Havoc Discussions - 7.2.5 Mechanics and Feel

Legion Class Development
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The revert on the change to Demon Blades was probably the one thing I feel should have been avoided. Everything else would have been better to adjust if you wanted to change anything further.

With this revert, you have forced us into a spot where we still do not have the consistency to give you quality feedback. We will be giving you either really good feedback, because we had good luck, or absolutely terrible feedback, because we were forced to do nothing but wait for fury from Demon Blades again. The 60% proc rate of 12-20 leads to a feeling of "feast or famine," where you either are waiting on fury during your cooldowns due to no procs (either by AA misses or non procs), or you feel like you literally cannot spend all of your fury. This was mostly solved by the 100% proc rate, which, combined with the new 18 second duration chaos blades meant you would always have fury during your cooldowns, which lead to less feelsbad moments. Numerically, the two were basically equal, so it seems to be a mechanical only change - and one that seems to be a step backwards.

Also, the inconsistency of this implementation of Demon Blades swings the variance too far in the wrong direction. The stark difference between good and bad luck - which cannot be manipulated in any way by good or bad play - makes it very difficult for the average player to identify when things are actually going wrong, or when they had poor luck. This is exacerbated by healthy RNG elsewhere in the spec (read - Chaos Strike crits) that when combined has an unpleasant playstyle effect on players.

This is especially noticeable when you read feedback from players that identify the massive swings between positive and negative streaks of RNG during cooldowns - something that has by now become a core part of the specs gameplay.

For feedback on Prepared, Vengeful Retreat's cool-down of 15 seconds, and the 10 seconds it takes to receive the fury, is too long to be worthwhile to take. Over 1 minute, it only generates 400 fury, and that's assuming you can use it every time it is off cool-down, without delay, from the 0 second mark to the 60 second mark. When boss mechanics that require specific positioning are included in this situation, its fury generation decreases, since we may not be able to use it as often as necessary. We also run the risk of being out of boss range, or away from a priority target that needs to die quickly, because of Vengeful Retreat's movement.

The 100% Demon Blades was providing us with 409 Fury per minute, and the feeling of consistency we have been lacking for the majority of the expansion. It allows us to maintain specific positioning required for certain mechanics, as well as the ability to prepare ourselves in advance for burst phases on priority targets, by giving us a consistent resource generation to pool with.

I ask you to please reconsider this revert. I love this class, but eventually everyone gets tired of having a random number determine their fate. Please return Demon Blades to 100% chance, so that we can gain the consistency required to give you quality feedback on the performance of the class.


Kalino, Zarania, Wordup, Strifelol, Lazel, Fragnance and the DH Community

US Link : https://us.battle.net/forums/en/wow/topic/20755686344?page=1
I always think that some rng is nice for a class because if every single time exactly the same stuff happened then it would just be too straightforward. At the same time though I think that we have more than enough of that in one way or another and bringing the Demon Blades back to the way they were will just as stated make the class feel really bad and it will have a silly difference between a "lucky" and "unlucky" pull. What I mean with that is considering we are getting a legendary which is on paper really good for us and tied to rng (10% proc on blade dance) combine that with the fury generation with all the misses and that and then if you want to play lets say shoulders and you end up with a lot of rng tied to the spec.

The thing with that is if you get unlucky it will spiral down really quickly and you will just do horrible while on the other hand if you just get lucky you will be doing insane stuff (at least that's how I can see it) which in the long run if you are actually going for mythic progress and all that is just bad in many ways but that is how I see it. I really hope that we can get an answer at least why the change was reverted.
The changes looked promising, the set felt great - no major class changes (we were actually promised), but I was fine with that. I was looking forward to the patch, now I don't feel like playing at all.

We express our concerns in detailed threads and all we get is silence while other classes are getting endless paragraphs of explanations and insights on changes. I hope these changes are not meant to be taken seriously. I am actually so done right now.
Honestly, there have been times where I have just wanted to stop killing a boss because of no Fury. Gaining no Fury when I'm in meta then getting Fury capped outside meta, wants to make me KMS. Please stop with the RNG within Rng. This was the only change I was looking forward to this patch. I haven't been excited for a WoW update in a very long time, but this was certainly one of those times. At least address why this was reverted back to live.
Thank you.
agree with op :/
Bump, please reconsider this before it goes live and hit us up with a response because going from RNG on live to consistency on PTR felt great but now with this one change I've lost all hype I had for next patch.

Please reconsider, thank you.
This is a really well written post and i couldnt agree more
Well said, I agree to 100%!
I was so happy to finally get rid of the horrible RNG aspect of Demon Blades.
I really hope Blizzard reconsider the revert in the latest build
I couldn't agree more with Kalino and crew. We've got enough RNG from other sources. I don't understand why you would revert this, please explain at least.
well took the words right out of my mouth nice post i was going to whine but guess not lol
Yup, the demon blades nerf alongside the T20 nerf has just made our fury generation worse..

T19 > T20 at its current stage as well.

It's also pretty much nerfing "chaos theory" in a way.. since if you don't get that lucky RNG with demon blades during those 6 seconds, no fury for you. (Not that it's any good anyway, since it's RNG based as well)

This is not about damage, this is about play style. there is no play style, there is waiting for fury (which we dont get a lot of) so we can spend that fury. But there is no fury to spend

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