would want/like at which point feel free to give your own suggestions, possibly in a new, seperate thread. Fix nr 1: Demonic Baseline Make Demonic and Blind Fury baseline. In the place of Blind Fury we can have a talent that makes it so casting Eye Beam during meta extends meta. Only limited by how many times you manage to cast Eye Beam; the mini-game is now to see how long you can stay in meta. As a part of this fix we also make it so that meta form improves Demon's Bite to give 70 fury (at this point I'll mention that all my numbers are, effectively, placeholders) Demon Blades is changed to be a talent where you remove the chance to miss and every auto-attack generates 5 fury. In the place of Demonic on the talent tree we place Meta as it is now. 5 min cs 30 second duration. If needed switch Meta and the new Demon Blades around. Fix nr 2: New and improved Demon's Bite So currently Demon's Bite is never any fun to press, let's change that. Rather than simply making it a more reliable fury generator, making us even more like budget Fury Warriors, I think it's better to make the spell more interesting in other ways. For the change that I am suggesting we also introduce a new spell: Consumption. Consumption infect the target with a fel-curse that builds up stacks of Consumption over time. Let's say it builds 30 stacks over 15 seconds. Can be multi-dotted making it decent for both boss fights and clearing trash. The new Demon's Bite is now on a 10 second cooldown and instead of giving your enemy a love-tap with your Warglaive, you now transfrom into meta briefly, the same way that Chaos Nova does, and you take a bite out of your target, consuming all stacks of Consumption within 10 yrd range. Doing damage based on the amount of stacks, but more importanly, giving 3 fury per stack. Demon Blades is now also baseline, but numbers may have to be tweaked. The aim of this fix is to make it so you have a reliable way to quickly pool up fury for your bust phases, or so you have a reliable refill during your Annihilation spam, since Meta benefits greatly from already having =>100 fury. Fix nr 3: Dot-proc Somewhat similar to the above suggestion, we need a new spell to be introduced into the baseline. This could be done by making Blootlet baseline, but it could also be my new ability, or something like it. My new ability would be: Curse of the Illidari. You inflict a curse upon the target that deals Chaos damage over time. I'm not sure what numbers would work here, but the idea behind is more important as numbers can be tweaked easily. The curse lasts 24 seconds and does a low amount of damage every 3 seconds, every tick has a chance make Chaos Strikes have no costs. After 24 seconds the Curse will explode for extra damage based on the amount of Chaos damage dealt within the 24 seconds. Aside from just giving us extra things to press, I think that this spell would fit in well just based on Class fantasy. It also helps reduce our downtime by having a chance to give random free Chaos Strikes and the dot combined with the explosion bases on Chaos damage dealt during the duration would help reduce the dps loss when RNGesus is not with you. Then finally, fix nr 4: Momentum I just want to say that I think momentum is, once more, a terrible talent from a design perspective, but for those who like it, I'll try to give a suggestion on how to make it workable. The main reason for Momentum being terrible is that is brings you out of position, causing a dps loss, and potentially putting you into fire or other high damage, boss related spells and effects. My fix would be quite simple, Demon's Bite reduces the cooldown of Vengeful Retreat by 3 seconds, if Demon Blades are chosen all your auto-attacks(including those that do not proc Demon Blades) reduce the cd by 0.2 seconds. This would give you the playstyle of Momentum while also making sure you can get right back into the fight. In case you missed it earlier, all of my numbers are placeholders, meaning that if you think it would be too op, we can simply change the numbers. I put some real thought into all of these suggestions, moreso from the perspective of game design and engaging gameplay than how much damage you will gain or lose. Therefore, I would like it if you overlook the small details and give opinions on what you would like to see purely from a perspective of what would be fun to you, what you think would fit into our actionbar without being too clunky, etc rather than giving criticisms such as it would be too op or too weak. If (one of) the changes are well received however, we will most likely need theory crafters in here to give us and Blizzard an idea of what would be needed to make these ideas work. Final note: As also mentioned in the introduction, the discussion on what we want is more important than choosing one of my suggestions, but for this thread I would like to at the very least use my suggestions as a framework. For you this means that if there is interest in this kind of discussion, I would rather create another, seperate thread where everyone can come up with their own ideas for spells old and new, and keep this thread on-topic. Also, I realise that this thread may be a bit difficult to read, but I am not too familiar with Blizzard's forum formatting, so thank you for muscling through despite the poor legibility of the thread.Kalai10 10 Oct
10 Oct 2 Demon Hunter on the same realm I would like to start a nightelf girl dh aswell, but i cant. Why? I love this new class so much, i would like to play pvp on my own realm, since i play on ragnaros since Wotlk. Please Blizzard, let us make another dh on the opposite faction.Harkafury4 10 Oct
09 Oct Spirit Bomb vs Soul Cleave If I am using SB, does it take priority over Soul Cleave? I am Vengeance specc'd.Deseximia3 09 Oct
08 Oct t20 4p question hey, is the 4p t20 really worth using? eg if i instead got 2 items with higher ilvl or better stats what should i priotize?Feeran6 08 Oct
08 Oct Chaotic Onslaught question Hey all, Does anyone know when chaotic onslaught procs, does the animation recast it's self as if you were gonna cast chaos strike 2 times or does it just show 4 hits instead of 2? And can chaotic onslaught proc of chaotic onslaught so that you would get like 6 hits? Probbaly really bad written but that's the best i can come up with. So yeah please help me out guys.Alëêex2 08 Oct
08 Oct How to get the Iron Warden Appearence for Vengeance DHs 1. You need the "Twisting Nether" Advancment, you can get it at Loramus Thalipedes. It takes 1 day to be done. 2. Click on the Fel Crystal next to Loramus. After that, click on the Book, it will spawn a demon, it's soloable if you have some better armor than questing armor. 3. Loot it, you have a chance to get "Bulwark of the Iron Warden" right click it, then you get it!Mathhunter0 08 Oct
08 Oct Demon flight So i was wondering why we don’t have our demon wings to fly with ?, why can’t we just fly with those wings ? I was talking to a couple of friends today who also play Wow and i asked: “Would you like Demon hunters to fly with their wings ?” they said of course that would be awesome and it would also be badass and i said demon hunters are badass but you can make them even more badass by adding their wings to fly with. So i went to some ideas like in pvp we have a honor talent that is called “Rain from Above” and there they are kind of flying but also falling down at the same time, yesterday i was doing a pvp match and i used that talent and just a few seconds the match was over and i clicked away the scoreboard and saw my Demon Hunter flying/hovering but still at the same position without falling down or going up he was like Illidan at the black Temple hovering in the sky and waiting for the flames of Azzinoth to be defeated, i kinda liked that moment then i went thinking about that idea, us been flying in the sky as our demon form or just us with our wings, it's kinda special because people can have different wings because of the glyphs they use. And i’m probably not the first one that asks this but please add it so many people will love it, many people will come back as their demon hunter again, when Legion came out thousand of people played as a demon hunter and i’ve talked to a lot of them and they said they would love it to fly with those wings. incase you don’t want to accept it because of the big thing you will need to add i have some suggestions -a mount (you will find it by your mounts in your collections) -an ability (like the worgens you can activate “running wild”.) -or you can change the “glide” thing when your in areas that you can’t fly you will hover and when you can fly just double jump and you can fly -animation - i had an idea if you choose the night elf with wings so if you land to put your wings at your back if you use it as a mount (link to picture) - and if you do the demon form as a mount here is what it should look like when you kinda fly (link to picture) I hope you will do it and i bet i'm not the only oneIllnathar7 08 Oct
08 Oct Havoc hidden artifact Hello there i need some help how do i get the charm ive tried to farm those trapper mobs that has the highest drop yet nothing dropped any specific location needed or mob?Impêrius1 08 Oct
07 Oct BiS legendaries for Vengeance What are considered the BiS legendaries for Vengeance? Some say the archimonde trinket + belt.Terajo13 07 Oct
07 Oct DEEPS So with my current setup, im averaging around 700k-900k dps sustained, and my burst is somewhere up around the 1.5-1.8mil mark. quite surprised i am hitting those numbers on demonic build with cascading eyes and delusions legendaries. I seem to have horrible luck with gear drops and i SWEAR RNG gods hate me and want me to have MOUNTAINS of mastery and Versatility. Is it too much to ask for 45%-ish crit chance? :'( Tried switching to demon blades, chaos blades etc but i found it to be laughable in terms of "i'll just sit here till felblade is off CD" MUCH preferring the demonic way of playing, and i needs me some of that tasty demonic-buffing tier set :D also nothing like hitting 5 mil + in aoe fights :DIthilean6 07 Oct
07 Oct RNG getting sic of master and no crit on gear upgrades. i DO NOT need 38% mastery -_-Ithilean3 07 Oct
06 Oct What have you done? Class Fantasy Before I start off, I would like to ask a question to my fellow Demon Hunters. How many of you were Demonology Warlocks before DH was released? Personally, I have always wanted to play DH, but it was not there so I played a Warlock to get the "fantasy". Mostly Destro until they released Glyph of Demon Hunting, which was not competetive at all, but was fun. Then played Demo during WoD, which I think was an amazing spec to play. Basically what I am trying to ask is, would you like to see old spells or mechanics that were once a part of Demonology added to DH? I like DH as it is now (playing Havoc) but I also feel that it is a bit weak on the "fantasy" side of things. Unless I am playing the Demonic build it's like I am playing a fury warrior with some new effects. Would you guys be in favor of for example the WoD Demo system of building Demonic Fury? What are your suggestions for getting the "feeling" of playing a DH? Also, lastly, a quick poll. Would having Demon's Bite give 30 fury always make you want to consider it? Or is everyone just sick of the thing and would you much prefer a replacement next patch/expansion or possibly you just like autoattacking for RNGesus? Let me know your opinions, let's get a conversation started. Also, also, what have you done?Kalai13 06 Oct
05 Oct Xylem Challange problem Hello, when I do "Xylem Challenge" on the final stage my boss does not behave like this movie: When this seed of darknes is released in me, I run away, the addies that heal him, but the boss is still running behind me casting this skill, even after 2-3 seconds I started to run the boss so it behaves itself, that is running from me This lasser, addy respirates underneath it because it is all time behind me and I can not kill those adds, please help, it is very frustrating. (Ao4 05 Oct
05 Oct DH Felblade Demon's Bite macro Hey guys i need your help. So i wanna hve a macro to cast Felblade whenever this is up and for whatever reason i want to have Demon's Bite too (which i don't but for testing builds) How can i put this on one button?Bebz7 05 Oct
05 Oct Havoc Hidden Artifact Skin! Hey im trying to get the Havoc Hidden Artifact Skin,but when i fly to the tower at suramar the bat isint there,am i missing someting or is this bugged out?Ðemoni11 05 Oct
04 Oct Will we have some changes this expansion as havoc? Hello! I would really like to know if we will get some changes for the last raid of this expansion, or if we will just stay as we are. I saw ptr changes but there was nothing for dh havoc. I don't really care if we get buffs or not but I just want to know it!. Thanks in advance!Reinhartdh1 04 Oct
04 Oct Xylem Broken affffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff Or maybe I just suck but Xylem broke AF doeDarendil14 04 Oct
03 Oct Vengeance secret artifact Do I need to be lv 110 for the skin to drop?Amatar1 03 Oct