Quel'dorei High Elves as an Alliance allied race

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18/05/2018 12:32Posted by Cirec
My support here for High Elves. Keep it up guys and ignore the nay sayers. Remember what happened with the call for Vanilla. It is happening now!!!


Sadly, your example is all too similar, as a quick perusal of the 'Classic' forums will show you.

"We want X! but we want it with some Y and some Z, and we want it exclusive to us!"

"So you want X?"

"That's what we've been saying for years, we want X"

"OK, you can have X"

"Yaaay! Oh whilst you're at it, remember to give us Y and some Z"

"We thought you wanted X?"

"We do, but with some Quality of Life improvements"

"Why?"

"Because....umm, because Americans thought it was a good idea, and some guy on YouTube said so"

Seriously, I would not use the Classic argument, as right now, those guys are proving that Blizzard were 100% correct when they said "You think you do, but you don't".

I support Alliance getting High Elves, I just do not support the wilder excesses that are sprouting up for the concept across the Atlantic and starting to be championed here. That is what is damaging the case for High Elves, that is certainly what is turning many away from the idea of them ever being playable. If you want X, be happy with X.
18/05/2018 13:22Posted by Brigante
18/05/2018 12:32Posted by Cirec
My support here for High Elves. Keep it up guys and ignore the nay sayers. Remember what happened with the call for Vanilla. It is happening now!!!


Sadly, your example is all too similar, as a quick perusal of the 'Classic' forums will show you.

"We want X! but we want it with some Y and some Z, and we want it exclusive to us!"

"So you want X?"

"That's what we've been saying for years, we want X"

"OK, you can have X"

"Yaaay! Oh whilst you're at it, remember to give us Y and some Z"

"We thought you wanted X?"

"We do, but with some Quality of Life improvements"

"Why?"

"Because....umm, because Americans thought it was a good idea, and some guy on YouTube said so"

Seriously, I would not use the Classic argument, as right now, those guys are proving that Blizzard were 100% correct when they said "You think you do, but you don't".

I support Alliance getting High Elves, I just do not support the wilder excesses that are sprouting up for the concept across the Atlantic and starting to be championed here. That is what is damaging the case for High Elves, that is certainly what is turning many away from the idea of them ever being playable. If you want X, be happy with X.


So true. High Elves are simply Blood Elves with Blue Eyes. But oh no, they want HE models with tattoos and war paint and additional 15 features that other races don't have, but should have.
17/05/2018 23:44Posted by Mornatar
Firstly, you clearly need to read up and immerse yourself in the lore rather than reading selective excerpts from some article and making a point to get a stylish new model to play on the Alliance side.
The High Elves were threatened with murder by the Night Elves after the Sundering as they had continued to use arcane magic despite their orders not to. Due to such knee-jerk reactions of the Night Elves, the High Elves exiled themselves they thrived elsewhere, away from their conservative brothers.


From what I can tell the Night Elves exiled the Highborne, after they continued the practice of Arcane magic.. As they couldn't bring themselves to put so many of their brethren to death.

17/05/2018 23:44Posted by Mornatar
So to sum it up, this imaginary and non-existent High Elven 'faction' (if you can even call a handful of such elves a faction) with blue eyes you want absorbed into the Alliance is basically a playable race on the Horde, only with green eyes, and thus it stands to reason that it is something that will never happen. Ever. Get over it.


18/05/2018 00:09Posted by Mornatar
He hasn't even done his homework about the matter. The High Elves are not numerous enough to form their own faction. They are a handful of vagabonds like Vereesa who left the Horde or the small number of Elves like the ones in Dalaran who are working for the Kirin Tor.


There are more High Elves than Void Elves.. Ion himself even described them as a "squad".. They were a tiny bunch of Void obsessed Blood Elves.
Yet they are playable..
The Lightforged aren't many either..

18/05/2018 00:09Posted by Mornatar
And with Void Elves now a part of the Alliance I'd prefer if Blizzard just put a stop to this whole matter and focused on other cool races like trolls and orcs.


They are cool in your opinion.. There are far more people who don't like trolls or orcs than there are people who think those races are cooler..
Just look at how few play trolls compared to all the elven races.
So just as they have to respect your opinion that orcs and trolls are cool, you should respect their opinion that they don't find them as cool..

PS:
This discussion has been done 50.000 times already in all 3 threads..
Every single one of your points has been made over and over again..
If people want to discuss High Elves and have fun with that, who are you to tell them otherwise?
So please, if you're not going to participate in the discussion which they are allowed to have, just ignore the thread.
I've seen countless people say that high elves shouldn't be implemented so that they wouldn't take a place from a 'cool' race such as Jinyu.

But realistically - how many people do you imagine switching to and playing Jinyu compared to High Elves?

Many of these critics say that Jinyu would be better but have no intention whatsoever of playing that race - and even if they did, its popularity would only be a fraction of high elves'.

High elves' popularity is the best reason for its inclusion. The most sought-after unplayable race.
18/05/2018 14:08Posted by Foreseer
But realistically - how many people do you imagine switching to and playing Jinyu compared to High Elves?Many of these critics say that Jinyu would be better but have no intention whatsoever of playing that race - and even if they did, its popularity would only be a fraction of high elves'.


I actually would. I'm not against Alliance getting High Elves, but yeah, I wouldn't roll one. I chose Blood Elf because the dichotomy of your classic High Elf working -with- the monsters was more appealing than LotR style Elves. Jinyu, I'd totally roll one.

I mean that is just my opinion as a single person, but yeah, Jinyu would be pretty nice. I could see a character who laments the debased nature of his ancient ancestors from another land, the murlocs, and decides to throw himself into studies as to how he can better their situation (Whilst being chased by bipedal pirhana-men going "Mrrrrghlgggh")
17/05/2018 23:44Posted by Mornatar
Now why would the High Elves (who have become known as the Blood Elves now) want to join the Alliance when Night Elves are a part of that faction?
Night Elves and High/Blood Elves get on well enough, actually. Since High Elves that didn't change their name and are not affilated with the Horde never ruined their relations with Night Elves, they still do.
Source: Warcraft 3, Night Elf Campaign: Maiev, Tyrande and Kael greet each other with respect, travel together and then Tyrande is willing to give her life to let the group of High Elves escape from the Scourge. And when the bridge collapses, Kael wants to save her.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y4ONaPnh5T4

18/05/2018 01:17Posted by Tìtus
Do you really think that is it though? After Theramore? And the fact that even Umbric the void elf is spouting his support for the Alliance and it's purpose, not because Alleria let them in, but because Umbric truly belives the Horde is a blight apon the world after recent events.


Umbric did not leave the Blood Elves and the Horde because he thought the Horde was a blight upon the world. He left because Lor'themar exiled him and his band and didn't have anywhere else to go.

Where do you get your information?

http://www.wowhead.com/news=284450/broadcast-text-for-26624-yrel-lilian-voss-drust-magic-spoilers#void-elves :
My followers and I felt no loyalty to the Horde. When Grand Magister Rommath forbade our Void research, we did not hesitate to break away and follow our own path.

...

We do not stand with the Alliance out of convenience. Nor is it a mere gesture of thanks to Alleria.

Our ordeal has taught us the importance of great powers being in the right hands. We could not allow the Horde to know the things we know, or to use us as a weapon in their schemes.

We fight for the Alliance because we believe in its values. And one day, I pray we will bring all of Silvermoon back into the fold.



18/05/2018 01:17Posted by Tìtus
And I doubt the High Elves of Quel'danil would wanna go join the Horde after living with the Wildhammer dwarves and draenei and so on for so long.

If anything they'd be the most likely to return. They're Farstriders, or rather, they -were- Farstriders before the Exile, and right now, there is zero difference between them and the Blood Elf Farstriders. They both have the same lifestyle, culture, reverence for nature. Only difference is the eye colour, which is now fading, and political allegiance.
And the fact that they were constantly attacked and assaulted by the Horde for the past 15+ years.

18/05/2018 00:27Posted by Infuria
High Elves are creatures of the light, they don't want to mess with the void and so it makes sense that there will be a rift between those who choose to embrace it and those who refuse it. High Elves will want to distance themselves from Void Elves.
So, do you mean that High Elves should be on the faction where the Lightforged Draenei are? Good point.
My followers and I felt no loyalty to the Horde. When Grand Magister Rommath forbade our Void research, we did not hesitate to break away and follow our own path.


See I'm hearing "I will tell my interlocutor what they want to hear, that plus when I was told I couldn't poke the bad thing, I ran away, despite the fact they kicked me out first"

That boy needs more consistency in his writing.

And the fact that they were constantly attacked and assaulted by the Horde for the past 15+ years.


Because they are hostile mobs. They attack you as a Horde character too as well. I'm talking lore-wise. Lore-wise they are more similar to a part of the Horde, than Alliance (The Farstriders). Read the rest of what I wrote, I don't think they -will- jump ship, but they are more likely to than say, the Silver Covenant.

18/05/2018 14:22Posted by Итилион
So, do you mean that High Elves should be on the faction where the Lightforged Draenei are? Good point.


That is emphatically not what they said. They talked of Void and Light. Logically, the Lightforged Draenei should -hate- the Void Elves also. Don't bring the Light into it, as it seems, right now, that whether the Light is Good or Bad, the Blood Elves are more Pious than the High Elves. They reject the Void, the Alliance embraces it. I'm not getting into the Right or Wrong of that, I'm just saying it is a very odd stance the Alliance has taken.
Void Elves are super cool but should be a completely separate thing to High Elves.
Leo made some good points before about how they can intertwining stories though.
That would be cool.
Arrogant Ion only cares about his L33T buddies and Mythic content, we wont get content unless he is removed and replaced. High Elves or your sub numbers will plummet!
18/05/2018 15:15Posted by Freedom
Arrogant Ion only cares about his L33T buddies and Mythic content, we wont get content unless he is removed and replaced. High Elves or your sub numbers will plummet!


Yes cause it wasn't clearly a blizzard decision AND THE STORY DEPARTMENT that decided on the playable high elves.

If you blame Ion the guy that decides mechanics, raids and how the engine works or how it can be improved, for the story (which he has no decision in unless it can't be made INSIDE THE GAME DUE TO TECHNICAL REASONS) you are so lost...

He just read the script that has been given to him by the story department... This topic has been discussed by the company clearly and it was their decision as a company to not make high elves playable.

But yes blame Ion for something clearly hasn't been his sole decision. At most he had one vote in the council/meeting that voted for or against high elves.

Now take a hike and understand how this story and real life work...
18/05/2018 15:28Posted by Dudas
18/05/2018 15:15Posted by Freedom
Arrogant Ion only cares about his L33T buddies and Mythic content, we wont get content unless he is removed and replaced. High Elves or your sub numbers will plummet!


Yes cause it wasn't clearly a blizzard decision AND THE STORY DEPARTMENT that decided on the playable high elves.

If you blame Ion the guy that decides mechanics, raids and how the engine works or how it can be improved, for the story (which he has no decision in unless it can't be made INSIDE THE GAME DUE TO TECHNICAL REASONS) you are so lost...

He just read the script that has been given to him by the story department... This topic has been discussed by the company clearly and it was their decision as a company to not make high elves playable.

But yes blame Ion for something clearly hasn't been his sole decision. At most he had one vote in the council/meeting that voted for or against high elves.

Now take a hike and understand how this story and real life work...


right you've made some weird points hes a lead game designer Ion’s primary responsibilities include contributing to the overall vision of the game and overseeing the creation of the game’s dungeon and raid content, you've just randomly stated he read a Script from the Story Development team.... Where si your proof of that.... Also.... they have opened the forum post size for high elves.. They haven't even made a decision if high elves are happening or not, I'm all for constructive counter points but you've literally wrote a paragraph that has no back or any logical sense.. if they didn't want high elves they would have created a blog post about it not happening and set it in stone... You clearly know nothing of game development and I would suggest you not make comments on it unless you've either studied it or experience within it, Also you keep saying the story department made the decision, Thats not strictly true because story and be written you clearly have no idea what you're talking about and it was clearly stated years back blood elves were part of the horde based on the imbalance due to the alliance obtaining space goats but now with the allied system and the better systems they use they can push out new races and have them equally distributed and back then it was a lot harder to create models, I know this as Its what I've studied in, Using lore as a counter argument is simply stupid because lore can be written to tailor them into the alliance saying because inthe past they had hardships doesn't mean they can't have a treaty now.

Look at real life when Germany was at war with everyone now there Allies within the EU so your points on lore makes no sense at all because lore develops and expands as a whole.
18/05/2018 15:34Posted by Crðw
18/05/2018 15:28Posted by Dudas
...

Yes cause it wasn't clearly a blizzard decision AND THE STORY DEPARTMENT that decided on the playable high elves.

If you blame Ion the guy that decides mechanics, raids and how the engine works or how it can be improved, for the story (which he has no decision in unless it can't be made INSIDE THE GAME DUE TO TECHNICAL REASONS) you are so lost...

He just read the script that has been given to him by the story department... This topic has been discussed by the company clearly and it was their decision as a company to not make high elves playable.

But yes blame Ion for something clearly hasn't been his sole decision. At most he had one vote in the council/meeting that voted for or against high elves.

Now take a hike and understand how this story and real life work...


right you've made some weird points hes a lead game designer Ion’s primary responsibilities include contributing to the overall vision of the game and overseeing the creation of the game’s dungeon and raid content, you've just randomly stated he read a Script from the Story Development team.... Where si your proof of that.... Also.... they have opened the forum post size for high elves.. They haven't even made a decision if high elves are happening or not, I'm all for constructive counter points but you've literally wrote a paragraph that has no back or any logical sense.. if they didn't want high elves they would have created a blog post about it not happening and set it in stone... You clearly know nothing of game development and I would suggest you not make comments on it unless you've either studied it or experience within it, Also you keep saying the story department made the decision, Thats not strictly true because story and be written you clearly have no idea what you're talking about and it was clearly stated years back blood elves were part of the horde based on the imbalance due to the alliance obtaining space goats

They don't want high elves.
They literally told people to roll horde if they want to play that type of elf.
There is no reason to pretend that since there was no "its never going to happen" said that it was not clear that we were told its not going to happen.
They just want to keep doors open for if they change their minds in the future.

If you want to try and change their mind then more power to you.
Thats what these threads are for.
But being told to roll horde if you want a high elf was a pretty strong no for the time being at least.

And in no way do they owe a long post saying it wont happen.
They don't need to write that at all.
And they would not write that.

This thread is to change their mind and have fun along the way.
Thats it really.
<span class="truncated">...</span>

right you've made some weird points hes a lead game designer Ion’s primary responsibilities include contributing to the overall vision of the game and overseeing the creation of the game’s dungeon and raid content, you've just randomly stated he read a Script from the Story Development team.... Where si your proof of that.... Also.... they have opened the forum post size for high elves.. They haven't even made a decision if high elves are happening or not, I'm all for constructive counter points but you've literally wrote a paragraph that has no back or any logical sense.. if they didn't want high elves they would have created a blog post about it not happening and set it in stone... You clearly know nothing of game development and I would suggest you not make comments on it unless you've either studied it or experience within it, Also you keep saying the story department made the decision, Thats not strictly true because story and be written you clearly have no idea what you're talking about and it was clearly stated years back blood elves were part of the horde based on the imbalance due to the alliance obtaining space goats

They don't want high elves.
They literally told people to roll horde if they want to play that type of elf.
There is no reason to pretend that since there was no "its never going to happen" said that it was not clear that we were told its not going to happen.
They just want to keep doors open for if they change their minds in the future.

If you want to try and change their mind then more power to you.
Thats what these threads are for.
But being told to roll horde if you want a high elf was a pretty strong no for the time being at least.

And in no way do they owe a long post saying it wont happen.
They don't need to write that at all.
And they would not write that.

This thread is to change their mind and have fun along the way.
Thats it really.


You seem to forget saying that his word is law is oxymoron based on the fact hes been well known for making baseless responses such as vanilla his reply regarding high elves is as baseless as me saying I'm a god because in the end he is not the head of the company who finalises the choices of the game he is merely one of several unless you've randomly decided he is the CEO who overall does the final decision on the game which is not the case, I'm not trying to offend so don't take anything I say the wrong way I'm merely trying to reiterate that you can't say there not happening due to one persons response out of a entire company.

Also regarding the tattoos thing it makes sense to ive them something else every single allied race has a extra just like if we gave you undead human nathanos model I'd expect you to get something more than just the base model, telling people that is the problem is just sheer immaturity.
Judge me if you want but i come here now and then Just to read some comments since they make me smile or laugh
18/05/2018 15:41Posted by Moritz
...
They don't want high elves.
They literally told people to roll horde if they want to play that type of elf.
There is no reason to pretend that since there was no "its never going to happen" said that it was not clear that we were told its not going to happen.
They just want to keep doors open for if they change their minds in the future.

If you want to try and change their mind then more power to you.
Thats what these threads are for.
But being told to roll horde if you want a high elf was a pretty strong no for the time being at least.

And in no way do they owe a long post saying it wont happen.
They don't need to write that at all.
And they would not write that.

This thread is to change their mind and have fun along the way.
Thats it really.


You seem to forget saying that his word is law is oxymoron based on the fact hes been well known for making baseless responses such as vanilla his reply regarding high elves is as baseless as me saying I'm a god because in the end he is not the head of the company who finalises the choices of the game he is merely one of several unless you've randomly decided he is the CEO who overall does the final decision on the game which is not the case.

So nothing that Blizzard says is worth listening to unless the CEO says it?
I don't mean to be rude but that just strikes me as serious denial that a no was given.
A no WAS given. And it was meant. But that does not mean minds can't be changed.
<span class="truncated">...</span>

You seem to forget saying that his word is law is oxymoron based on the fact hes been well known for making baseless responses such as vanilla his reply regarding high elves is as baseless as me saying I'm a god because in the end he is not the head of the company who finalises the choices of the game he is merely one of several unless you've randomly decided he is the CEO who overall does the final decision on the game which is not the case.

So nothing that Blizzard says is worth listening to unless the CEO says it?
I don't mean to be rude but that just strikes me as serious denial that a no was given.
A no WAS given. And it was meant. But that does not mean minds can't be changed.


How is that Denial? He said no in a manner that was clearly not serious also you're clearly holding onto strings when if you actually read up on how a company works EVERYTHING goes through a system he is not the person who has the end say he may not want them but its not his decision to make that so no so no don't worry Its no a strike of denial its a process of critical thinking in a professional manner within the game industry and I'd suggest you read up on that process to have better insight on it also, I would also suggest you stop making random quotes I've not even stated that's just bad discussion you don't need to fill in parts fo your paragraph with quotes I've not even stated.

EDIT: I also stated the only worthwhile information given is that of a blog input stating the hard cold truth if one of the many dozen developers says no is not a case to suggest there not coming because funny enough the Brown orcs had the same situation back in TBC
18/05/2018 15:50Posted by Crðw
...
So nothing that Blizzard says is worth listening to unless the CEO says it?
I don't mean to be rude but that just strikes me as serious denial that a no was given.
A no WAS given. And it was meant. But that does not mean minds can't be changed.


How is that Denial? He said no in a manner that was clearly not serious also you're clearly holding onto strings when if you actually read up on how a company works EVERYTHING goes through a system he is not the person who has the end say he may not want them but its not his decision to make that so no so no don't worry Its no a strike of denial its a process of critical thinking in a professional manner within the game industry and I'd suggest you read up on that process to have better insight on it also, I would also suggest you stop making random quotes I've not even stated that's just bad discussion you don't need to fill in parts fo your paragraph with quotes I've not even stated.

So you mean to tell me you genuinely think he went into that question with no insight whatsoever about what the company stance was on the matter?
Ion quote was clear

"So, Blood Elves kind of are High Elves with different eye colors and backstory in terms of their relationship to magic in the Sunwell. But if you want to be a fair-skinned, light, blonde-haired, tall, majestic, elf...that is a Blood Elf.

Giving that race directly to the Alliance would have blurred a lot of the lines between the two factions, but also there isn't a clear example of who or what High Elves are as a larger group which remains in Azeroth. There's a couple...we just met Alleria again...but they're not out there in the same way. When we add an Allied Race, there's a desire to have things be even more distinct especially between the two factions with the faction conflict being so prominent. And so, the Void Elf angle, as it tied into the story of Argus, the powers of Alleria awakened and was able to train others to harness, was able to give something that felt a bit like a Blood Elf but had a unique flavor of its own to the Alliance.

That said, obviously I understand you would love Alliance elves...you're an Alliance player, and want to be a fair-skinned, light-haired, blue-eyed elf. Sorry? The Horde is there and waiting for you. Eye color is not quite the same but maybe contact lenses in the future, you never know? Anything is possible in the future, but no plans in the near-term to add High Elves as an Allied Race."
No more elf please.
<span class="truncated">...</span>

How is that Denial? He said no in a manner that was clearly not serious also you're clearly holding onto strings when if you actually read up on how a company works EVERYTHING goes through a system he is not the person who has the end say he may not want them but its not his decision to make that so no so no don't worry Its no a strike of denial its a process of critical thinking in a professional manner within the game industry and I'd suggest you read up on that process to have better insight on it also, I would also suggest you stop making random quotes I've not even stated that's just bad discussion you don't need to fill in parts fo your paragraph with quotes I've not even stated.

So you mean to tell me you genuinely think he went into that question with no insight whatsoever about what the company stance was on the matter?


Being that he laughed and never gave a professional deep insight into a well saute discussion by thousands as he literally took 5 seconds to even discuss that question does make me think that yes and the fact he has done the exact same about Vanilla servers, If you can't see or grasp the understanding why people are not accepting that as a full blown straight answer you're beyond being able to convince.

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