14 Feb 2014 Forum Guidelines - Please Read Welcome to the World of Warcraft discussion forums! This forum is here to provide you with a friendly environment where you can discuss all aspects of World of Warcraft with your fellow players. Community forums work best when participants treat their fellow posters with respect and courtesy. Therefore, we ask that you take the time to read through the forum Code of Conduct before posting. Search The new search function at the top of the World of Warcraft community site is extremely robust. Please be sure to use it to look for similar topics, blog posts, or web pages that may contain the answer before creating your forum topic. Making a new thread on an existing subject will likely result in your thread being deleted. If you continue to repost it you're likely to have your posting privileges suspended for spamming. Worst of all, you'll be making the other forum goers upset that you didn't take a minute to search before posting. Reporting You can quickly report a post as trolling or spam, or use the report function to fill out a more comprehensive description of the violation. You can only rate each post once. Use it wisely to help foster a positive and helpful forum community. Guidelines In addition to our general Code of Conduct, here are some common courtesy guidelines to follow to ensure these forums remain a constructive and friendly gathering place for the community. While these do technically fall within the bounds of the Code of Conduct, these cover more specific examples of common errors that will lead to thread deletions or posting privileges being revoked. The World of Warcraft forums are for discussion of topics directly related to World of Warcraft The forums here are specifically to discuss the game and related topics. Any topics not related to World of Warcraft, or Blizzard are subject to deletion. Don't post in all capital letters, use a misleading title, excessive punctuation, non-standard symbols, etc. While everyone wants their posts read, we ask you to refrain from using these types of tactics in order to bring more people to your thread. Let your post stand on its own merit. Threads violating this guideline are subject to deletion. Using the words Blizzard, Blue, or any community team members name in a thread topic to gather attention is frowned upon Everyone would like Blizzard to read and acknowledge his or her post, and we understand that. However, use of such words in the topic does not help that come to pass. Please make your thread title relevant to the post subject. Threads violating this guideline are subject to deletion. Note that threads discussing e.g. the Blizzard authenticator or Blizzard’s latest press release are allowed to have Blizzard in the title as it’s then relevant to the discussion. Posting "First" or IBTL constitutes as spamming You will be suspended if you create a post that is intended to call out that you achieved a specific reply number in a thread. This is considered spamming. Posting IBTL (in before the lock) is not helpful and if you feel a thread should be moderated please use the rating button to do so. Posting TLDR or L2P constitutes as trolling Posting TLDR (Too Long, Didn’t Read) is saying you don’t care about a player’s post. Posting L2P (Learn to Play) mocks the player for their skill or experience level rather than provide constructive input on the post itself. Both are considered trolling and will lead to a suspension.Takralus2 14 Feb 2014
10 Sep 2018 Story Forum "Guidelines" and Suggestions We've adapted the description of this forum to include Fan Fiction, and we encourage you to share your stories here! This rest of this post is taken from Nethaera's thread on the US forums: I know more than a few people have been asking if there are guidelines to posting in these forums. The answer is yes and no both. Confusing, I know, but you'll understand once I explain. First, if you are sharing a story here, it should be fictional and set in the Warcraft universe. Can you break canon? Yes. It's your story. Just please try not to go too far afield. Your audience will appreciate some semblance of familiarity. Next, you've asked about just how far language, sexual themes, or violent themes can go, so I'll explain here. Keep in mind, the forum Code of Conduct still applies. Also, keep in mind the rating (T for Teen) as well. When you want a good example story, please take a look at Blizzard's own for World of Warcraft. That should give you a good comparison for your own tales. Use your best judgement. If you ask yourself, "Is this too far?", it just might be and you might want to consider doing another editing pass. While not everyone may agree on taste, try to keep it as tasteful as possible. If you're sharing a story, it may be a good idea to put "complete" at the bottom of your story if it takes more than one post to tell it. We know there are restrictions on the forums that may hinder you a bit, but this may give you the room to post without someone jumping in before you're done and so that the reader knows they are reading a "finished" (we all know no story is ever really finished) piece of work. Authors may also want to express at the bottom of their completed tale if they are open to constructive feedback. Some may not want feedback other than to hear if someone enjoyed it and some may be looking for others to help them hone their skills. The best way to solicit either is to make it clear what you would like. "Constructive feedback welcome." If you are a reader, please be considerate. If you didn't like a story or liked it, then sharing constructive feedback is fine. But, please make sure you do it in a way that isn't insulting to the author if the author has asked for or made it clear they are open to feedback. Most importantly, we all know that these types of efforts are very personal to the author. I'd like to ask authors not to take feedback too personally and likewise for those that give constructive feedback. Please don't make it personal. Personal attacks are definitely not OK here. This is largely 'your' forum to make of what you like in the end. While we have the power to moderate and help mold, the shape of it all is largely up to you and what you make of it as a community. *I've left this thread open on purpose so that any additional etiquette discussions or questions could be kept here. Feel free to talk amongst yourselves.Takralus9 10 Sep 2018
15 Nov 2018 New forums! Hey fezellas, We're getting new forums in appr. 5 hours! Only a few threads will be migrated to the new forums, so it's advisable to necro old threads you think are valuable. Hope to see you guys on the other side! Let's take the time to say goodbye to the old forums, and prepare ourselves for eight hours or silence.Theronarum56 15 Nov 2018
15 Nov 2018 Race ranking Rank all playable races (with or without allied races) in order from most to least favourite. -GOD TIER- 1. Night elves. 2. Zandalari trolls 3. Orcs 4. Draenei 5. Trolls -GOOD TIER- 6. Blood elves 7. Pandaren 8. Gnomes 9. Forsaken 10. Worgen -OKAY TIER- 11. Goblins 12. Tauren 13. Dwarves -!@#$ TIER- 14. Void elves 15. HumansAshval94 15 Nov 2018
15 Nov 2018 BFA isn't THAT bad tbh story, gameplay etc all fine but the thing is when you compare it to the previous expansion this one seems like peanuts. we went from fighting sargeras, meeting titans, going to argus with legendary weapons and stuff to going to kul tiras and zandalar. it was always going to be underwhelming.Jorginhó15 15 Nov 2018
15 Nov 2018 More news about Tyrande's ascension from the PTR The newest version from the Alliance side is very interesting. 1-The Moonwell that Tyrande performs the ritual in now pulses with Void/Elune energy, a cool combination never before seen. 2-Nathanos now has an army of Forsaken dark rangers with him. 3-Tyrande will create beams that pull the risen Night Elves into the sky killing them and releasing their spirits( confirming the old lore for Night Warrior) 4-Tyrande will also kill the Dark Rangers in similar fashion, they scream while being pulled towards the moon :P. 5- the entire fight is a lot harder for the players now as there are many enemies, you can easily die. 6-Minor text and dialogue changes, they switch some conversations to make more sense, the NPCs are positioned better now( at the end of the Ritual Maiev has Wardens rallied behind her, she avoids the blight with blink and kills the Forsaken forcing Belmont to run etc...), and Dori'Thur model was changed. What I noticed that all the spells are either Silver/blue the Color of Elune, or Shadow/void, this pretty much confirms that Elune is more than just Light ! very interesting for future lore. I can't wait for 8.1, gonna take a break from WOW until it gets here, I hope you guys enjoy the game and stay positive <3 For Elune !älfurion176 15 Nov 2018
15 Nov 2018 the Alliance Tyranny. Forgive the bait title, but the following will hopefully be a discussion about how the Alliance could be considered Tyrants by those not within their Faction that do not posses Meta Knowledge of the Players. So, for now let us take the wowpedia description of the Alliance as a whole. Humans, night elves, dwarves, gnomes, draenei, and the savage worgen make up the illustrious Alliance. Proud and noble, courageous and wise, these races work together to preserve order in Azeroth. The Alliance is driven by honor and tradition. Its rulers are champions of justice, hope, knowledge, and faith. In a time when chaos and uncertainty reign, the Alliance remains steadfast in its determination to bring light to the darkest corners of the world.[1] Now at first glance this likely makes people think, How would anyone find these with Tyranny. But then we also have to consider a few things with the Alliance as a whole. Justice and Faith. are likely the two elements that could be viewed as Tyrannical by others. Now first let us take Justice, what is Justice exactly as a whole? is it always a force of good, or is it honestly just something said out when performing dark deeds to make it seem more heroic from a kind of we are honest twisted point of view. Next we've faith. Religion can always be a strong factor for Tyranny in itself as history shows. Now one prime example of Alliance ''Tyranny'' is probably going to be the upcoming Raid Siege of Dazar'alor. the Alliance moves their armies to attack this place, to make the Zandalari not commit to the Horde. I mean really? Anyone would know that attacking those you seek to drive away, will more than likely direct them over to those you try to prevent it off. Then again we do live in an Azerothian time where people thinks Might makes Right. Another is probably in the past of the humans, most of their Kingdoms were basically ground they took from inhabitants already there. Stormwind was build upon Gnoll Grounds. Quel'thalas upon Troll land. (Yes we count Quel'thalas into this as it used to be a Kingdom of Team A) Kul'tirans build upon stolen Drust Land. Another factor we can throw in is possibly the passive racism of the Alliance in the past, They've had a tendency to kill things that does not look human enough before and then later coming to the realization such was a bad idea. Many races not appearing human enough or sharing their ground ideals has met the swift -Alliance Justice- In overall the Alliance Union could be from an outside perspective be seen as Tyrannical in some regard due to their past and clear present methods of making -peace- Spoilers Read no Further unless you do not care. the Alliance murders the Troll King of the Zandalari sealing the loyalty to the Horde completely, as well as granting the Zandalari a true reason to fight them now. Now the following post is still simple enough how would races outside of the Alliance view them, and what would lead to possibly finding them Tyrannical upon a world scale in the eyes of outsiders? Now do remember that these races do not have the Meta Knowledge of us players and can only judge the Alliance upon their military actions, and first hand impressions towards different species.Durlan23 15 Nov 2018
15 Nov 2018 Healing in lore Just wondering how does healing work storywise? It obviously isn’t how it is game wise, surely? Also how does a shaman’s water heal a person?? Answers I seek because thinking about it has just confused me. Edit - maybe I just lack imagination smhTelriem25 15 Nov 2018
15 Nov 2018 Zandalari Paladins are disrespectful It is clear to me that Blizzard obviously has a Horde bias. The Zandalari Paladins are a metaphysical middle finger to the pious Human races, who are willing to sacrifice their lives for the noble goal of justice and peace and harmony. However, the Kul Tirans, blessed by the Light, will not become Paladins. Instead, some tribal mudhut-dwelling filth gets to use the pristine Light???? This is preposterous!! I demand that the virtuous Kul Tirans will also be able to become proud Paladins! Humans were always destined forthe religious life, and to see that the Kul Tirans cannot fully embrace it... ridiculous. They will have to steal it from the cattle then.... Light be with you... but not the Zandalari Trolls!Empedocles78 15 Nov 2018
15 Nov 2018 How powerful are average magic users? This question came to my mind during a discussion in the realm forums. How powerful are average magic users like shamans, mages or priests? We're not talking about the big superheroes meaning we're not talking about people like Jaina, Thrall, Anduin etc. We are talking about the average guys. A few points I'd like to make before we start: - In the "Terror of Darkshore" cinematic, the orc warrior tells Nathanos that a single night elf couldn't have ambushed a caravan (of 4 people) on his own. - In the BfA-cinematic we actually see a handful of night elf mages and a troll shaman. And while they do some damage, they don't turn around the entire battle and most fighting is still done by average footmen and grunts. - If we want to use Warcraft 3 as a reference: Every faction had magical units for example priests, sorceress, druid of the talon/claw, necromancer and shamans. However none of them was a walking army, and they all needed support. Same with the heroes: While a level 10 mountan king could kick some serious !@#, he still couldn't win a game on his own. So, really: How powerful is the average mage/priest/shaman/paladin etc.?Keydiam6 15 Nov 2018
15 Nov 2018 horde lower number of characters (horde only please) with the death of garrosh vol'jin the high age of saurfang and eitrigg and everything indicates that we wil lose sylvanas maybe nathanos to. I would say we are running out. i see garona and lilian voss present in bfa as a symptoms of that. and blizzard tendency to kill more horde characters then there create i am will worry about the horde future what do you think about this dilemma?Sylanna69 15 Nov 2018
14 Nov 2018 Why I feel like Quitting the Lore For Good. I just got the incredible feeling that I'm been taken for a ride at developers' whims. So I just feel like letting the story die to me completely and just not care because I can't trust anything. There are so many parts in warcraft lore I like, but so little effort for consistency, i have no confidence in the future, that when i like something or love it even, that it actually means something because tomorrow it will be retconned or thrown under the bus. What made me think of this just now? Well it's all those instances - lore in game or novels has shifted, retconned, re-cast in a worse light, the failure to keep to the integrity of a good plot that was started and changing it for a seeming whim. The inability to care enough even to make the game lore play straight through. How long must i wait. We're enjoying the little bone we've been thrown for night elvesin 8.1 - reason I'm not letting myself jump for joy? Because they'll forget about them totally in 8.2 against Azshara - that is their number 1 enemy, been part of thier lore from day 1, her naga always attacking night elven lands and trying to kill them. Yet, because Sylvanas has pissed Tyrande off so much, she'll have her "moment" in Darkshore, and that would be "night elves' high@ Quote: From Ion Hazzikostas ... So after murdering them in the sundering to near extinction, robbing them of their immortality, stripping them of power from Well of Eternity, World Tree, making them look like noobs to the horde in cataclysm, leaving them out of the final push against the legion, then giving htem a second genocide - massive low *you don't get lows lower than that, it's massive sting of lows and critical lows" so where are the massive string of highs and critical highs? -- why do I feel like the night elf high - is a warfront where Tyrande looks the role she should have been for the last 14 years, in a warfront who's outcome is meaningless - and they will go, "there! we did something for night elves. Gave them their high" Meanwhile lets find more things from night elves we can give to other races and the horde to make them even cooler. Left homeless, near extinction, still a civilizaiton in ruins, 10,000 years and still counting, most of the power still gone - yet it was okay to see BElves get a recovery going, Sunwell back, restored to thalassian lands, power not only back, but upgraded. Then blood elves written quite strongly (as i would expect) afterwards, but no such treatment for night elves? Talk of consistency? Why isn't Thalyssra and the nightborne not in the alliance with the night elves - i mean a more perfect story for the night elf arcane rejoining the main branch and being redeemed from callous recklessness coudl not have been written - long have night elf fans waited for the night elves amidst 14 years of constant ruins to get 1 pristine city - and bang it goes horde. First time night elves are a focus since wow, couldn't give em the send off against the Legion - the story writing this races civilziaiton ruined by this foe, then every group - Long vigil, Eldre'thalas, SUramar all in isolation because of this enemy, the long vigil group going to great extremes to prevent its return - their lives ALL about stopping the legion, even arcane magic they love so much, they ban, the well anathema not for the good it use to bring, but for the threat of returning the legion. Their immortality lost to defeat it a second time, and much of the nature part of their power - gone - and what role do the Darnassians play against the Legion ? ZERO - don't get me wrong, great to see new night elf groups like the nightborne, Farondis, Moonguard = applaud 100% - but then come 7.1 and 7.2 , firstly Tyrande, in her home city is reduced to counterpart to Liadrin (not even racial leader), goes about announcing the Alliance is here to help rather than the GOddess -- she is freaking high priestesss, her Order's capital, and main temple -- showing me how little they care - instead its more important for Liadrin to prance, than for Tyrande to get involved. Why did we not see The order of Elune, bringing the salvation of the goddess to the afflicted and the vengeance of mother moon against the evil destroyers? How I would have loved to see Tyrande Starfall a bunch of demons trying to devour some hapless nightborne, or set up radiance of the stars - areas where those intentionally starved have their hunger pangs subdued by the light of the moon - instead .. then don't get me started on the broken shore - where the main temple is, where we shoudl have seen the Order of Elune interact with every class order hall, and Tyrande herself as high priestess leading the charge to reclaim the Tomb/Cathedral - instead it was more important for Khadgar to be there.. Khadgar. Velen and the draenei, 100% agree with taking us to Argus, illidan making it possible, great move also, it makes sense the new night elf groups would perhaps stay behind, but Darnassians? the group who has suffered most from the legion, and the ones who fought it from the start missing? In-Game Continuity As for that, it is such a mess, I can never go through and play /experience every change that happened in wow. The mere fact that Sylvanas is issuing quests that Thrall, Garrosh, Vol'jin all issued is so jarring, key lore events part of pre-expansion events, and end game patches removed - if you didn't play Mist of pandaria while it was playing you will never fully understand what is going on, the Vale of Eternal blossoms is cracked and broken before you can do the quest that explains it, key quests removed as the next state appears.. no attempt, i mean no attempt to make a way for you to actually go through all this. Then there is the jarring inconsistency that is TBC and WotLK in the timeline, with 0 explanation - and the only way to understand the continuity is to buy 3 volumes? Then the Night Elven History Blizzard introduced the night elves with such flair and imagination - reading about them being the first to study magic, build a civilziaiton unparralled, the first to master druidsm, build a world tree - Elune the goddess watching over them, and they knowing her, specialists at spellcraft and ranged fire power is what the manual said - then the game showed, incredible things, the novels reveaeled even greater things. And then wow came, and only a fraction of the race was shown. Only the peaceful , serene side (which I like) but without the aggressive, dangerous side - they just look like chumps, only the druid side shown, where was the priest? and what about the great hope of the arcane returning now the legion was back? Teased with ruins all over the place, night elves can use magic again, why aren't they rebuilding or progressing? Answer came in Cataclysm - it was simple. NEglect, time spent focusing on blood elves, draenei, humans, orcs, Lich king, and in cata, they had to update the old world, so naturally finally new stuff came, but the focus was goblins, thrall, dragaon aspects, and we saw no updates for darnassus to accomodate returned highborne nor worgen - i.e. NEGLECt - time taken to show everything else, but them. With people like Tyrande and Malfurion around, why Tyrande wasn't in Outland trying to get through to Ilildan, silent till MoP, Malfurion - plays a minor role in Hyjal, HYJAL - Thrall ofc is the man, MAlfurion just fades away - you could argue it makes sense for the shaman to be in control here being an elemental thing.. okay (even though there is no reason why such a powerful characters like Malfurion and Tyrande won't play a key roll) but okay, however when it comes to matters that are back in their court, like the Legion - Malfurion gets the EMerald dream, but no where to be seen in the final push against the legion, - i didn't mind that too much, because his brother Ilildan was shining.. but Tyrande? what's her excuse... ah - i get it, they showed her in 7.1 that was enough. So come 8.2, because we have seen the darnassians in a warfront, means we won't see them agianst Azshara, an di'm supposed to be happy with this. Lets not even go to the retcon of night elves coming from trolls, and troll history being shifted from post sundering to pre-night elf - i wonder what was so unsatisfactory of the original version that this twist was soo necessary, it just seemed going out of the way to be different rather than actually doing something cool that was different. But let's not even go there Then the Nightborne I didn't even get to talk about the nightborne going horde, and what an insult it is to night elf fans, and the fact that they dind't even have to have all of them over, but it's okay for the alliance to get an exiled remnant of blood elves, with no city, no assets, no sunwell, but when it comes to the nightborne, we can't give the horde a remnant of the night elves greatest civilization, no, we have to give them the pristine city and all the nightborne too, because the horde clearly needs more arcane wielding elves, and clearly needed more elven cities too, blood evles weren't nearly enough, and apparently weren't the ones living only at half mast with the nature half waiting for a full arcane halt to make them whole. The Thalyssra character who if you have read WotA, is a fusion of Tyrande and Malfurion - there is no more fitting a bunch of people that match the kaldorei like a glove than the nightfallen rebellion characters, Thalyssra, Ly'leth, occuleth, and their own Sylvans' horde that has committed genocide against their own people who helped them - after the talk of defending the world, working so closely with VAlewalker Farodin, the Moonguard, the Suramar kaldorei refugees, and her desire to help and do right that reminds me so much of Tyrande and Malfurion - and you mean to tell me she all of a sudden U-turns and decides to go horde, and get this - b/c Tyrande is strict with her? Dont' get me wrong, I can understand a cocky nightborne from the city having that reaction, or Elisande having that reaction, but humbled Thalyssra, and all the others too? And it wasn't even necessary - horde could have gotten the nightborne without the nightfallen rebellion, who i say should have stayed neutral to both factions, while some of the arrogant city folk, in search of more power and glory, join the horde because they believe their best chances at reagining their power and control lie with joinign the stronger faction. But no, they all had to go horde, but a tiny fraction of exiled thalassians is enough for the alliance followed by genocide of their race. Where does This Leave Me? Wondering why I have botehred and allowed myself to get so invested in something i know is going to let me down - like the people who keep going back to the bad boyfriend (or girlfriend), they know is no good, they know is a waste of time, they know is not fulfilling them because they aren't being decent about it. You know who would get continuous involvement and relevance, who they would make sure everything about her character and lore is in line? Sylvanas. Yes, the favourites will always get good treatment. I have been meaning to quit the lore until better treatement came for night elves - and I think I shall and will give it till 8.2 to turn things around. If 8.2 indeed fails to actually follow the consistency of the story by failing to include night elves against Azshara, then i would know, Darkshore was the "high" and that's all they are getting and i'm not waiting around another 14 years to actually see things pick up. If blizzard can't see they have a winner in the night elves, that can carry the franchise better than Orcs and are more appealing than humans, and instead prefer to squander them to push favourites like Sylvanas and her nasty ways, then their choice. It's their game, they can throw away their greatest gem if they want, but don't expect me to respect them for it. RANT OVER.Kalibas112 14 Nov 2018
14 Nov 2018 Saurfang Mag'har and Draenei come to think about how Saurfang and Mag'har would interact with their very different view on Draenei. what do you think of itSylanna72 14 Nov 2018
14 Nov 2018 Lore on Elune/Azeroth's moon? What exactly is Azeroth's moon and how does it relate to Elune? Is it possible for the denizens of Azeroth to visit the moon? I know there are very few facts about who or what exactly is Elune. I know she's a "true" goddess, but not much more. I can't help but feel she is actually related to the void somehow, a "sane" void if you will... Perhaps the source of the void is being corrupted by Voidlords (which would explain all the madness and tentacles currently inherent to the void) and Elune is trying to clean it? Do you think this is plausible or am I way off track?Leinadh13 14 Nov 2018
14 Nov 2018 Sylvanas ordered the Wrathgate massacre "I've heard these discussions on the internet about 'she's going off the rails', but is she? I've been writing Sylvanas personally since 2006, and this is pretty much - the Wrathgate and the Blight and the Forsaken - in character. Those were all under Sylvanas' orders. What we're seeing now is an escalation of the plans Sylvanas has, clearly, and we're in the middle of that. A quote from Afrasiabi in his new interview with Eurogamer Not sure if there's a thread already, but... Why? Why reveal this in some stupid interview? Why retcon it at all?Qahnarin40 14 Nov 2018
14 Nov 2018 Is Sylvanas controlled by third party? I think it’s a plausible option, so speculation: Option one: Valkyrs. There is a lot of talk about free will and what happens when they are raising people.The fact is that if they just raising people with free will there is no point to raise your enemies. Most probable outcome is that they still be enemies and in any case you cant trust them to be your lawful army. I don’t think it’s a plot hole, something is happening during the raising. Sylvanas was raised by Valkyrs also. Option two: Old gods. Her death was very singular, although she is dead, the blood of an old god might run through her veins, kind of. N'Zoth might controlling? manipulating? her through the blood connection. Option three: Arthas. I have written about it in another post. An interpretation of the warbringer cinematic: Sylvanas slide is from Arthas POV. Arthas reveals himself to Delarin and the lines are: Arthas: I remember a fool. Life is pain. Hope fails. Now you understand. Derarin to Sylvanas: I grieve for you. Delarin to Arthas: You’ve made life your enemy... Behavioral the burning of Teldrassil and the raising of Delarin are Arthas moments. Option four: The true enemy. Don’t know who-what it is. That might go combined with the other options but can also happens separately.Vonen24 14 Nov 2018
14 Nov 2018 How could Sylvanas die in a body? Remind that she is a banshee.Shandyra14 14 Nov 2018
14 Nov 2018 Alternative 8.1 story Here is what I actually predicted in my mind would be the 8.1 patch. I was fairly close: Sometime during questing the player (I imagine representing the Horde) makes a deal with Bwonsambdi to bring him some number of souls (I think a million). [Not made up, this bit actually happened] How can we keep this deal? By waging war on the alliance. Rastakhan makes up some excuse and sends out a fleet to attack the alliance, who attack in turn. Maybe Rastakhan pretended he wanted to capture some strategic island, but the real reason was the million souls. In the chaos and confusion at sea, the naga take advantage and launch an attack of their own. Cue 8.1 raid. First boss is some denizen of the island. Second and third bosses are opposing faction themed. Fourth bosses onwards: naga/nautical themed, you go gradually deeper underwater - prelude to 8.2. <End> I quite like this idea (of course I invented it), at lot more than the nice Horde city getting razed (hope it doesn't change in appearance) and major characters dying. I don't like Rastakhan dying (if he does), because him being ressurected showed the power of Rezan and the loa hierarchy. I also think he's a complex character who can add a lot to the story. I'm also not a fan of loa being killed off in the raid, don't loa die all the time? Do we need more loa deaths?Daddyghoul0 14 Nov 2018
14 Nov 2018 The horror of Undeath (Spoilers) I must say, the recently revealed Derek Proudmoore cutscene is truly chilling. Let's start from Sylvanas' ploy. To "condition" the mind of the reborn Derek so that he may kill his entire family in their sleep... That's just cruel. Even by Sylvanas' standards. You would think that, as a Forsaken, she would try to help Derek get over his terrible trauma... But No, she just treates him like a tool. But I really want to focus on Derek Proudmoore. The voice actor did such an amazing job I have the impression that Undeath has been taken way too lightly recently. Voss refused to believe that she was Undead and was absolutely terrified, but now she is cool with it. Sylvanas kept moaning about how terrible and painful Undeath is, how it was an agony that had enslaved her, yet now she is fine with "freeing the people of Stormwind City from the shackles of mortality". UNDEATH IS NOT PLEASANT. And this cutscene shows it quite well. Imagine waking up, looking at yourself, and seeing a monster. A corpse. Derek's reaction is so relatable and "human". The voice actor did a brilliant joy conveying the idea that Undeath truly is one of the worst possible things that can happen to someone. Even the mere idea of watching your body, once full of life and energy, decayed to an hollowed husk, would most likely shatter the sanity of the vast majority of people. Overall, I much prefer Derek's reaction over Delaryn's and Sira's. Derek, once a proud man, has been crushed and reduced to such a pitiful and miserable individual. That Sylvanas witch truly knows no limits to her villainy and cowardice.Arctur139 14 Nov 2018
14 Nov 2018 Morale gray world 8.1. ? Before BfA Blizzard had promise us, that this new war will be a "Gray World". But until now we had only Dark "Evil" world of Sylvanas. The Lich Queen who burn down innocent civilians with children, who were surrendering. Creating her own Undead world. Pure evil. And we had bright "Good" world of Anduin. Knight of the light, who does not want that war, who wants peace, who is just forced to have a war, who just want to stop Sylvanas to protect innocent... But now in 8.1. Horde gets Saurfang. Old orc who feels guilty for murdering so many innocent children. Who doesn't want to have war against Alliance any more. Who wish to stop Sylvanas. Sounds like he is a good guy. But is he? No, he was the one who wanted that war at the beginning. He was planning to make whole Night Elves race to be Horde slaves. He was planning to kill NE leaders to brake their hope. He personally kill many elves who wanted just to protect their homes, their families... Alliance gets new Tyrande and Malfurion. They are now use evil dark magic of the Void. They are killing enemies with no mercy. They bury orcs alive. Sounds like a bad guys. But are they? They are not conquers, they are fighting against enemies on Night Elves lands. They are fighting to save their home against murderers. So, in 8.1. Horde really gets a "Grey World" in Saurfang's Horde. And Alliance gets a "Grey World" in Tyrande's-Genn's Alliance. But is it fortuitousness that this happens in the same time? =)Призраклеса46 14 Nov 2018
14 Nov 2018 are saurfang and sylvanas deceiving us all with blizzard split questline intended to meet in the end and nobody should feel wrong about there choice. could it all be a continuation of a good war deception what do you think?Sylanna40 14 Nov 2018
14 Nov 2018 Anduin's second lie? Saurfang : I.. Hoped.. You.. Would stop her. Anduin : I can't. Not alone. I have yet to see anyone really say this (as far as I am aware) but it is possible that this is Anduin's second (or possibly third) lie he has offered? Him offering Saurfang to "rebuild" the Horde only for him to be used as another way to weaken the Horde and eventually dismantling the Horde? It isn't like Anduin and the Alliance cannot defeat the Horde, after all the war effort paints a clear picture of who is in the driving seat and this is only backed up by what Nathanos says in 8.1 "The Alliance is tightening their grip. Victory is within their grasp" (or along the lines of that). Not to mention the Alliance has yet to bring in conscription which they didn't need to do against the Burning Legion which the Horde had to. Furthermore it is also stated that more soldiers died at both Lordaeron and the WoT event on the Horde side than on the Alliance side. This is all before Saurfang even does anything beyond kill a few Dark Rangers in the Swamp of Sorrows. All this points towards the Horde being in a more dire situation than the Alliance, yet we are lead on to believe that the Alliance is the one struggling through this by Anduin more so than the Horde. So is it possible that the reason why he says this is to manipulate Saurfang? And perhaps the real reason he looks sad, emotional, even guilty is because he is using Saurfangs honor against him to hopefully rip the Horde into 2 different groups before defeating them both just because it would be so much easier to and would come at far less loss of life? These offers of lies must come out soon, and it fits perfectly in offering Saurfang the lie of getting back the Horde he wants only to be ripped apart in front of him when the Alliance goes back on their word? I am pretty sold on this idea, I doubt it'll actually work but at the very least I still think this is one of the lies.Frozenshadow40 14 Nov 2018
13 Nov 2018 Horde players sure are excited. 13 Nov 2018
13 Nov 2018 Alliance faction pride Since the forum kind of ate my longer post, I'll make it short, mirroring the Horde topic: Alliance players. Do you feel anything approaching pride in your faction? Did you before? Have you lost it along the way? What are you proud of and did that change over time? I for one don't feel any pride in the Alliance as a faction, and don't remember ever feeling any. If the Horde had the gnomes I'd be playing Horde. I never cared much for the faction conflict (though I may have whined a bit where I thought it was unfair against the side I play). If we were all unified under the Alliance, the Horde, or the Unified Coalition of Alliance and Horde, I wouldn't miss anything about the conflict. It was never deep enough in WoW to grab my interest, and it mostly felt cheap to me to pitch the players against each other.Wimbert64 13 Nov 2018
13 Nov 2018 Warchief Baine - thoughts? I've been thinking for a long time now, that since we are almost certainly getting rid of the cartoon villain of Sylvanas - we will need a replacement. Saurfang's been mentioned a great deal, but I wanted to suggest an alternative - Baine. Imho, he might not be the Warchief the Horde deserves but the one we need since we seem to have a lot of crazy ones sadly. He's got a track record of dealing with extremists who want to escalate the situation (Thunder Bluff exiles) and a level head. Crucially, experience as a diplomat, and a good working relationship with the senior leaders of the Alliance, particularly Anduin.Zhaoling127 13 Nov 2018
13 Nov 2018 Horde: where is the tech? All the Iron Horde technology that Garrosh brought with him, all of that was from us originally was it not? Via the Iron Star engine. Where is it? I see precious little walking around Orgrimmar to remind me of the firepower we have. Some old Demolishers parked near the back door is all I can find.. There’s the Sky Gunship I guess but, where are the tanks? The artillery? One of the main things I loved in WOD was all this awesome crude coal-powered technology, the coal-fires tanks, launchers, etc. Especially with the Mag’har officially with us now, where is it?Grimgar8 13 Nov 2018
13 Nov 2018 The truth of Wrathgate, at last. "I've heard these discussions on the internet about 'she's going off the rails', but is she? I've been writing Sylvanas personally since 2006, and this is pretty much - the Wrathgate and the Blight and the Forsaken - in character. Those were all under Sylvanas' orders. What we're seeing now is an escalation of the plans Sylvanas has, clearly, and we're in the middle of that." Your thoughts?Taxania127 13 Nov 2018
12 Nov 2018 Will Warcraft:Reforged retcon lore? I just think that it would be very convenient for Blizzard to make small but significant changes to the story of Warcraft: Reforged. Mainly because there are some inconsistencies with the lore right now and perhaps there are things they want to correct for future lore development. If they change anything, what do you think they'll change and why?Sinvara8 12 Nov 2018
12 Nov 2018 Future allied races possibilities. Yes, it's another allied race thread, but I want this one to be well argumented, a bit more than most I have seen. Since every race (from BC at least) seems to bring us an allied race, we can at least try to guess the next ones through the prism of the current ones. Orcs gave us the Mag'har, Humans the Kul'Tirans, Taurens the Highmountain, Dwarves the Dark Iron, etc, etc. Plus, we now know where we're heading, and we have enough informations to guess coherent future allied races regarding the lore, past or future. From here, some speculation regarding the lore and its evolution. SPOILER ALERT. On the Alliance side : Gnomes : We now know from the datamining of the next patches that we will get mecagnome models. Mekkatorque will be badly hurt during the attack on Zuldazar, and may lead him and/or his fellow gnomes to turn transhumanist, obviously giving us the opportunities to play mecanical gnomes. Night elves : This is a mystery to me. Maybe you guys could bring informations and ideas, because I really can't see. Maybe the Void Elves who are normally unrelated are supposed to fit this place. Regarding the current situation, they're pretty much an exiled nation that has been massively killed. They feel abandoned by the Alliance, and only the Worgens agree to help them take back their homeland. I've heard some people talking about Night Elf Worgens, but I don't see what such an allied race would bring the current Worgens don't. Maybe an even more nature-oriented subrace / evolution / allied race? Or nothing? Other possible allied races for the Alliance : The Broken : The Alliance got half its allied race from the attack on Argus. The Broken could be a fitting race for joining the Alliance. They're basically Draeneis without the light, and have been around before World of Warcraft, in the classic Warcraft games. Not only this, but they have their own mounts, a unique lore, could bring a new shaman, a new rogue, and a somewhat monsterish contribution to the Alliance. Their close ties with the Draeneis are enough to justify their addition to the Alliance. The Sethrak : The Sethrak are more or less considered to be a future allied race because everyone know the Volduni will join the Horde at some point. They have a unique lore, unique mounts, and could bring an additional non-human looking race to the Alliance. Not only this, but they perfectly fit the "highly noble, sometimes arrogant" trait some Alliance races have. Two problems, though. 1 : There's currently no particular relationship between the Alliance and the Sethraks, be it politically, or through a blood tie. The Sethrak have had their own "Zul", the betrayer figure they fought to deliver themselves from his tyrannical rule. The Horde actually fought him. We'd need a vast evolution of the current lore to justify them joining the Alliance. The Vulpera and the Sethrak have been enemies, and even though a minor faction of the Sethrak fought with the Vulpera to deliver themselves, there may still be animosity between those two. The Vulpera joining the Horde may lead to some problems. 2 : Their models. Even though they have tons of animations and their own skelettons, some people are afraid their head might pose a problem when it comes to armor and clothes. The High Elves : The High Elves are well known for their close ties with the Alliance. But I don't think they will ever officially join the Alliance as an Allied Race, as long as their model is the same as the Blood Elves, who are basically High Elves with green (and recently yellow) eyes. They basically bring nothing new to the game, and the Alliance already has Void Elves. A future evolution of this race, both in terms of lore and esthetics, might lead to a more interesting addition. On the Horde side : Forsaken : The Forsaken are currently thriving. Sylvanas is the current warchief of the Horde, and everyone knows she is far more interested in serving her people than the Horde as a whole. Even though the Forsaken, being undeads, have no particular tie to any possible allied race, their ability to raise the dead may lead to a whole new perspective for them. In term of lore, massively rising the dead is completely justified, considering the impossibility for the Forsaken to reproduce. I see two possibilities right now : 1 : A human skeletton based model, just like Nathanos. Those somewhat "fresh" undeads would not only have a leader (Nathanos), but their racial aesthetic identity would be easy to find, as their racial armor would basically be, again, just like Nathanos. There's a problem, though : humans are classicaly an Alliance race, and having perfectly human looking undeads in the Horde would look as weird as having Lightforged Orcs in the Alliance. I'm not sure they would bring anything new to the game, and would be poorly justified lorewise. 2 : Night Elves undeads. After the attack on Teldrassil, there are plenty, plenty, PLENTY of Night elves corpses ready to be raised. Not only is this justified lorewise, but the result may be incredibly badass if the aesthetics is not "just a Night Elf Deathknight", but a brand new model. Blizzard has shown us they could make creepy elves with the depraved and arcane hungry Nightbornes in Legion. But, again, there's a problem : the forsaken are not forced to fight for the Horde, when they are raised again. What they do with their "life" is their own business, and if they don't want to join Sylvanas, they're completely free to do so. The Night Elves have been massacred and humiliated by the Forsaken, and I can't see them joining their butcherers with a big smile on their face. Seeing where Sylvanas seems to go, she could still find a way, but it has to be a freaking big one in order to be coherent lorewise. Considering the goblins, just like the worgens, they're Cataclysm addition, and for now, no allied race has ever been brought by a post BC race. And I can't really see what they could bring. Those green lil'!@#$ers only think about themselves anyway, and the Worgens are already looking like an allied race lorewise. Other possible allied races for the Horde : The Vulpera : Obviously. Not only have they been saved by the Horde, but this ferocious yet fragile race is in grave danger, even though the Sethrak Tyrant threat has been dealt with. Their skeletton pose no problem whatsoever, being the same as the goblins. Lorewise, we now know (again, spoiler alert) that, in the next patch, Alduin will talk about them, fearing the probability of the Vulpera joining the Horde, and orders to the Alliance to politically prevent such event. We all know what's gonna happen, considering the Volduni's mentality and past (such an incursion of the Alliance in Vol'Dun could make the Sethrak interested with them. See : Sethraks). The Vulpera have their own mount, their own culture, and could bring a cute (yet ferocious) addition to the Horde. We can only hope for Vulpera druids, now ! The Half Ogres : Rexxar has officially sided with the Horde, and has been granted quite a good looking model. The Half Ogres, or Mok'Nathal, could be, lorewise, a minor addition to the Horde in term of number, but a great one in term of strength. I don't see any problem with them siding with the Horde as a very minor playable allied race, since the Void Elves have joined the Alliance. The problems anyone could raise (lack of mount, society, architecture, etc) can be raised for the Void Elves too. Rexxar could represent the Horde, and negotiate with his father to implement those big boys in the Horde. P.S : The Mok'Nathal seem to be able to practice druidic magic ! The Ogres : The Ogres and the Horde didn't have, as a whole, a nice history. The Ogres enslaved the orcs, and waged war at basically everyone for quite a long time. A minor faction of the Ogres have, however, already fought alongside the Horde and proved to be great allies. Lorewise, they could represent an official addition to the Horde, but something would have to justify them doing so, especially in times of war and Sylvanas leadership. The only problem I see is aesthetic. The Ogres are just super tall and big, and we have yet to see female Ogres. Plus, they all look the same, and would need a massive graphic enhancement to be playable. Tell me your own ideas, if you want to complete, or propose another allied race, based on actual arguments and contradictions !Locklewix13 12 Nov 2018
12 Nov 2018 The BfA pattern Take a look at this interaction from the Horde side of the Dakshore Warfront, starting at 0:18 Sira: "Show no mercy, for you can expect none from Maiev." Maiev, a second later: "Sira... No... Turn back now, or I will be forced to strike you down." This is the pure essence of BfA. Bad writing, logically inconsistent, lack of continuity, a disconnect between what the world is showing us and what the characters say plus the Horde champions telling us how dangerous the Alliance is, followed up by the Alliance doing all they can to avoid conflict. That, and characters acting in a way that does not fit their previous characterization. Seriously, the writers cannot even keep a two-sentence dialogue consistent. This expansion is so damn hilarious.Darvingar24 12 Nov 2018
12 Nov 2018 Can we rewrite Jaina’s Song? ( Daughter of the Sea) Hi everyone, I just watched Warbringers: Jaina and thought about how this old sailor song was changed by Jaina’s betrayal. In Warbringers we hear the sailors sing of her betrayal, where it was a childrens lullaby when little Jaina sang it first with her father. Now that Jaina has become the new Lord Admiral, it would be weird for the Kul Tirans to keep singing their old version. So imagine being a Kul Tiran for a moment ( which a lot of you will be once we get to play them), do you have a version or a few lines you’d like to be brought into the song, from a story perspective. I’ll try to start: Beware, beware, the Daughter of the Sea. Beware I heard him cry. How wrong, we were, when she first came to port. But she came, and turned our tide. Real curious to hear if people have some funny or creative input here, all from a story perspective ofcourse.Draedir4 12 Nov 2018
12 Nov 2018 What common beliefs do you disagree with? What common beliefs or interpretations of the lore do you disagree with? Try to focus on common, frequently posted opinions about the lore that you find posted here or elsewhere. What commonly held beliefs do you disagree with, or what beliefs do you have that make your feel like you're in the minority? Try to avoid criticising others for what they disagree with, by the way. Let's avoid turning this into another flame war if we can.Taxania40 12 Nov 2018
12 Nov 2018 Would the Loa/Wild Gods... ...take a side? If the Zandalari and the Night elves came to fight each other directly, would for example Bwonsamdi and Cenarius fight each other? Goldrinn and Kimbul? Or Krag’wa and Ursoc? Must say it would be awesome witnessing it.Zarao58 12 Nov 2018
12 Nov 2018 The defenders of Dazar’alor An entire army with a snap of his fingers. Is Bwonsamdi particularly powerful as a Loa? Rezan didn’t pull this kind of stuff....Zarao26 12 Nov 2018
12 Nov 2018 How to save the story of BfA Desperate times call for desperate measures, my friends. Like King Rastakhan had to consort with the Loa of Death to save his empire, so too must we call upon the website of death to save the story. Tumblr. I mean, BfA could be easily read as white supremacist propaganda. The Alliance is shown as perfect and good, and what do most Alliance races have in common? They are white, based on European cultures. And their leader is a blonde blue-eyed Аrуаn. And perhaps it is no coincidence then that the only non-European Alliance race - the night elves - are shown as pathetic and weak. Meanwhile, the Horde is made up of vaguely Asian orcs, African trolls, Native American tauren, Jewish goblins, and Middle Eastern-ish blood elves. All of these races are portrayed as bloodthirsty savages, only capable of good deeds while under the guidance of the blonde blue-eyed Аrуаn Anduin. Only the Forsaken do not really fit into this narrative, but then we could portray them as a metaphor for Jews or something. If we construe it the right way, we could start a riot on Tumblr, and scare Blizzard into actually making the conflict morally gray.Ashval11 12 Nov 2018
12 Nov 2018 Tyrande and Anduin cutscene was just datamined. Discuss.Zakkaru74 12 Nov 2018
12 Nov 2018 Will the Darkspear suffer from Zandalari? A little piece of speculation... The Darkspears ,under leadership of Vol'jin, founded their rightfully place within the Horde, and is also a well respected people within the faction as they're part of the "original" force. We even had a Darkspear as Warchief (RIP Vol'jin and damn you Blizz!) I wonder if the Darkspear, in one way or another, will politically losing their grounds when the Zandalari are joining the Horde? I mean, isn't the Zandalari lorewise a greater force to reckon with than the Darkspear tribe? And Sylvanas as Warchief could admire the Zandalari more as they can provide the Horde with the fleet they need, greater numbers in soldiers, bigger war-troll-stuff like giant dinosaurs etc... I know people are saying that all the allied races are a great minority, but the Zandalari is a strong people, very strong. Rokhan is nice and all, but he dosen't have the same authority as Vol'jin had.Grimblin6 12 Nov 2018
12 Nov 2018 Logic and consistency Amazing, logical lore decisions recently... Sylvanas and the Forsaken: we must kill the Alliance because they would never truly trust and accept us as undead and will eventually exterminate our race. Also Sylvanas and the Forsaken: ooohhh.. let's raise Derek and have him return to the Alliance, who will trust him so that he can betray them from within. Slight exaggeration to prove a point. That the Alliance hates undeath only when the writers need it to manufacture some faction conflict.Oakbark9 12 Nov 2018
12 Nov 2018 Lost art piece of Sargeras There was a piece of Sargeras, where he sits on his throne and appears to be weeping in despair. If anyone could find it for me I'd thank. I've not been able to find it, and I think it was really really old, like from times of TBC or something.Devyx17 12 Nov 2018
11 Nov 2018 ETA on a new Lore Q&A? I really want one, so many questions toask, would love their insights , even if they just answer on the forum like they did in the past. When was the last one? 3 years ago?Kalibas1 11 Nov 2018
11 Nov 2018 Keep the NPCs in the next expansion? Hey guys, I figured that I quite enjoy Nathanos on the horde side, he brings a nice Lucasarts TIE Fighter vibe to the whole story ("you will serve the emperor or die" that kinda thing). I like Flynn on the alliance side even more, he's the most enjoyable NPC that I met in game probably for years. The reason is most likely because he does not take himself (or the whole game world) too seriously. It is a real treat after listening to Illidan's grunting about not showing mercy to the legion, for months. I am also trying to level an alt, during which I got back to WoD and got reminded how much I liked Yrel's storyline on the alliance side. It's really a bummer that that was her only part. Which brings me to the point: is there any hope to keep some of the NPCs (dunno, the fan favorites?) going in the next expansions, and give them a more active role? Development time was spent on making these characters likeable and building a story arch for them. Who says they wouldn't fit into a new expansion with a bit of creativity? Well, my 2 cents on the valuable connection that players build with particularly fun NPCs. Even if they are not main characters of the Warcraft storyline, they might play a role. (Also, it might be more realistic and more relatable than hanging out with Anduin, Jaina, Sylvanas, and the rest of the biggest heroes of the world.)Sylphiel45 11 Nov 2018
11 Nov 2018 Illidan vs Turalyon Who do you think would win if those two actually fought?Solanis49 11 Nov 2018
10 Nov 2018 Thrall, THERE IS STILL HOPE! YAS! But maybe. STILL YAS!Nobal17 10 Nov 2018
10 Nov 2018 Future of the Night Warriors In 8.1. Tyrande will do a ritual and will become a Night Warrior. She will become Vengeance of Kaldorei, taking powers from evil dark side of the Elune, to have revenge. On Blizzcone Blizzard told: "We’re building foundations for future stories." - knowing Blizzard, in other words Tyrande will become evil, and will die in a raid. But what about players? Players also can be Night Warriors! What you think, will Blizzard take possibility to be Night Warrior from players in future? And also, will Night Warriors be just a small group of elite warriors, and majority of Night Elves will have white eyes, or majority of Night Elves will have those dark skin and eyes aka Drows?Призраклеса33 10 Nov 2018
10 Nov 2018 Gul'dan's Clan So I discovered that Gul'dana is a name in Tatarstan and Kazakhstan (you know, the regions that were once central parts of the Golden Horde). A female one, but still. You know what it means? "Flower-sage". Could Gul'dan be once part of the infamous Flowerpicker clan?Ashval3 10 Nov 2018
10 Nov 2018 R/WoW Interview story related Hey guys, just seen this: and want to quote the Story-part for descussion here: ... Especially the last point is great. And we all have seen it in action (Tyrande may thank you here) I am a bit confused by point 3. Lows and Highs are great If Blizzard follows its agenda and offers both factions their lows and highs. But at the moment both factions are at their low. Lot of Horde players have their low because of: beeing mindless villian again, beeing forced into inernal conflicts again. Getting own capital raided again, and even wins feel like low because of beeing a contributor to genocide and so on. The alliance list of lows is at least as large as hordes (as far as I, as non alliance player, understand). Just to write some of them down (dont judge me by this points, as said, im not an alliance player): nelf treatment incompitent leaders completely irrational fightplans (hey the enemy is on the ground, lets run away!) goody two shoeses image (and i guess much more) So both factions need their high (soon?) but how could blizzard give it to both without giving the opposite factions a low? No Idea. Or does blizzard count burnig the tree as Horde high? and retreating after (nearly) win in horde city as alliance high? I hope not.Moradur19 10 Nov 2018
10 Nov 2018 Let’s talk about Warcraft super heroes I like that Warcraft story does have super heroes. I also like there are characters and individuals that are more powerful than the player character That the player character can look up to That are the ultimate of what they stand for. Warcraft can have super heroes, like we do in Marvel comics and D.C Universe as well as others. This is good to have, but I like that it is only a part of wow’s narrative, the player hero is another , and Ofc world threats. Super heroes in Warcraft don’t have to be cringeworthy and they don’t have to be the same either. Some can have lots of things going for them, some can have little, so don’t even need to have special powers although that is impossibly rare in Warcraft that doesn’t really focus on ordinary people. I played classic wow, and was dismayed not to ever see the Wc3 heroes in action, I was also dismayed when they over did Thrall, but left Tyrande doing Zero till a small crap scene in MoP. I have mixed feelings on how they have handled their super heroes, it’s been bad more than it’s been good, but it is getting better and having more good showings than bad. I’d say I’m glad they are round and blizzard shouldn’t give up trying to do them well and fitting, and of also progressing them.Trubbles6 10 Nov 2018
10 Nov 2018 Sylvanas Supporters: What do you think will happen? What do you think will happen if Sylvanas would defeat the Alliance? If the Threat that made her seek for protection is gone? When the Only threat left for her life, the only thing that could bring her the death she is so terrified of, are the living races of the Horde? Do you actually belive Sylvanas would just sit back and say "Ah, they wont go against me, we can all live in peace now that the Alliance is gone."? Do you really think she wont blight every living city after she has nothing left to fear from the Alliance?Xemeron88 10 Nov 2018
10 Nov 2018 Spoiler : Lichking, lichqueen and Ebon Blade I hope the Titel is not clickbait , since I just didn’t want to spoil how Vol Jin and the other meet the Lichking. He tells them the Lichqueen is disturbing the balance of life and death. I can’t see any reason why the Lichking is not asking the Ebonblade to kill sylvanas. They are at the top of their strength and sylvanas is not able to fight at two fronts. What will she do banshee scream at deathknights who can shift in and out of the shadowlands to attack ?Kappador13 10 Nov 2018