Legion Single player or MMO?

General
In the build up to Legion's release I've loved being part of the invasions, being part of something big with everyone contributing to the effort. Much like the Gates of Ahn'Qiraj and the Isle of Quel'danas it made me feel as though I was part of the world and not the special snowflake that started somewhat with Cata and continued into Pandaria, WOD and now Legion want me to be.

There's a real dichotomy here and while I enjoy the storytelling mechanics that have evolved from Cata, I again am feeling less like part of a multiplayer world event and more like I'm in a single player game which in terms immersion gets broken as soon as you see every other player who is also supreme commander of the Horde or Alliance with their own special snowflake weapon.

So I'm wondering where other players stand on this issue, do you find the single player narrative immersion breaking and would you rather be part of the world rather than the focus of it.

Just curious. :)
I still feel about as insignificant as always in the grand sceme of things.
There is nothing better than a dungeon/raid/world boss or another player with better stuff than you to completely shake off any illusion of a single player game
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wH8M-Cc5wlk

This video pretty much sums up the "random adventurer" storytelling. While I understand why people want to be just random character instead of important lore figures, we have come to a point where our characters saved the world multiple times. If I killed Deathwing, I would not pick up goat !@#$ for some farmer.

Also, there has been interesting example of this storytelling in WotLK. When we came to Borean Tundra, Garrosh didn´t recognize us and he even sent us to suicide mission and considered us to be just some random stupid whelp (at least that´s what I was told, I never did BT completely). This has happened during expansion with no level boost, so those characters were the same ones who helped Mag´har in Nagrand. But, because they were just random adventurers, they weren´t recognized as savior of Mag´har by Mag´har chieftan.
One of my (personal) favourite things about Legion is that so much of the experience can naturally be shared with other players now.

For example, mobs are faction-tapped now, so if you're out questing and you see someone who's pulled a bit too much and is struggling - you can jump in and help and you'll also get EXP and loot. Likewise if you see some players taking on an elite, you can jump right in and assist them, no need to be in a party anymore.

Gathering nodes are personal, so there's no need for people to be "that guy" who waits for someone to pull the mobs around the node, before running in and harvesting the node. Now you can help each other and both get the node.

Admittedly these might not be as grand in scale as invasions (for example), but they're still nice little changes that hopefully encourage more spontaneous playing together while out in the Broken Isles.
Being the commander goes against the story of most of my characters. It breaks the immersion because I feel I need to separate the story I'm experiencing from the narrative of the character. At least I have to disregard part of it. But the worst is seeing dozens of hatis or ashbringers around. Just seems silly. And not special at all.

01/09/2016 18:28Posted by Aerythlea
For example, mobs are faction-tapped now, so if you're out questing and you see someone who's pulled a bit too much and is struggling - you can jump in and help and you'll also get EXP and loot. Likewise if you see some players taking on an elite, you can jump right in and assist them, no need to be in a party anymore.
For me it's not the mechanics that are single player, but the narrative. The improved mechanics are one of the things I love about this expansion for sure.
01/09/2016 18:26Posted by Dorlas
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wH8M-Cc5wlk

This video pretty much sums up the "random adventurer" storytelling. While I understand why people want to be just random character instead of important lore figures, we have come to a point where our characters saved the world multiple times. If I killed Deathwing, I would not pick up goat !@#$ for some farmer.

Also, there has been interesting example of this storytelling in WotLK. When we came to Borean Tundra, Garrosh didn´t recognize us and he even sent us to suicide mission and considered us to be just some random stupid whelp (at least that´s what I was told, I never did BT completely). This has happened during expansion with no level boost, so those characters were the same ones who helped Mag´har in Nagrand. But, because they were just random adventurers, they weren´t recognized as savior of Mag´har by Mag´har chieftan.

If your character has done the Mag'har questline then Garrosh has a different initial text where he greets you more respectfuly but then advices you to turn back cause things are apparently too nasty in Northrend.
01/09/2016 18:30Posted by Korrina
But the worst is seeing dozens of hatis or ashbringers around. Just seems silly. And not special at all.


Funny thing is that since we can all be made to see other players as Dalaran mages simply by drinking a potion or not to see each others gear by wearing goggles, it shouldn't be technically impossible to see someone else's Ashbringer as a random 2H weapon or Hati as just some wolf. In Draenor this worked well many times while escorting my pet hate Yrel. Only I had Yrel, others had just some draenei without a name.
Well, look at it this way. Immersion is broken, you feel lonely and isolated. Your addiction to the game begins to dissolve and you know better the next time. Not as much drama and sadness when you uninstall. And you are more resistant to the hype next time.
01/09/2016 18:28Posted by Aerythlea
One of my (personal) favourite things about Legion is that so much of the experience can naturally be shared with other players now.

For example, mobs are faction-tapped now, so if you're out questing and you see someone who's pulled a bit too much and is struggling - you can jump in and help and you'll also get EXP and loot. Likewise if you see some players taking on an elite, you can jump right in and assist them, no need to be in a party anymore.

Gathering nodes are personal, so there's no need for people to be "that guy" who waits for someone to pull the mobs around the node, before running in and harvesting the node. Now you can help each other and both get the node.

Admittedly these might not be as grand in scale as invasions (for example), but they're still nice little changes that hopefully encourage more spontaneous playing together while out in the Broken Isles.


I agree these are very useful mechanics but I was for focused on narrative and my characters place with the narrative as well as interaction with other players :)

01/09/2016 19:15Posted by Eldranovelia
Well, look at it this way. Immersion is broken, you feel lonely and isolated. Your addiction to the game begins to dissolve and you know better the next time. Not as much drama and sadness when you uninstall. And you are more resistant to the hype next time.


I'm sorry I don't know what you mean...?
as i type this i am standing on Margoss' little island off of Dalaran fishing for drown mana alongside around 30 other fishers. so no, it's not a single player game. everyone around me is talking in /say
@Aerythlea you basically confirmed WoW being focused on isolating players and eliminating need for interaction beyond mandatory grouping such as raids...

every player-player interaction is considered griefing and eliminated. this game won't be an MMO until you add massive open world PvP content which encourages players killing each other but is not directly about rewarding killing.
01/09/2016 18:28Posted by Aerythlea
One of my (personal) favourite things about Legion is that so much of the experience can naturally be shared with other players now.

For example, mobs are faction-tapped now, so if you're out questing and you see someone who's pulled a bit too much and is struggling - you can jump in and help and you'll also get EXP and loot. Likewise if you see some players taking on an elite, you can jump right in and assist them, no need to be in a party anymore.

Gathering nodes are personal, so there's no need for people to be "that guy" who waits for someone to pull the mobs around the node, before running in and harvesting the node. Now you can help each other and both get the node.

Admittedly these might not be as grand in scale as invasions (for example), but they're still nice little changes that hopefully encourage more spontaneous playing together while out in the Broken Isles.


I love that as well. It's so natural to do the quests/rare/events since anyone can just jump in and get the rewards.

On topic of the narrative: I found that its working well with me so far. A number of the story sections are actually crossrealmed already so you dont feel as alone. Others feel more epic because its just you (''Exodar'' for example).

I think they did a great job of making the story NPCs feel like actualy party members now.
... It's an MMO, you can't beat content and get the best rewards without other players, there's tons of other people out in the world...

I'm as social and dependant on other players in Legion as ever before, and now there's the added feeling that other players are not competition for quest mobs, rares and gathering nodes.

As for the story, it doesn't change mechanics of the game. You might be hailed as a commander and leader, but you still need those other heroes. No one defeats the biggest enemies alone.
01/09/2016 19:49Posted by Rorcanna
... It's an MMO, you can't beat content and get the best rewards without other players, there's tons of other people out in the world...


which makes it a co-op game with dalaran being the lobby.
01/09/2016 18:28Posted by Aerythlea
One of my (personal) favourite things about Legion is that so much of the experience can naturally be shared with other players now.

For example, mobs are faction-tapped now, so if you're out questing and you see someone who's pulled a bit too much and is struggling - you can jump in and help and you'll also get EXP and loot. Likewise if you see some players taking on an elite, you can jump right in and assist them, no need to be in a party anymore.

Gathering nodes are personal, so there's no need for people to be "that guy" who waits for someone to pull the mobs around the node, before running in and harvesting the node. Now you can help each other and both get the node.

Admittedly these might not be as grand in scale as invasions (for example), but they're still nice little changes that hopefully encourage more spontaneous playing together while out in the Broken Isles.


One problem with tap system is that it's not sharable across realms and most of zones are cross-realm zones :)
01/09/2016 17:50Posted by Dvalin
In the build up to Legion's release I've loved being part of the invasions, being part of something big with everyone contributing to the effort. Much like the Gates of Ahn'Qiraj and the Isle of Quel'danas it made me feel as though I was part of the world and not the special snowflake that started somewhat with Cata and continued into Pandaria, WOD and now Legion want me to be.

There's a real dichotomy here and while I enjoy the storytelling mechanics that have evolved from Cata, I again am feeling less like part of a multiplayer world event and more like I'm in a single player game which in terms immersion gets broken as soon as you see every other player who is also supreme commander of the Horde or Alliance with their own special snowflake weapon.

So I'm wondering where other players stand on this issue, do you find the single player narrative immersion breaking and would you rather be part of the world rather than the focus of it.

Just curious. :)


Exactly my thoughts on Invasion. Just immense amount of fun. I just really hope they will make them into weekly event
I agree that It'd be more immersive being a soldier struggling against the Legion together with countless other soldiers rather than being the special snowflake among millions of special snowflakes.

The result is the same except that you don't have to listen to all the cringy dialouge about how you're the savior of the world... this is especially cringy when you play an alt you just created and leveled up and arn't especially good at(and knowing that the character hasn't done anything special at all). Haha..
01/09/2016 20:48Posted by Udèd
I agree that It'd be more immersive being a soldier struggling against the Legion together with countless other soldiers rather than being the special snowflake among millions of special snowflakes.

The result is the same except that you don't have to listen to all the cringy dialouge about how you're the savior of the world... this is especially cringy when you play an alt you just created and leveled up and arn't especially good at(and knowing that the character hasn't done anything special at all). Haha..


This, basically.
Game is single player to the max, no group quests, everyone phased out, leveling takes 1 days max then you wait for content. No world chats being used. Casual LFR, dungeon finder, I don't need anyone anymore to achieve everything, don't need to communicate anywhere either everything is in the dungeon journal etc...
I would love if they bring back the invasions! It was super fun!

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