The people who are complaining

General
Every time I see a post where people are complaining, specifically about being bored with legion, I have fun looking at their character profiles. A pattern emerges!

99% of these players who complain that they are growing tired of the content and have nothing to do have not actually done most of the content the expansion has to offer. No raid progression, no mythic+ dungeons (a lot of the time they haven't even done normal mythics) and no PvP.

Now I don't mean to speak for people and if you are bored then you have the right to feel that way. But I do urge you to try and branch out into more of the content the game has to offer. If I was to log on every day only to do world quests and rep grinds I would have quit long ago.

Legion has its faults - no expansion has not, but right now I'm just having so much fun planning mythic+ runs with my friends, discussing raid tactics with my guild and achieving a sense of personal progression.

I am by no means a hardcore or even good player. I'm probably very average, but I am still finding many opportunities to explore all that this expansion has to offer.
I see where you´re coming from. Maybe that kind of content doesn´t appeal to them :p
They have a ton of things to do, they just don't want to do it. So they expect Blizzard to tailor some new content to them. It's like the kids today, they have a lot of toys to play with but they still complain that they don't have anything to do. They "demand" their parents activate them 100% of the time and figure out what they should do.

Legion offers a wide range of things to do, more so than any other expansion has done on launch, with raids, mythic and mythic+, world quests and also a major incentive to make alts (to see the other artifacts and class halls). My guess is that Blizzard could have made even more content and people would still "be bored". Some can't be satisfied and will always find something to complain about.
These threads always follow the same pattern really.

Non-Raiders will say they want high quality open world content, and some will resent that they cannot just toddle of and craft etc and say that the open world content is poor/shallow and gated behind content they have no interest in.

Raiders will say that's the main part of the game, and usually someone will pipe up 'its an mmo'

Then someone will actually explain what an mmo is

Repeat this to eternity. With neither side of the argument willing to understand the other.

At the end of the day, it is clear that blizzard has designed an expansion with a focus on ...encouraging people to play all aspects of the expansion instead of cherry picking what they like

Only time will tell whether players will leave their comfort zones and enjoy it, or unsub. What we say here- i doubt anyone even reads it...all that will matter to blizzard is whether people stay subbed.
26/09/2016 11:16Posted by Zavian
I see where you´re coming from. Maybe that kind of content doesn´t appeal to them :p


Fair enough, everyone has different tastes. I think the point I was trying to get at was that it seemed a lot of them had not even attempted the content to see if it actually appealed to them or not.

They have the right to state that they are unhappy with the content that they are doing, but do not have a legitimate argument when they say that the expansion, as a whole, is boring if they have not done what the expansion, as a whole, has to offer.
26/09/2016 11:26Posted by Octarine
26/09/2016 11:16Posted by Zavian
I see where you´re coming from. Maybe that kind of content doesn´t appeal to them :p


Fair enough, everyone has different tastes. I think the point I was trying to get at was that it seemed a lot of them had not even attempted the content to see if it actually appealed to them or not.


I tried it since i felt gimped without class/profession no doubt ill get responses of

'you suck omg git gud' but what the heck, my experience as a new player with no experience of these things (since i pvp mostly) doing random groups below

I main a holy paladin...traditionally i gear completely through pvp, but as instances are pretty much required to do anything i gave it a try

First random group was actually ok, second one was to help a guild mate who had never done a dungeon ..we did it on heroic and again no problem

Onto my third, random group... dps was constantly standing in crap and when i ask them to move out i get spammed with dps counters and whispers...after popping pots galore and cd's i get through it but dont enjoy it at all

Fourth random group... a 'go go go ' tank leads, pulling absolutely everything he can and again i get through it without anyone dying but find it stressful not fun.

Fifth and final try...i get hit by a boulder on the final staircase and catapulted into trash at the bottom, the tank proceeds to pull anyway, and dies because im stuck at the bottom of the staircase.

Cue tank death and abusive whispers, at this point i decide i never want to heal a random group again

But, the time investment ive put into the character is huge for me, and the last thing i want to do is start again.

If i could go into BG without being gimped i would do so and be a happy player, but that is not an option with this xpac
26/09/2016 11:26Posted by Octarine
...

Fair enough, everyone has different tastes. I think the point I was trying to get at was that it seemed a lot of them had not even attempted the content to see if it actually appealed to them or not.


I tried it since i felt gimped without class/profession no doubt ill get responses of

'you suck omg git gud' but what the heck, my experience as a new player doing random groups below

I main a holy paladin...traditionally i gear completely through pvp, but as instances are pretty much required to do anything i gave it a try

First random group was actually ok, second one was to help a guild mate who had never done a dungeon ..we did it on heroic and again no problem

Onto my third, random group... dps was constantly standing in crap and when i ask them to move out i get spammed with dps counters and whispers...after popping pots galore and cd's i get through it but dont enjoy it at all

Fourth random group... a 'go go go ' tank leads, pulling absolutely everything he can and again i get through it without anyone dying but find it stressful not fun.

Fifth and final try...i get hit by a boulder on the final staircase and catapulted into trash at the bottom, the tank proceeds to pull anyway, and dies because im stuck at the bottom of the staircase.

Cue tank death and abusive whispers, at this point i decide i never want to heal a random group again

But, the time investment ive put into the character is huge for me, and the last thing i want to do is start again.

If i could go into BG without being gimped i would do so and be a happy player, but that is not an option with this xpac


You make a valid point. I do not really believe players should be forced to do something they do not enjoy in order to do an activity that they do enjoy. And toxic experiences with pugs are always the worst :(

Of course players should also not expect to gain the same rewards by doing a certain activity as someone doing another activity. The level of reward ideally should be linked to the effort and skill put into the activity to encourage player progression and growth. (This isn't linked to your comment specifically, just my general opinion)
And I noticed another pattern, 99% of the people who complain about complainers seem to have a very solid opinion about what others should enjoy - in 99% of the cases it's always about instanced content. Or is it my idea?
26/09/2016 11:55Posted by Lumeny
And I noticed another pattern, 99% of the people who complain about complainers seem to have a very solid opinion about what others should enjoy - in 99% of the cases it's always about instanced content. Or is it my idea?


No one is telling what others should enjoy. The problem is that people are complaining that they are bored because there's nothing to do. When pointed out what they can do, they retort with "I don't want to do that".

That's the core issue with the "I don't have anything to do", there's things to do but you don't want to do that. Which also leads to the question; how many things must be added to the game before you "enjoy" or "find something to do"? And follow up to that; how long will you enjoy doing that before you're bored again and "don't have anything to do"?
Having to do PVE to gear for pvp is absolutely fine. Know why? Pvp is just a minigame. Raiding is the meat of the game, and the only respectable path of endgame. Before we've had people getting the most welfare of welfare gear from pvp that's equivalant to HC level loot within an hour of sitting afk in random battlegrounds. That's not good.
...

I tried it since i felt gimped without class/profession no doubt ill get responses of

'you suck omg git gud' but what the heck, my experience as a new player doing random groups below

I main a holy paladin...traditionally i gear completely through pvp, but as instances are pretty much required to do anything i gave it a try

First random group was actually ok, second one was to help a guild mate who had never done a dungeon ..we did it on heroic and again no problem

Onto my third, random group... dps was constantly standing in crap and when i ask them to move out i get spammed with dps counters and whispers...after popping pots galore and cd's i get through it but dont enjoy it at all

Fourth random group... a 'go go go ' tank leads, pulling absolutely everything he can and again i get through it without anyone dying but find it stressful not fun.

Fifth and final try...i get hit by a boulder on the final staircase and catapulted into trash at the bottom, the tank proceeds to pull anyway, and dies because im stuck at the bottom of the staircase.

Cue tank death and abusive whispers, at this point i decide i never want to heal a random group again

But, the time investment ive put into the character is huge for me, and the last thing i want to do is start again.

If i could go into BG without being gimped i would do so and be a happy player, but that is not an option with this xpac


You make a valid point. I do not really believe players should be forced to do something they do not enjoy in order to do an activity that they do enjoy. And toxic experiences with pugs are always the worst :(

Of course players should also not expect to gain the same rewards by doing a certain activity as someone doing another activity. The level of reward ideally should be linked to the effort and skill put into the activity to encourage player progression and growth. (This isn't linked to your comment specifically, just my general opinion)


I dont think you will find many arguing against that, the guys who sit planning their raids and coordinating it through teamspeak or whatever should absolutely get the best gear.

However the difference for me with this expansion is that the gating is very very early and on very basic stuff.

Raiders may well find it odd that someone just wants to do battlegrounds, or just likes exploring and questing, or just likes crafting...but those people exist, and i suspect in larger numbers than people realize.

It is my feeling that blizzard have designed the expansion to make people do instanced content because the reality is there is very little else with any depth to see...

As for toxic pugs..to be honest i dont know if i was unlucky, or my last 3 runs were typical. I do know it has put me off completely though. I can see why there is a healer shortage.

But as i said my opinion doesnt matter, all that will matter is the sub numbers, and i really dont want to get into arguments over it all, those enjoying themselves...i am glad for you :)
26/09/2016 11:58Posted by Melthazina
No one is telling what others should enjoy. The problem is that people are complaining that they are bored because there's nothing to do. When pointed out what they can do, they retort with "I don't want to do that".

That's the core issue with the "I don't have anything to do", there's things to do but you don't want to do that. Which also leads to the question; how many things must be added to the game before you "enjoy" or "find something to do"? And follow up to that; how long will you enjoy doing that before you're bored again and "don't have anything to do"?

Thing is, most of "you can do this" comes down to doing same content player has done before, but in different mode.

"I've done all dungeons, nothing else to do"
"But you can do same dungeons on mythic+!!!"

Doing same content on different setting is not new content. Its cheap illusion of content.
Find a guild of people who have the mindset of helping and getting better as a collective. Specially as a healer, randoms are cancer since most players cant avoid simple mechanics. I know, ive been healing the entire start of Legion and ever since tbc quite actively.

Now if i do say so myself, im an above avrage player. Meaning. I dont often get hit by avoidable mechanics, i cant remember when last i ninjapulled, i as a healer dispell within the second an ability lands, i interupt, i CC when needed, i can run into almost any encounter with 0 previous experience and learn it on the fly since im aware of the games mechanics and can see similarities in Bosses.

These things should be fairly comon to anyon after 6months of playing. Or in my case. Almost 12 years. But yu never see it. Healers dont dispell in randoms. DPS never interupt or CC/peel. Tanks dont move boss/adds to promote cleave, people cant avoid huge pools of fire and water moving slowly across the floor.

I think its that most mechanics are forgivable. You can get hit afew times and it wont be a Big deal since people assume its the healers job.

so i say again. If you play a healer. You should take time to find a guild with a good mindset to it. Very much like the one im in.
You can't make players enjoy themselves just by pointing out what they haven't done in a game. I am sure they are fully aware of what they have and haven't done but I guess in the end when you log and play your own style of game if it's not meeting your expectations then maybe that is when the players stops or channel hops. And then maybe that is when they come here to complain. The game ' has ' to maintain players attention or it will fail. And trust me, that is not the players fault.

And sorry, complaining about the complainers is only going to reinforce their own view and probably make them complain more... or worse, go play something else. Would be better to give them encouragement. Supporting this game is so important.

I am not complaining by the way. I haven't played Legion so can't even give my view on the expansion. I enjoy my Warcraft every single day. Always have. Maybe I'm easy to please. Can't complain.... Whoo hoo ship just landed gotta go. Crescent Thrown ... wouldn't you know. Packs to deliver.
26/09/2016 12:08Posted by Wipsie
Thing is, most of "you can do this" comes down to doing same content player has done before, but in different mode.

"I've done all dungeons, nothing else to do"
"But you can do same dungeons on mythic+!!!"

Doing same content on different setting is not new content. Its cheap illusion of content.


Thing is, that's an MMO, the very essence of any MMO, regardless of MMO out there. Doing the "same" content over and over with slight variations. I've played 2 other MMOs of lately, Guild wars 2 and The secret world. The core and the mode in these MMOs are more or less identical with World of Warcraft. Do quests, get XP, progress your character. Rinse and repeat until maxed out, at that point, do world content and dungeons for better gear.

It's impossible for any MMO company out there to hash out content faster than what the players can consume it and become "bored" of it. So rehashing content is one method of "extending" the lifespan of the content. Per example in The secret world you go back to do the old dungeons on a higher difficulty, sounds familiar? In Guild wars 2 you go through the same dungeons in a different route than the first "story clear", an "adventure mode" that takes your through a slightly different path. And lets just mix into another game, The elder scrolls: Online, at max level, veteran dungeons, more or less only rehashing of old dungeons done in normal mode.

So my point here is that repeating content and doing "the same" content is a core essence of any MMO. If people don't like the "rehashing" of old content then perhaps MMO isn't the genre for you. Sounds harsh, but unless you have a clever way of making new content faster than what players can consume and become bored of it, that's about the best solution I can come up with.
26/09/2016 11:13Posted by Octarine
But I do urge you to try and branch out into more of the content the game has to offer


Can we examine carefully what content Legion has to offer?

We have World Quests, but! They are recycled quests from leveling in zones we have already explored, does that count as content? It's not refreshing, we have already seen those 100 times. I enjoyed doing those a few times but they get boring after a while, i dare anyone to say otherwise.

We have Dungeons with a lot of difficulties but... it's always the same dungeons, same environment, same bosses, nothing new.

We don't have PvP in Legion.
We have battlegrounds from past expansions since Legion didn't add any PvP content, those do not count.
We have 1 PvP World Quests where we kill guards, cool i guess.

I want to hear from other peoples where is this fabled content they're claiming, i don't see it, please enlighten me.
The only thing im looking forward right now is the raid, nothing to complain about that, it's amazing and i'm having lot of fun with my guild, but what there is outside that?

Reputations?
Those do not exists in Legion, it's an illusion.
We don't have faction specific zones like in past expansions, rewards are disappointing with their toys and 820 gear, no mounts, no titles, they're just necessary for Pathfinder.

Pets?
That's fair, personally i never touched them, but still counts as content i guess.
After it taking 9 hours to kill 4 bosses on the emerald nightmare on normal, I think I've been put off going back into raiding until LFR. At least in brain dead mode I don't have to worry about playing with stupid people as they won't struggle either.
I know that might seem a bit rude but 9 hours... half of that because people kept running into people with the debuff on the Ursoc fight killing half the raid instantly or on the eye people trying to kill everything at once in the second phase 2 instead of working as a team... I don't wanna do it again...
And I don't want to do mythic+ because PuGs.
I would join a guild but last time I was in one I just got annoyed with people coming online and offline all day. Plus once I got the gear I wanted I would probably not be all that interested in going back in because I would have the rewards already.
26/09/2016 11:26Posted by Draine
Non-Raiders will say they want high quality open world content, and some will resent that they cannot just toddle of and craft etc and say that the open world content is poor/shallow and gated behind content they have no interest in.


But that's just it. This expansion caters to far more playstyles then just raiders. And when I say that it "caters", I don't just mean that there is a bunch of non-rewarding stuff to do which is not a raid. That's something every expansion had until now, even WoD (you could farm rep, but it was useless, and so on). This time around, non-raid content actually, for the first time in a long while, offers rewards that are almost on par (if not even at complete parity) with raiding. PvP - both Arenas and Rated Battlegrounds - can award super high item level items if you're high enough rated. Mythic+ dungeons can give gear on par with mythic raiding, at high enough difficulty. Even world quests, which are not exactly the peak of difficulty (that's not really the point to them - they're supposed to be little relaxing choirs for us to do) give on occasion really decent rewards. LFR will start next week for those not seeking difficulty. Raids themselves have multiple levels of difficulty, and mythic+ dungeons have even smoother scaling of difficulty.

So to sum it up, this expansion has:
- adequately rewarded content for raiders;
- adequately rewarded content for pvpers;
- adequately rewarded content for dungeoneers;
- adequately rewarded content for people who enjoy world quests.
- side little activities, such as pet battles and others.

Which makes me wonder, what exactly do people want, when they demand "more" content?
At some point as a player one must decide if this game is satisfying one´s needs, if for some reason you have come to the conclusion, just after 6 weeks, that none of the hundreds of things offered in-game suits you, maybe this particular game just isn't for you.
26/09/2016 13:14Posted by Ada
At some point as a player one must decide if this game is satisfying one´s needs, if for some reason you have come to the conclusion, just after 6 weeks, that none of the hundreds of things offered in-game suits you, maybe this particular game just isn't for you.


Of course :)

If your not having fun then it is silly to keep paying to play!

Sub numbers arent published anymore so it will be hard to tell how many decide its not for them anymore.

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