Havoc Discussions - 7.2.5 Mechanics and Feel

Class Development
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And bump!
Still waiting for an answer Blizz.
Silence isn't acceptable.
Bump
Please fix this ASAP, it was a universally loved change. For once the entire DH community is in agreement about something
13/06/2017 05:55Posted by Erralia
Please fix this ASAP, it was a universally loved change. For once the entire DH community is in agreement about something
It's hilarious how they went ahead and communicated with the shamans after the changes made while they just ignore us. Keep spamming them until they are forced to do so.
13/06/2017 05:55Posted by Erralia
Please fix this ASAP, it was a universally loved change. For once the entire DH community is in agreement about something


At this point if you're expecting anything before 7.3 you're delusional.

The change made it into the patch notes.

Release is literally today in NA
We are here to stay Blizz, give us a comment on this !@#$ty move you pulled on us
Time to reroll warrior untill they fix havoc...
I dont play DH (no time for alts becouse of personal time limits, not offensive), but you should give them a response Blizz. It doesnť look a fair. 40 pages almost 400 fingers up and no still response. I hope they will not get some letter about class made for good stories or something like that.
13/06/2017 09:18Posted by Liaara
I dont play DH (no time for alts becouse of personal time limits, not offensive), but you should give them a response Blizz. It doesnť look a fair. 40 pages almost 400 fingers up and no still response. I hope they will not get some letter about class made for good stories or something like that.


those numbers are so high, becouse of this theme has lot of threats.....
Up with you.
That silence IS ridiculous. Does blizzard not know what to say? How to handle the situation?

Odly, I start to lose the respect I had for them. Wonder why that is happening...
13/06/2017 18:50Posted by Nenora
Up with you.
That silence IS ridiculous. Does blizzard not know what to say? How to handle the situation?

Odly, I start to lose the respect I had for them. Wonder why that is happening...


I guess they think that if they ignore us that the !@#$storm will just fade. So just gotta keep hanging over their heads.
13/06/2017 22:33Posted by Tiás
13/06/2017 18:50Posted by Nenora
Up with you.
That silence IS ridiculous. Does blizzard not know what to say? How to handle the situation?

Odly, I start to lose the respect I had for them. Wonder why that is happening...


I guess they think that if they ignore us that the !@#$storm will just fade. So just gotta keep hanging over their heads.


and get louder every day
Also people should direct their complains to their twitter account too.
https://twitter.com/WarcraftDevs

Don't make them forget.
Thank you for all the feedback, and apologies for the delayed response.

We agree that there are moments of frustration with the live version of Demon Blades, and are continuing to look into how to address them, but also think that a smooth resource income is not the best solution.

For Havoc, we wanted to create a style of play that used fewer core abilities in favor of having deeper gameplay in other areas (e.g. a higher reliance on movement and battlefield awareness, and higher variation in resource generation). Part of what makes Demon's Bite, a spammable resource generator, work for Havoc is that its interaction with Chaos Strike is not static. You need to monitor how much Fury it generates, and react with Chaos Strike when appropriate.

We tried out having Demon Blades at 100% on the PTR mostly as a quality of life change, and to reduce the periods of time where players running Demon Blades found themselves unable to use any abilities. However, in practice, that change took an already simplified rotation and made it almost completely predictable. Though effective, it made the spec very dull to play. Reacting to your Fury bar is a core aspect of Havoc gameplay, and we don't want to lose that gameplay with Demon Blades.

All that said, we still agree that the current version of Demon Blades is not perfect, and we will continue to iterate. The version we tried on the 7.2.5 PTR was just not the right direction for Havoc.
14/06/2017 01:20Posted by Lore
Thank you for all the feedback, and apologies for the delayed response.

We agree that there are moments of frustration with the live version of Demon Blades, and are continuing to look into how to address them, but also think that a smooth resource income is not the best solution.

For Havoc, we wanted to create a style of play that used fewer core abilities in favor of having deeper gameplay in other areas (e.g. a higher reliance on movement and battlefield awareness, and higher variation in resource generation). Part of what makes Demon's Bite, a spammable resource generator, work for Havoc is that its interaction with Chaos Strike is not static. You need to monitor how much Fury it generates, and react with Chaos Strike when appropriate.

We tried out having Demon Blades at 100% on the PTR mostly as a quality of life change, and to reduce the periods of time where players running Demon Blades found themselves unable to use any abilities. However, in practice, that change took an already simplified rotation and made it almost completely predictable. Though effective, it made the spec very dull to play. Reacting to your Fury bar is a core aspect of Havoc gameplay, and we don't want to lose that gameplay with Demon Blades.

All that said, we still agree that the current version of Demon Blades is not perfect, and we will continue to iterate. The version we tried on the 7.2.5 PTR was just not the right direction for Havoc.


You could have gone with a middle ground and tried 80%.
But I guess the real problem is that the most passive talent in the row is the best talent which is clearly something you've been against.

So either DB needs a nerf so prepared becomes better or it needs another buff OR it needs to be redesigned. Perhaps just be a fury gen over time CD we can press when we need the fury.
14/06/2017 01:20Posted by Lore
Thank you for all the feedback, and apologies for the delayed response.

We agree that there are moments of frustration with the live version of Demon Blades, and are continuing to look into how to address them, but also think that a smooth resource income is not the best solution.

For Havoc, we wanted to create a style of play that used fewer core abilities in favor of having deeper gameplay in other areas (e.g. a higher reliance on movement and battlefield awareness, and higher variation in resource generation). Part of what makes Demon's Bite, a spammable resource generator, work for Havoc is that its interaction with Chaos Strike is not static. You need to monitor how much Fury it generates, and react with Chaos Strike when appropriate.

We tried out having Demon Blades at 100% on the PTR mostly as a quality of life change, and to reduce the periods of time where players running Demon Blades found themselves unable to use any abilities. However, in practice, that change took an already simplified rotation and made it almost completely predictable. Though effective, it made the spec very dull to play. Reacting to your Fury bar is a core aspect of Havoc gameplay, and we don't want to lose that gameplay with Demon Blades.

All that said, we still agree that the current version of Demon Blades is not perfect, and we will continue to iterate. The version we tried on the 7.2.5 PTR was just not the right direction for Havoc.


I and most other Havoc players believe that there are already too many lairs of RNG - you have to not miss the boss to have a chance to proc demon blades to get a random amount of fury and have a chance to proc felblade which is just one of the RNG chains. More RNG comes in from Chaos Strike refunds and from legendaries like Chaos Theory (10% chance on blade dance to get a very powerful proc, can chainproc or not proc at all) as well as other mechanics.

Can you guys hotfix rebalance the alternate styles (demon's bite stuff) to be roughly comparable to DBlades instead of way worse for raid content, particularly in 7.2.5 with tier 20 sets?

DBlades iteration ASAP is warmly welcome but many of us would like alternative options meanwhile.
14/06/2017 01:20Posted by Lore
Thank you for all the feedback, and apologies for the delayed response.

We agree that there are moments of frustration with the live version of Demon Blades, and are continuing to look into how to address them, but also think that a smooth resource income is not the best solution.

For Havoc, we wanted to create a style of play that used fewer core abilities in favor of having deeper gameplay in other areas (e.g. a higher reliance on movement and battlefield awareness, and higher variation in resource generation). Part of what makes Demon's Bite, a spammable resource generator, work for Havoc is that its interaction with Chaos Strike is not static. You need to monitor how much Fury it generates, and react with Chaos Strike when appropriate.

We tried out having Demon Blades at 100% on the PTR mostly as a quality of life change, and to reduce the periods of time where players running Demon Blades found themselves unable to use any abilities. However, in practice, that change took an already simplified rotation and made it almost completely predictable. Though effective, it made the spec very dull to play. Reacting to your Fury bar is a core aspect of Havoc gameplay, and we don't want to lose that gameplay with Demon Blades.

All that said, we still agree that the current version of Demon Blades is not perfect, and we will continue to iterate. The version we tried on the 7.2.5 PTR was just not the right direction for Havoc.

U can do lot of thing to change that:

Buff dmg or fury generation of Demon's Bite, coz is useless right now.

Delete Demon Blades or change to a talent that buff Demon's Bite.

Change Demonic Appetite: Right now is only usefull with demonic build and with low hp adds, on Gul'dan is useless for example, 25% chance is the same wrong way of Demon Blades, RNG playstyle is really bad

Change Momentum, now is 20% for 4 sec, that is useless vs Nemesis, Momentum in 2 min with perfect rotation, buff u like 32-40 seconds, when u has Nemesis 60 sec and 25%, on aoe dmg u can't use momentum properly but nemesis is still work fine.

Finally, I wanna do a suggestion, i think Demonic talent should be baseline.
We are Demon Hunter but I only see that when we uses Eye Beam, Wings and Metamorphosis. The rest of the time We are warriors with warglaives: both throw our arms, jump on or away of the enemy, do a crit attacks and generate fury(rage on warriors)

14/06/2017 01:20Posted by Lore

However, in practice, that change took an already simplified rotation and made it almost completely predictable.

Then what u think about BM Hunters, the most predictable and simply rotation: Dire Beast on cd, Kill Command on cd, Titan's Thunder on cd and Cobra Shot when u has more than 70 focus.

I love that rotation, u allways has something to do and u can be focused on mechanics without lose dps, but i hate stay like 10 seconds or more without do anything coz no fury, if i use Demon's Bite I lose like 100-150K DPS coz Demon's Bite do so low dmg and so low fury generation.
lemme translate the blue post for you boys:
all of you retards think you dont like rng on top of rng, but you are delusional !@#$s and we know that you actually love it, so were just gonna ignore your opinion, cause after all you only play the class.
kthxbai

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