Classic Discussion

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1h Which version of Alterac Valley do you want? 1.5: - AV was added. 1.6: - Some balancing changes. - Respawn for tower guards greatly increased. 1.8: - Mark of Honor was added. - Minimum number of players dropped to 20. - Graveyards and capture points changed to different locations. - Terrain changes, most notably the entire western and eastern segments have been removed (including a lot of the NPCs). - Korrak moved to Snowfall Graveyard. - NPC power reduced by 15-30%. 1.10: - Korrak removed. 1.11: - Most of the NPC guards removed. - Remaining creatures got their HP reduced. As far as I see it there are two possibilities for the patch cycle: start and stay with 1.12 or progress from somewhere before. But it would still come to 1.12 at some point. And then you'd be stuck with the AV from that patch. And I'm pretty sure what most people remember is the AV from before 1.10. So, what version do you want? Should it just progress and then stay at 1.12? Should the 1.8 - 1.11 changes never happen?Soeliah24 1h
2h A reminder: WOW classic is classic So, recently a article has been posted about the progress on WOW classic, and I'd feel it would be good to clear somethings up. The article can be found here: So, let's get into it. How they are delivering the 'authentic' classic experience According to the text, they are simply upgrading the code that was used for patch 1.12 to the code that they are using today, and then editing it so it fits around their security and Anti-Cheat systems they currently use, as well as This essentially means NO CHANGES WHAT SO EVER including animations, character models etc. This is how they have chosen to do it, and I'm very happy they have chosen this path. So if you keep asking, "Ooo, will they add *thing* into classic wow? Answer will always be no. What version will be used? It has been confirmed that they will start with 1.12 as a base, and move from there which is good choice. The article does not say about if all raids will be unlocked from the word go, but if they are it would be disappointing. We will have to see in the future. Why would just converting code take that long? Consider the simple fact that WOW is a massive game, even for classic. For each place, quest, action etc; a line of code must be converted. That's your answer. If you wish to ask me anything else about this, then please ask, because I have gone through the text too many times for my own good.Pandariea9 2h
3h Addons in classic I remember back in classic we had very limited amount of addons available unlike now (even on private servers and retail ofc), what do you think about restricting certain addons as they pretty much trivialize most of the raids etc. Yeah I know MC and BWL are just tank and spank anyways and pose no real difficulty but still addons make AQ40 and Naxx really really easy compared to their original version (not just addons, experience and knowing tactics beforehand helps a lot too ofc) Personally I would be happy if they didn't allow addons at all or only addons that modify your UI but I know that would never happen. Also before you crucify me I'm not demanding that they should do it this way or anything I just had this thought while playing my vanilla char for a while with no addons at all finding quest mobs myself and stuff and I'm just genuinely curious about people's opinions on this.Rngzus71 3h
3h Alliance or Horde So yeah, I don't want to start an argument for change or no change as it was already stated that the final goal is "no change". It was always on my mind that most classes had the best combination with alliance race for PvE. and for raiding somewhat a paladin was always better than shaman, as they eventually were compared to priests as best healers, while shamans were mediocre towards the end game. For example Fear ward for dwarf priests, or 5% spirit for human priests, 5% int for casters if you were a gnome. for leveling every time I played on alliance side I never felt like I was stuck without quests or that I had to just grind mobs without having a quest at the same time, while on horde, I had times when I was at a level with no quests to take and had to just kill mobs for 2-5 levels just to be able to get quests. So what's your opinion on this? (sorry for bad english)Feralt14 3h
4h Time is going too slow, what to play? In my waiting time i have played some games -Rift - came to lv 65 awful and boring -Tera - Weird UI, grindy end content with no tactics or visible boss mechanics -Rocket League - Goalkeeper is something like, a god, we could really use one but nobody is there, and i'm really tired of being one -Zomboid - Boring solo - Retail wow - I can't any more it's just cliche and boring, wow died when they split up the barrens What are you guys playing while you wait for classic? God knows i'm not gonna play retail, there are no more good MMO's and private servers are a time spent waisted SOOOO what are you guys playing? EDIT : Thank you guys for suggestions, i have filled my playlist, next for me while i wait is Grand ages : Medieval Styx master of shadows Settlers 7 You can keep throwing suggestions, i like your guys tastesLifemetall41 4h
5h No mercy for casuals I can't believe Blizz is starting from patch 1.12. I was hoping that we had the real bare bones no safety net version of WoW where casuals would be slayed on the spot the moment they stepped out of their starting zones. So after 10 years of thought Blizzard has developed something known as empathy. Sod that, I don't want any of that! I want to see bones of low level players scattered outside the Deadmines instance entrance and Paladins worshipped for the healing machines they are. No cookies for PvE Rets though. WoW Classic should be modelled around the social no-lifer principles that state that you must have absolutely no life what so ever to get ahead in Vanilla. Anything else is just casual appeasement. No troll honest. But why is it that casuals always want medals?Whoopy10 5h
5h Suggestion: Seasons in WoW Classic. 2 types of servers: 1- season- limited time realm that last up to 1 year. This will allow ppl to create seasonal World Races. After every season characters will be moved to non-season server. 2- non-season- realm for less hardcore players. It will be up from the beginning of season 1 until the end of WoW Classic life. This one will help less hardcore players to achieve their first kill of Kel'Thuzad without a time limit :)Nalía16 5h
5h Strat, Scholo, LBRS and BRD 5 or 10 man?? pre nurf they where 10 men had more mobs and the mobs did more damage and correct me if i'm wrong UBRS was 15 man and to do a full run was way more of a challenge and took longer i would love them to be 10 men again even if the reward isn't that great so what do you guy's think ??Soeliah18 5h
5h Wow token on classic Howdy, now we know blizz is adding universal features such as integration and cross realm battlegrounds, I’m wondering whether we’ll see the wow token on classic. I think it would be great if I could exchange some spare € for a bit of gold on classic. Would be a great move by blizz and I would be more than happy for that feature (I’m against xmog and zone shards, but this is merely a feature that allows redistribution of ingame currency) What do you think? CheersHállow68 5h
5h imho, how it will or should be hello everyone. since the news a few days ago, it was stated that they would go with the 1.12.1 foundation (as expected). while i wouldn't have been against a 1.1 true form, i think is the best for the whole vanilla game to be at 1.12. since over the course of vanilla they polished a lot of the bad edges in the game. plus this approach will make sure we will be able to play before 2020. So now that we know approximately what we will get on the technical side, we should talk about some details. Imho what should happen: basically, also what I personally think that will happen. The game will/should run with the 1.12 talents and items. But with the gated content like raids and dungeons obviously. And this will/should be the basis of the game. Now we come to the details… for me the points worth talking about are: - Debuffslots - Crossrealm bg's (battlegroups) - Quest gating - Raid adapting - Faction balance - Dynamic respawn I hope de debuffslots will be integrated as they were back then. (augmentation with a gated content patch) This is one thing I hope they won't implement as it was in vanilla. Keep this away… Over the course of classic there are many quests that got patched in. I am hoping blizzard will implement the quests that are not related to any major content from the get go. But to be honest, either way it's no deal breaker. Just a thing that makes the game look more finished, alive and deep. Since my guess would be that the items will also be on a 1.12 basis, I am hoping for a little tweak on the raid and dungeon side of the game. no major thing. My guess would be in a 10-15% range of the basis, just to make it feel a bit more authentic. Bcause at the end, what matters is how the game feels. I don’t give a s**t if Rag has 1billion health or 1.15 billion (I know he didn’t have that much). As long as the encounter feels like back then. The faction balance is something I don’t really know how to address, but I hope they find some sort of technical solution in order to balance the servers from the get go. Like faction gating or whatever. Idk… I know a lot are against dynamic respawn, but to be honest I think it is a very good implementation. Especially for the sake of recreating the vanilla and not the launch experience as brack stated. What do you guys think, what points do you think that are realistically still not given are worth picking up and talk about? Cheers PS: thanks for the Update Blizzard. I really hope we will be able to play that masterpiece soon? Maybe q1-2 2019? ^^Sellina16 5h
5h Classic Honor System needs a rework/tweaking. I for one hope they do change or at least tweak the old system. The system was totally unfair, you just had to be lucky to play on a realm with little competition to get an "easy" rank 14. I originally intended to go for it, but after 3 months of 14-16 hours/day in WSG premades (and winning 90% of the time) I barely made it to rank 10. I was grinding 800.000 honor/week and that barely put me in the top 10 (top player on my realm's faction was sitting at 1.6 MILLION honor/week) I've seen and spoken to rank 14 players who got there in the same timeframe with less than half that time spent & the honor I was grinding. They were just lucky to play on a realm with little competition. The only thing the old system promotes & rewards is having absolutely no life whatsoever, doing the same repetitive thing over and over until you're completely burned out or share your account with multiple people. And yes, at least half of the top 10 characters on my server's faction back then were online 24/7 with 2 sometimes even 3 people playing said characters. All of them being in my old PvP guild at the time. I also played in a top 10 world PvE guild in vanilla (pre-Naxx, we lost our spot in the top 10 cause we didn't clear Naxx as fast as we wanted) and eventhough you had to invest about 3-4 hours/day farming for consumables, the time invested in PvE was far more rewarding, doing something that was far more challenging with a lot less time invested. All in all I think the old honor system is a flawed system and needs a serious rework or at least some major tweaking. Other than that and maybe a few quality of life improvements (such as removing the limit of debuff slots on bosses) I'm all for Classic WoW.Mórtred18 5h
5h Sad news on classic update We just recieved updates on classic wow. Unfortunately it's not all good and while loving the fact we got some news before blizzcon, then i can't say i'm that happy with it. it is still a bit uncertain what will happened and here's a few indicators blizzard quote: After careful consideration, we decided on Patch 1.12: Drums of War as our foundation, because it represents the most complete version of the classic experience. In the mentioned patch, Cross realm battlegrounds were introduced, this mean we might see a possible crossrealm function for battlegrounds, which is sad imo. It is also sad, that we wont be seeing talent tree progressions, as these talents, made hell of a dps increase for many classes, too op for early content. Lets hope they scale the health and damage of bosses accordingly to above mentioned. Will we get to see the AQ40 event? Will we have full access to all raids early? a lot of bad things, may accour, and i dont believe this "clarification" is a clarification after all. It leaves us with tons of questions more to ask, and frustration tbh. However, Thanks blizzard never the less, for reaching out and speaking about what's going on. that's atleast somethingÐaxtar63 5h
8h Will Classic have RP servers? Has Blizzard commented on this, yes or no?Yue7 8h
8h Classic Patch 1.1.2 Just wondered whether Blizzard will be starting classic from Patch 1.1.2 and rolling out later patches in the same time frame to give players the authentic experience that I and many other veterans where part of almost 14 years ago in December 2004 (EU release). Anyone know the plan?Whoopy40 8h
9h To the Azjol-Nerub players in Vanilla Just wanted to start this topic to see who's still here, and who'll be returning in Classic. Seeing Alliance guilds such as R.A.G.E, Scion of Darkness, The SnakeEyes, The Outkasts,Keepers Of Azeroth, Valhall, among others return would be quite fun EDIT : created a discord for AN 9h
11h Things you never did in Vanilla.... Just idle curiousity for the heck of it. Are there any things you never did on any of your characters back in Vanilla, but wish you had done? Do you plan to remedy this once Classic is released? I never did any of the following: - Did a low level BG. I waited until I was level capped. - Did the Gurubushi Arena - Did the Wintersaber Trainers grind for the mount. - Got exalted with Timbermaw Hold - Downed a world boss - Rolled an undead character - Did the STV fishing competition - Participated in the Opening of AQ Gates event (was only around L20 when it happened on my server)Grupp42 11h
11h New Vanilla information? "After careful consideration, we decided on Patch 1.12: Drums of War as our foundation, because it represents the most complete version of the classic experience." I dunno if that means 1.12 talents and systems like BGs with progressive patches or just flat 1.12. There is a massive difference. EDIT: Posted it here for everyone as per request. Greetings! Development of World of Warcraft Classic is underway, and we’re very excited to share some of the challenges and solutions we’re working on. As we mentioned last BlizzCon, the process of restoring the classic game is not straightforward, and it’s important to us to take the time and effort to get it right—this includes poring over numerous game versions, data, and code; meticulously scrutinizing all the changes we’ve made over the years. Rest assured: The WoW Classic team is hard at work making it a reality, and we’re at a point in development where we’re ready to share some of the things we’ve been working on. WoW Classic: First Prototype The first—and among the most important—decision we had to make was which version of the game to focus on. As many of you have noted, the classic period was two years long and full of changes. Core features like Battlegrounds were introduced in patches after WoW’s original launch, and class design similarly changed over time. After careful consideration, we decided on Patch 1.12: Drums of War as our foundation, because it represents the most complete version of the classic experience. Once we had our starting point, we began taking stock of what we had in the source code and what we could make available, which included restoring the original development database from archival backups. After stitching various key pieces together, we had a locally rebuilt version of Patch 1.12 running internally. The team could create characters and do basic questing and leveling—and dying, which we did many times. For testing purposes. Obviously. Our initial runs exposed a few (expected) issues: the game sometimes crashed, didn’t recognize our modern video cards, and was incompatible with our current login system. That first pass also couldn’t support any of our modern security and anti-cheating capabilities. Clearly we had a lot of work to do to make WoW Classic live up to the Blizzard standard of quality, and deliver the experience players want. The Path Forward: Second Prototype Speaking of engineering, World of Warcraft is a very data-driven game, which means the basic code is flexible and the specific way it behaves is controlled by information contained in databases. Things like quests, monsters, items, and the rules for how these all interact are defined by the designers and artists in data. So we asked ourselves, would it still be possible to deliver an authentic classic experience if we took our modern code, with all its back-end improvements and changes, and used it to process the Patch 1.12 game data? While that might seem counterintuitive, this would inherently include classic systems like skill ranks, old quests and terrain, talents, and so on, while later features like Transmog and Achievements would effectively not exist because they were entirely absent from the data. After weeks of R&D, experimentation, and prototyping, we were confident we could deliver the classic WoW content and gameplay without sacrificing the literally millions of hours put in to back-end development over the past 13 years. While our initial effort helped us determine the experience we wanted to provide, this second prototype really defined how we’d get there. Starting from a modern architecture—with all its security and stability changes—means the team’s efforts can be focused on pursuing an authentic classic experience. Any differences in behavior between our development builds and the patch 1.12 reference can be systematically cataloged and corrected, while still operating from a foundation that’s stable and secure. Digging In So what does it take to recreate an authentic classic experience with modern engineering? Let’s start by categorizing the different types of game data that make up WoW: Table data: This kind of information is almost always represented as numbers. How many hit points a creature has, the amount of Strength an item grants, or where and when certain creatures spawn, are all examples of the numerical data we store in our databases. We can also store and enforce relationships between different pieces of data. File data: This is often very dense data like 3D models, textures, animations and terrain. Our user interface is built up from XML and Lua files. Many of the art files do not use the same file formats that commercial art tools spit out. Our build pipeline takes these raw art files and translates them into something optimized for our game to read and process. Lua scripts: Some features are driven by Lua scripts written by designers, allowing them to easily define custom behaviors for server-side logic without requiring deep engineering knowledge. How Engineering Has Changed One challenge we face is that all the classic data is in the original format used at launch, but that format has changed substantially in the intervening years. Major work needs to be done in this area to make the modern client compatible with the classic data. For example, spells could originally only perform three actions on the spell’s target. In table form, that looked something like this: **snip ** you can read this on the site if u want the technical stuff. As you can see, there is a lot of space taken up by ‘Nothing’. Over the course of WoW’s lifetime, we’ve improved our data design and normalized much of our database data. Today, that same data would be separated out like this: **snip ** you can read this on the site if u want the technical stuff. In this form, there is much less wasted space and spells are no longer limited to three effects. But before we can load any database data, we need to transform the old data layout into the new one. This is not limited to spells, as almost every game system (including items, creatures, player characters, spawning, AI, and more) has had its database layout altered over the years. Looking Ahead All the work we’re doing will ultimately allow us to recreate an authentic classic experience on a platform that is much more optimized and stable, helping us avoid latency and stability issues. Additional modern improvements will include modern anti-cheat/botting detection, customer service and integration, and similar conveniences that do not affect the core gameplay experience. We are looking forward to the challenges ahead and share your passion for the classic game; every code check-in data conversion we make brings WoW Classic closer to providing that authentic experience you—and we—want. Thanks for joining us on this journey.Kagemoth114 11h
11h Tier 0,5 should be in the game since release Tier 0,5 came with the AQ patch originally, and at that point most people had better gear, and didn't even bother doing the quest chain because it was very long and costly. But imo it would be perfect if it was in the game since release, since it will take months for most people to even get their tier 1, tier 0,5 would be a nice side goal to go for when raids are on lockout.Inanis33 11h
6h Legion + Battle for Azeroth Dear players, I saw the special offer from blizzard and heard good stuff about mythic+ dungeon. So i decided to give it a try and going to play again. If i buy the special offer from blizzard now, can i play legion then immediately and do i get a boost to the new level cap? Otherwise i will wait till the new expansion is there. Kind regards,Delaiah14 6h
14h what mount will you pick ? Hey guys when Classic releases what mount color will you choose ? i will pick white ram beacuse KKonaHaihukan25 14h
15h Remove Dishonorable Kills For those who don't know, dishonorable kills (DHK for short) was a penalty system intended to prevent high level players from camping important NPCs - civilians (quest givers, flight masters, etc.). You would lose a substantial amount of honor if you killed them. It was introduced in patch 1.5 and removed in TBC. This system had a big negative (unintended?) side effect, in that it stopped virtually all town/city raids by anyone who was trying to get honor, because civilians were almost guaranteed to get hit by some AoE and the penalties were drastic (see To make matters worse, it actually never fixed the underlying issue, as those who didn't care about the honor system could still keep killing civilian NPCs without any penalty. If Blizzard is really worried about people camping NPCs (I don't think it is that important), please make them untargetable/passive, like children already are. I don't care what patch we start with, but town raids were one of the more interesting parts of world PvP, and a common instigator for escalation, and I definitely want to relive that.Tadaharu11 15h
15h How much would you pay for Classic? If Blizzard announces that Classic will be relased for a one time cost of €99, would you buy it? What about 150? 200? So many people wanted this for so long. Can Blizz scare people away with high subscriptions/costs, or is the community willing to go for it no matter what?Felsome57 15h
1d Why Vanilla Was Better without LFR I just recently discovered this gem and thought it could offer some perspective to those who don't understand why players are against the very existence of LFR, because from my point of view, he's completely right! 1d
1d Cross faction talking? Patch 1.12? Like all the other private servers? I expected Blizzard with their resources to actually give us the classic wow experience starting from patch 1.1 which wasn't possible for private server developers for obvious reasons. It's basically going to be a glorified private server with battlenet integration and possible microtransactions. I would lie if I said I'm not going to play, but I can't say I am hyped to play Nostalrius all over again.Vaniljcola19 1d
1d New update is not an update The entire text can be surmised to this "we made it work, it's unstable as hell, this is how we are trying to fix it" Only update was that the basis is 1.12, however it's nice to have an update, which in this case was "we are alive, they are feeding us good, it's being worked on"Lifemetall14 1d
1d From Vanilla to Classic: The grand to-do list Hello Vanilla World of Warcraft fans and WoW: Classic development team. This will be a long post which I have been wanting to make since the announcement of WoW: Classic. The goal of this thread is to help the development team so that they do not overlook a single thing while taking on this massive challenge. To get everyone on the same level so we can cooperate, lets start with showing some respect to the original game and it's creators. First let me say this. In my opinion, World of Warcraft is the best game ever made. A game like this of course does not come falling out of the sky one day, there is a lot involved. As a owner of the Collectors Edition I have seen the 'Behind the scenes footage' which really opens up a world on it's own and totally makes your jaw drop. If you don't own the C.E., check out this link because it's been put on YouTube: I encourage everyone who has not seen this to take the time to watch all of it, that will really give you a idea what the stakes were on this one, what kind of brilliant people were behind this game. I really feel the need to underline this because this was no ordinary development team, this were a bunch of pure geniuses working together like a well-oiled machine, driven by the passion of their creation instead of their salary or whatever else. You just need to see this to get a idea why this world felt so incredibly immersive, why these classes were so brilliantly unique, why these different races were so beautifully animated, why the lore and mystery in this game was so engaging, just to name a few. This is important because we need to respect these people and the decisions they made before trying to judge on changes of any kind ourselves. That said, because the original game was so close to perfect, it is also important that the making of WoW: Classic is executed perfectly. We can not afford to overlook a single thing. Also, we must respect the choices made by the original developers. These people knew what they were doing and their choices are the reason a team is now working to recreate their very game. Another good video for your inspiration: Now, lets get to business. There is one big difference between Vanilla WoW and 'Classic. That is the fact that during Vanilla, WoW was a game which was continually being developed, new content was prone to come out all the time. That meant that as the game progressed, players that were ahead because they were better or had more time would get ahead even further. This required catch-up mechanisms so that low-geared players would also get a (still small) chance to play the new raids. Because Classic will be a game with a 'ending' (at the start atleast) there will be no need for the catch-up mechanisms because eventually every player will learn how to raid every boss. Even if at a later stage Blizzard would decide to add new content to Classic, they will hopefuly do so without any gear resets so the new content will only be a addition to the game, not a replacement like previous expansions were. Anyway, like Blizzard already let us know, the question remains what 'version' of Vanilla will be released as classic. In my opinion the only option is to make a new custom version of the game and I think that is what they are currently doing. This is because certain features which were added or changed during Vanilla were done with the idea in mind that the game would continue evolving. To put it simple, you don't want 1.0 because it lacks all the later raids but you also don't want 1.12 because many raids and dungeons were nerfed at that point to be much easier than originally intended. So basically what I did was read through the complete Vanilla patch notes from 1.0 all the way to 1.12 and let my memory do it's work. I took note of everything that potentially needs to be looked into. I also put the solution that I think is right on some of the subjects as a *. See the results below. Of course this list is not complete, I might have overlooked things, some changes might not even have been in the patch notes at all, maybe the solutions I provide for some of the points are sub-optimal, etc. So what I would like to see is that you guys also take a look at this list, try to remember how these patch changes felt for you during vanilla, post what the different effects would be of having these changes in the game or not and also give your opinion what you think is the best way to handle this. Should the changes be included in WoW: Classic or not? Or should they be implemented differently. Let's just see what we can come up with. I don't require you to give your opinion on everything, or find a solution for everything, if you can only name one subject that will already be helpful. In the end I will be putting the best ideas in the starting post. Note that these best ideas will be selected by me, which means it will be subjective. Everywhere in the world is always someone making the final decision. For this thread that will be me, for the product that will be someone at Blizzard. If you don't like that I suggest that you make your own thread or even your own game. Again, keep in mind that Classic in the first place will remain the same game forever, which is why we should not want catch-up mechanisms such a nerfs to dungeons and raids. Also, I am not in for 'changes' that were not already changed in a patch during Vanilla. Lets stay away from new stuff for now and first see how we sort out the old stuff. I am assuming here they will just be releasing one version of Classic and not doing staggered releases as that will probably introduce even more challenges. Also it will frustrate many hardcore Vanilla fans as many of the patches already included QoL changes that might better be left out. Link to patch notes: 1.1.0 (7-11-2004) No comments so far 1.2.0 (18-12-2004 No comments so far 1.3.0 (07-03-2005) - Dire Maul added to the game * Because we don't need catch-up mechanisms this time around, it is important to look at this one. I do not remember how Dire Maul scaled against the existing 5-man dungeons in terms of difficulty/rewards to say much about that. - Azuregos, Kazzak outdoor bosses added to the game * I think this is fine in it's original implementation but if you think differently please post below. - Meeting stones added to the game (only forms groups in this first implementation) * I think this is fine in it's original implementation but if you think differently please post below. - Dungeon Player Caps * I think this is fine in it's original implementation but if you think differently please post below. - Significant nerfs to different dungeons (read patch notes, a lot was changed here) * This is certainly up for debate. I lean towards saying no to these nerfs and keeping the difficulty up high. It depends on if this was intended as a catch-up mechanism or if the dungeons were actually too difficult compared to for example raids. We should also keep in mind that better gear was added to these dungeons later on. 1.4.0 (05-05-2005) - PvP honor system added to the game * Great addition imo, implement - Arena Event in Gurubashi Arena added to the game * Great addition imo, implement - Lots of balance changes (mostly nerfs?) to raids and dungeons * This clearly looks intended as catch-up, maybe leaving these changes out will be better 1.5.0 (07-06-2005) - faction reputation through cloth donations * This enables people to buy rep through ingame money which will enable them to ride off-race mounts. While cool it takes away some of the uniqueness factor of every races mount. - Dishonorable kills added to the game * This was a bit of a problem because if a group would decide to raid e.g. a capital city and someone in the group would kill a low-lvl NPC, that would give the whole group the dishonorable kill. This would keep many players from going on the famous outdoor PvP raids. 1.6.0 (12-07-2005) - Blackwing Lair added to the game * Lets discuss this - Darkmoon Faire added to the game * Lets discuss this, the trinkets were quite strong I remember, maybe a hidden catch-up mechanism - Battlemasters in capital cities introduced * Remove these from Classic. Then atleast someone in the PvP group will need to go out and queue up at the BG entrance like when WSG was first released. Also, players should exit the BG at the portal, not in the city. This was a QoL change that had a very big impact because the PvP players would all stay in the city instead of being outside, ready to be ganked and what not. Having to actually go to the BG like going to a dungeon was just much more real, they came up with these portals for a reason. - nerfs to Scholomance and Stratholme dungeons * Should be looked into, avery probably nother catch-up nerf that is better left out of classic 1.7.0 (13-09-2005) - Zul'Gurub added to the game - Debuff limit increased * This is obviously a big one. While this absolutely adds to the game experience for many classes. I feel this absolutely should be implemented and testing should be done on the impact in terms of raid difficulty, if needed a compensation could be invented. - 'Characters that use the Battlemaster to enter a Battleground will now port back to that Battlemaster when they leave the Battleground for any reason.' * As said before, better remove battlemasters entirely. If not, at least have players exit the BG at the portal, using Hearthstone is not that big of a concern, is it? - 'Racial "Leaders" have been strengthened, and are now worth slightly less honor.' * I would say don't implement this in Classic. This lowers the incentive to raid capital cities which was great. Players should also defend their leaders. - 'New crafted sets have been added that require reagents found only in Zul'Gurub or through the reputation gained from adventuring therein.' - 'Two new quests have been added to Thorium Point in the Searing Gorge for Thorium Brotherhood reputation turnin for players with neutral faction. You will now be able to turn in Iron and Heavy Leather to increase your reputation with the Brotherhood.' - Many changes regarding add-ons, not listing all here, see patch notes 1.8.0 (10-10-2005) - New outdoor Dragon bosses - Silithus revamp - Repair cost nerf * Don't implement, keep the game difficult like it used to be. You want to wear fancy epics, fine, if you die you pay the price though. - Honor System Nerf (how does this exactly impact the different affected ranks?) * Rank 14 is only for the most hardcore. I would say keep it original. - Alterac Valley changes/nerfs * Absolutely don't implement. Keep Alterac Valley in it's original unnerfed state, that was the best version. A true 'battleground'. - Many new craftable items * If this turns out too much into catch-up, maybe increase the material requirements? - Major Zul Gurub nerf * Absolutely don't implement in classic. ZG was great and I believe in it's original version it scaled pretty good in terms of difficulty/effort/reward compared to the existing (40 man) raids. - Blackwing Lair nerf (timer removed from Vaelastraz) * Don't implement 1.9.0 (03-01-2006) - Ahn Qiraj introduced - Linked Auction Houses * This had a big impact. Weren't auction houses added later in the other cities anyway? I remember for Alliance this changed the city where most people were hanging out from Ironforge to Stormwind. - Multiple battlegground queues at the same time * Implement, sometimes the waiting could take long. Still having to queue up at the entrance (or have someone in your group do it) should be necesarry. - Hunter pet changes (nerfs?) - 'Players should no longer be able to walk on steep terrain.' * This would remove the ability to explore some areas of the game that are normally inaccesible but can be entered due to this 'bug'. I can think of Karazhan, under Orgrimmar, Mount Hyjal. It was fun to go there but I can see this might lead to exploiting. 1.9.3: - 'Zandalar Tribe reputation rewards for killing mobs in Zul’Gurub have been increased.' * Catch-up mechanism, don't implement - Massive Zul Gurub nerf * Keep ZG in it's original, difficult state. This is Classic, not current WoW. 1.10.0 (28-03-2006) - Nerf to dungeons; increased drop rates, buffed item stats, decreased player limit, new item drops - Dungeon armor gloves Bind on Equip, adjusted set bonuses, moved drop locations, belt of valor Bind on Equip - Gold reward for quests when at level 60 - Final Destination Flight paths * While QOL, I wouldn't mind this being implemented in Classic, as long as there is a way to hop off earlier. - Alterac Valley changes - Rep gain increases Arathi Basin and Warsong Gulch * Don't implement, just keep the rep as it was (slow xD) - Many druid changes here, also nerfs which could maybe be reversed in case of underpoweredness of druids in certain aspect of the game (which is obviously for later after the game is releaed) - The drop rate for Essence of Air has been increased. - Blacksmithing new powerful craftable items - Tailoring Mooncloth Bag materials requirement nerf - Enchanting +Healing materials requirement nerf - Leatherworking many new powerful craftable items Quests: - The Hexxer's Head is no longer a requirement for the Collection of Heads quest in Zul'Gurub. * Don't implement (catch-up mechanism) - Realms that have Ahn'Qiraj open have access to a new questline at Cenarion Hold. (Does anyone know the rewards for this quest?) - Magma Elementals in the Searing Gorge can now drop the Heart of Flame quest item. (What is this?) Raids & Dungeons: - Ruins of Ahn'Qiraj nerfs * Don't implement - Temple of Ahn'Qiraj: Was Cthun nerfed? Anyone remember? - Blackrock Spire nerfs * Don't implement - Blackrock Depths some nerfs and buffs - New flight paths Undocumented changes: Instances: Zul'Gurub - The High Priestess Arlokk fight has now been changed so that panthers will always run out of the pens. As well, any damage done to the panthers results in little or no aggro being created. 1.11.0 (20-06-2006) - Major AV nerfs * Don't implement - Detect Traps is now a passive skill. (unacceptable, WE WANT SWIRLY BALL!!11) * Don't implement - Key rings have been added to the game. * Don't implement, you need to remember to take your key from the bank, otherwise you are considered a {fill in yourself} - 'We have re-evaluated the class specific quest rewards for both Zul'Gurub and Ahn'Qiraj Ruins. To bring them more in line with the effort required to attain them we have upgraded the superior items to epic quality.' * Was this the start of welfare-epics? Smells like it at least. Better don't implement. Professions: - New craftable nature resist gear * Here comes the AQ catch-up system. Leave it out or make the matt-requirements insane. - Nerfs to mats requirements of many blacksmithing items * No reason for this, don't implement Quests: - 'Blood of the Black Dragon Champion is now a multi-drop quest item. Everyone on their respective faction's quest will be able to loot the blood.' (BWL attunement nerf) Reputations: - 'New revered option for Hydraxian Waterlords faction allows players to receive a non-consumable version of Aqual Quintessence' (no need to return to the NPC every week for the item) * Don't implement Raids and Dungeons: - Nerfs to ZG, buffs to drops, nerfs to requirements for gear/enchants - Nerfs to AQ20, changes to gear from AQ20. - Undocumented: 'Various new Scourge-related bosses added to world dungeons (to coincide with the Scourge Invasion world event).' (Is this only temporarily?) User Interface: - Lots of raid enhancements - Mob icons (these also show through walls, can be imba in case of patrols), basically is also a nerf to Hunters Mark - Target of target functionality World Environment: - 'New flight points can be found at Ratchet and Marshall's Refuge, Un'Goro Crater.' - 'Flight paths added between:' (many new flight paths, I feel this is too much, especially with Ratchet the Alliance having a flightpath inside the barrens almost next to Horde starting area always felt like a step too far) 1.11.1 (28-06-2006) Felwood was corrupted. (What does this mean?) 1.12.0 (22-08-2006) - Cross-Realm Battlegrounds - Outdoor PvP objectives (Eastern Plagueland towers, Silithus) - 'Honorable Kills now diminish at a rate 10% per kill rather than 25% per kill.' Effect on grinding players as premade in BG´s - 'All manner of rogue reagents can be found in locked junkboxes (obtained from pickpocketing).' I hope not fadeleaf, as a Rogue myself in Vanilla I think it would be better if gold has to be spent for Blinding Powder, or some herb grinding would have to be done. - Major nerfs to Uldaman, Zul'Farrak and Maraudon dungeons - Some nerfs to Ahn'Qiraj - Automatic Quest Tracking (what is this?) - 'Neutral guards are now able to see through the rogue Vanish ability.' (Ganking in towns/cities was fun, the possibility of being ganked in a city while flagged was also fun, it added some thrill!) * Don't implement - About honor system: 'The curve has been adjusted to allow more people into the ranks. No, I can't give specific details on how many where but it should help at least for now.' If this means it's easier to obtain Rank 14 then this is up for debate. - 'Raid boss emotes are now shown in center of screen like a warning.' This makes default (no UI mods) raiding easier. 1.12.1 (26-09-2006) - Change to cost of mount. Total cost to learn riding + buy mount is unchanged but emphasis was shifted from mount cost to riding skill. * Don't implement. This makes the mount itself inexpensive which makes it very cheap for players to buy a different mount. This takes away a 'character uniqueness' factor from the game because before this change you would need to grind a long time if you really wanted to have a different looking mount. Now everyone can basically ride every normally available mount whenever they want. Other changes to the mount system might also include the ability to easily obtain other races mounts that would previously require exalted status with the race's capital. This is not wanted. Other changes made during Vanilla that we remember but are not listed in the patch notes: - Mounting in Undercity (I believe this was added later) * Don't implement, it's indoor. - As I played Rogue in vanilla, I can remember some issues with changes being made to stealth walking animation. I do not recall in which patches this was broken and fixed, all I know that this should be looked into because the animation from the first patches although not perfect looked the coolest so I would prefer that instead of the newer sped-up version. - Another Rogue thing, I remember some ability sounds like backstab/ambush and possibly cheapshot were changed at some point. I do not recall if this was during the 2.0 patch or another version prior to 2.0. In any case, we really need the original sounds as they were throughout Vanilla, not the modified version because the original sounds simply were better imho and of course, more Vanilla xD 'New' changes to the game that might be considered for Classic: - New hardware will finally enable very large outdoor raids without servers crashing, due to this population cap may be reconsidered. We really should consider the idea and imagination that the original developers had regarding server player cap and large-scale outdoor PvP battles, which they maybe could not fully get in the game the way they really wanted due to technical limitations of the time. We should talk to the original developers if possible. --END OF PATCH NOTES-- As you can see, making WoW: Classic truly is a monumental task. On many subjects I tried to already answer if it should be implemented or not and sometimes I also listed the reason. This of course solely comes from my own judgement, based on memories from back in the day. Many things need to be tested and thought over. I wish I could be part of this but I am not in the dev team unfortunately. If you don't agree please let us know, for the most difficult subjects we will probably need to hear many pro and counter arguments to really get a idea of how the change affects the game on a large scale. If there is anything else I can do to help let me know. I will be maintaining this thread as much as I can, I have a busy live though and am not getting paid for this yet still need food on my plate so please forgive me if sometimes it will take longer.Panzy3 1d
2d Divine Storm in Legion feels good Hello So with artifacts going away now we get the old Divine Storm back where the range of the aoe effect no longer exists. I got the Beta test and tried paladin and i must say the satisfying feeling of the spread - range aoe damage is totally noticable and doing Divine Storm doesn't feel nearly as rewarding as Legion. I just want to tell Blizzard that i think it should come back maybe as some Azerite Neck buff at a later stage but i hope you havn't removed the Idea of the range Divine Storm because i think it brought alot to the feeling of Retribution.Kratoes2 2d
2d Progression trough patches? Simple question, why? What's end result? You get to 1.12.1 and then you stop....What would be the point? Just a lot of work for developers. You know i have read a lot of posts about nostalgia and rose colored glasses or whatever, i think people that want to go trough the patches are actually playing it for nostalgia reasons. THIS IS NOT a post about "hah look how stupid they are", this is genuine question, why would you want to over-complicate something that can be as simple as "here people, an original vanilla experience, enjoy"Lifemetall44 2d
2d When ? how long do we have to waitJaalix2 2d
2d Prestige mode? Hey everyone, I’m curious. Finally we have an update (yes) and I have been seeing a lot of people worried about end game going stale. So I was thinking why not add a prestige option. Now hear me out please. When someone has done all raids or pvp up to rank 14 and or finished Naxx if they don’t want to pvp then they get the option to prestige. All this will mean is their choosen character (fitting the prerequisite: rank 14 or naxx cleared or similar) get their inventory and bank wiped and character reset to level 1, all they get to keep is their name and 5% of money they had on that character. The only reason I say to keep some of their former currency is I propose that that character can not receive eternal help I.e friends/ Guildies sending aid via gold or items, the only mail a prestige character can get is from the Ah. Also along the same lines limit the use of trade so the character can use and obtain professions, just to make it a bit harder and worthy of being called prestige. I have though of other little bits as well but I’m running away from myself there. Once said character then starts again (I think they should be able to choose their start zone). They then have to do it all over again, no special this or that, just the limitations imposed to make it more of a challenge. And what do you get in return for all this hard work and dedication. To be honest I think you should get a little tag on the character selection screen so you’ll see your character and then name and then under that you see prestige. And in order to get that you have to get rank 14 and finish Naxx, I never said it was easy. I’d like to think that it’ll keep people around for a bit longer, provide more content for them whilst changing very little. I think by not making it a visible accomplishment it won’t become a requisite for raids. Hehe just kidding but I hope that by not making anything more than bragging rights it won’t change anything that can hinder anyone else’s experience and they will know nothing about it unless someone takes a screenshot. I don’t know it was just an idea I had. I’m not trolling, just something to ponder whilst we await so more news I hope it provides an adequate distractionGiddly8 2d
3d Vanilla raids and tuning the bosses Back in the days i cleared MC, BWL, AQ, and naxx 40 man. ( ondagubben purged) and it was pretty hard because we dident have the same knowledge of the game and the boss tactics was more something you go for trying bosses and not looking at strats over the inter-webs. However ive been playing on private servers off and on. only to descover that after a lauch MC go cleared 4-5 days into the launch. So im super concerns that the instances will be under tuned big time. Blizzard talks about giving us a vanilla experience in the year 2018 and every boss has been data mined for almost 15 years. What if they "overtuned" the bosses instead, to recreate the same challenge. i hate to se 2 day clears. looking at boss mechanics and maby change it around abit?. the only instance that people had problems with on the private server servers some AQ bosses and Naxx. however MC and blw is more loot runs.Ondagubbén53 3d
3d Classic First off hello everyone, I just wanted to add my thoughts. I know everyone has different likes, wants, needs, are different ages, started the game at a different times/expansions etc but what you guys have to remember is back when WoW first came out it didnt know how successful it was going to be this is why I think the game as in Classic (a patch near the beginning) should remain unchanged apart from the requirements that it needs to run on modern hardware/software. My reason for saying this I wish and im sure most of you do for Blizzard to preserve the game as it once was because I see the game as a piece of gaming history and should be preserved just like a museum so everyone can take a trip back in time and enjoy the experience. Thanks for reading.Awol12 3d
3d Some thoughts on release If we assume that there is really only 5 people working on release of classic (judging by the "leak") There are only 4 things that make sense 1. Blizzard is putting BfA prior no1 because 5 people are understaffed for classic 2.Even if by some miracle 5 people are enough for recreation of classic, there is no way blizzard wouldn't put more people on that project if they considered classic to be even slightly a priority 3. 7 months to release a completed game, obviously it isn't a priority 4. So many Q&A and absolutely no updates, so it's fair to assume that the game is already competed and ready for release but .....BfA. I have never heard that blizzard has remained this silent about any product they released, only thing they are known for is the delays but the updates? Not really White i was writing this i threw my self in sadness because logically speaking there will not be anything of classic for additional 2 months....or more AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHLifemetall4 3d
3d PTR Hey fellas, how's everyones day going ? So I updated my PTR to 8.0 it even says it in the corner. But once I press Play it doesn't take me into the PTR. I tried to reload it over and over again including Battle net client.Koldan1 3d
3d Hybrid classes in vanilla. I have read alot of posts about hybrids in vanilla, and how people claim that guids would bring a "one-of" to raids and such... Did you guys who claim this ever raid in vanilla? If you did, did you ever clear current content? Because as far as I can remember, this is just not true... In 1.12, people did ony 5-man, just for the gold... and guess what? They would never bring a ret pala... I'm not saying everyone did this, but the very endgame guilds did... Take ret pala for instance... People say "look at Esfand"... First of all, he is probably an exeptional player. Second, he uses EVERYTHING in his power to get those numbers... Now imagine, if he played a fury warrior or a rogue. This post is to air my frustration and goes out as a fair warning to anyone who is a vanilla-noob, who has been fooled into thinking they can pick a hybrid class to DPS with. Please correct me if I'm wrong.Droorid68 3d
3d #NOCHANGES :) I don't why but whenever I see "#nochanges" one song came upon my mind :). I see no changes :) ... 3d
3d What was 1.5 AV like? Hello all, When I dinged 60 AV had already changed a lot. I have never fought Korrak and I haven't seen the original map before it was shrunk. In what ways did the battles differ before these changes were implemented?Fläskefar7 3d
3d We are getting Vanilla but TBC and Wrath? I think it is great we are finally getting to play pure Vanilla servers again. I think I will get years of good game play from classic. But I would like to play TBC and Wrath as well (would be happy to skip every xpac after that). So do you also want TBC and Wrath servers as much as me?Bilko71 3d
3d What is Classic? Hello I have played since 2010, which I think was the end of wrath of the lich king expansion. I remember the way people in my social circles were carrying on when wow first came out, at the time I was not at all interested in playing a game that required a subscription, so I missed out on the vanilla and bc experience. I'm very excited at the idea of being able to see what it was like. It seems that there's some confusion about what classic is and isn't, can anyone point me at official information for this? Is it Vanilla, is it BC? Where can I get information about the classes and the things you could do with them in vanilla and BC?Astoenyth6 3d
3d Single race guilds Was reading some Tauren lore today and it got me thinking... I know there were some single race guilds before, and i know its kinda hard to maintain and raid due to lack of all classes (Taurens for example). But today, with discord and and all it seems it would be much easier to handle and coordinate two or three guilds. I think it would be immense fun to have like three guilds named ie "Darkspear tribe", "Bloodhoof Clan" and "Bleeding Hollow Clan" going to raids together or even doing wpvp together, attacking cities and such. Same goes for alliance. Too complicated ?Lomilica17 3d
4d NO To CrossRealm, LFG & LFR Ever since CrossRealm, LFG and LFR were added into WoW, it slowly went downhill (lowering sub numbers speak for themselves) and killed off a large portion of daily social interaction and obviously broke up the community of a realm, which I had first hand experience of, causing me to have to move to a populated realm. If you played WoW before CrossRealm was implemented, you'd understand. Please consider the negative impact this has before you think of adding it into Classic servers. Now from my observations over the past few years of playing WoW regularly, I can confidently come to the conclusion that the social aspects of WoW are at an all-time low, EVEN on highly populated realms. It's like being on a subway train in China or somewhere. From inside cities to outdoors while questing & levelling, inside random dungeons and also in some end-game content that doesn't require communication in the first place. People's usual argument is something along the lines of "I don't need to speak in random dungeons, so therefore I don't." and that's true, nobody needs to speak because how easy levelling dungeons are despite their recent "buffs" (basically only increasing health, nothing else.) Anybody with half a brain knows that if content is too easy overall then communication isn't needed or required amongst the players, and the whole convenience of clicking a button and getting put into a group within no time usually, doesn't help - especially when you consider how ridiculous LFR is and the rewards it gives to players who do not have time or do not want to actually join a PUG or guild that raids. The whole WoW community has changed over the years, that's no secret, and personally I wouldn't say for the better. Everybody seems disconnected like as if they're playing a solo MMORPG, but I just hope that Blizzard do not add these additions into Classic servers.Nyc69 4d
4d Classic wow is a waste of dev resources Classic wow is such a waste of time.. unless they just rebuild the game in a brand new engine and even then its a maybe. Everyone will play for a couple of hours then go back to the expanded wow.Loredrael110 4d
4d LF Classic guild Hello i am looking for Guild (Alliance/Horde) that is gonna play in classic and i am looking for Hardcore raiding guild if there are guilds already planning message me in discord :) Ragnar#2012Ellamatic4 4d
5d What class and professions are you taking? I thought long and hard about this and I've got a really long feeling about what class and professions I'll be taking. Troll Warrior - because I don't have to drink for mana Tailoring - so I can make my own bags Herbalism - for extra gold now and then What will be your choices?Jímmy107 5d
5d Server Reputations I‘ll keep this quick. I genuinely don‘t believe server reputations were as much of a thing as people make them out to be. Servers still had thousands of players so to get your name out there to most of them was rare. I understand that the pool of people is much larger now so it is almost irrelevant nowadays - I just think it is being overhyped. It‘s also worth questioning if you trust Blizzard to not allow name changes through the store because I‘m sure they want as many income streams as possible.Foxybull14 5d
5d DKP vs Loot council I've seen this topic kind of mentioned in plenty of threads, but never actually discussed thoroughly here. Probably because everyone's so focused in the "change this change that" -drama. Considering that (moderated) dkp was the major raid looting ruleset among vanilla guilds, i'm kind of curious about how people nowadays think of that. Are the other of you oldschool raiders wishing for the oldschool system, or the new age buddy council to dish out the juiciest of drops?Líntu14 5d
5d You know what....? Even if an announcement goes out from Blizzard next week, along the lines of: ... Even if that happened, in some ways it's still been worth it in some ways, just to be able to kind-of 'plug in' and take notice or WoW once again after so many years, and even to post on the forum. Browsing the General Forums, Class Forums etc. just reveals a whole bunch of strange stuff I have no knowledge of, based on content I never played and have no intention of playing. It's nice to have been able to talk about the game I love, even retrospectively with others who share similar opinions.Grupp10 5d
6d Duel outside Ironforge ! When Classic releases who wants to duel me outside IF !?Haihukan13 6d
6d My vanilla opinion. This is my wish to Blizzard and the Classic team. Faction leaders should have their unique models as they are now. Not as a Night Elf Sylvanas for instance New player models and animations should also be in the Classic version of the game. The world should have much greater detail to it. Blizzard should make an effort to make all specs relevant. I wish to have a choice to play a Shadow Priest and not be forced into a healing role. Other than that everything should stay the sameTanvar35 6d