Returning players need to grind old content for new content.

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18/08/2018 21:13Posted by Korrina
18/08/2018 20:09Posted by Nefaryas
It is legion content locked to a bfa requirement actually but never mind eh?
It's a BfA feature gated behind the previous expansion content. In case of doubt:
https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/battle-for-azeroth

They were never a feature of Legion and you could never and still cannot play them without BfA. Again, I repeat, they are a BfA feature.

Blizzard is always pushing the limits, to see what the playerbase will or will not accept. What surprises me is that people defend choices like this. You understand that if something like this goes uncontested they will just double down on it, right? It was the same thing with the paragon reputation and the time limit for the artifact skins. People were defending what were clearly poor choices from Blizzard to increase player retention. Thankfully there were enough reasonable voices and common sense prevailed in those cases. I hope it will too in this one.

Blizzard will always push for anything that increases the time we spend on the game. Is up to the players to push back. It's not acceptable to gate a feature of an expansion behind a previous expansion. The races' storylines happen during Legion? Though, I'm sorry, but it's just that simple. When was the last time you needed to have a specific achievement from one expansion to access a feature of another? Without backlash this will become a new normal for Blizzard.

As far as I'm concern only the storylines should be required, as a trade-off for the characters starting at level 20. That seems fair. Blizzard doesn't have to create starting zones, players get to know the races and they don't have to start at level 1. As a compromise it works for both sides.

Sorry for the long rant :P


The requirements are legion content for the first 4 but the unlock is gated behind bfa purchase. The requirements have been available for 2 years in legion and known for allied races for 6 months and purchase of bfa to do those requirements (the rep and the legion bound quests) was not needed. Bfa purchase was needed to access the unlock quest chains, that is legion content locked behind a bfa requirement for those 4 allied races (and before you argue back I am all for the bfa purchase requirement being removed for them)

The next 4 are now locked by bfa requirements and content and are already causing complaints.

Heritage armour will cause complaints too as it will be unfair you have to play the game to get it.

And big whoop a company wants to make as much money as possible. Wow what a new concept in this capitalist society!
18/08/2018 20:08Posted by Møø
18/08/2018 15:33Posted by Nûron
Why do returning players have to grind old reputation that is not relevant to the current expansion just to unlock the new races. It really is quite daft.


I wanted to make an allied race, then noticed the requirements. Now I doubt I ever will :(

exactly. i thought: hey im gonna go play Mag'har orcs. oh wait, i guess i wont :/

not yet at least...

gating new expansion pack content behind OLD expansion pack content is so stupid i dont even think the english words can cover it. if i were to farm reputation in BFA to unlock those races, THAT i would be down with. that makes sense because its new content, it belongs to this expansion. but old expansion? thats retarded.

- OMFG! YOU CAN PLAY THESE NEW ALLIED RACES!

Me: Really?!

- YES!

Me: AWESOME!

- but first! you have to go back one expansion that you didnt play because you've been on and off and thus dont have any of the reputation factions on exalted. and thus start grinding some !@#$ you never played before! in an OLDER EXPANSION! ISNT THAT GREAT?!

Me: uh.. yea... i guess... *sheds a tear*

- YOU GET TO SEE ALL THIS !@#$ YOU DONT CARE ABOUT ANYMORE!!! THAT IN IT SELF IS ITS OWN REWARD!

Me: *waterfall of tears*
18/08/2018 21:25Posted by Nefaryas
And big whoop a company wants to make as much money as possible. Wow what a new concept in this capitalist society!
Did I said it was? What I did say is when they go beyond what is reasonable players should push back. Blizzard is looking out for their interests, players should look out for theirs. This is a bad decision and it should be nipped in the bud, before it becomes the new normal.
18/08/2018 21:37Posted by Peonmaster
gating new expansion pack content behind OLD expansion pack content is so stupid i dont even think the english words can cover it.


It's actually gating old expansion pack content behind NEW expansion pack content.
Highmountain, Nightfallen, Void elves, LF Draeneis are part of legion, it's only that BFA brings the ABILITY to hire allied races.

EDIT: The only developers problem is that they made allied race feature only in BFA. Noone would complain if people could unlock those specific 4 allies in 7.3.5 without pre-pruchase.
18/08/2018 21:52Posted by Korrina
18/08/2018 21:25Posted by Nefaryas
And big whoop a company wants to make as much money as possible. Wow what a new concept in this capitalist society!
Did I said it was? What I did say is when they go beyond what is reasonable players should push back. Blizzard is looking out for their interests, players should look out for theirs. This is a bad decision and it should be nipped in the bud, before it becomes the new normal.


It isn't unreasonable to expect players to play the game <sigh> you only have to play through legion once on one character, it doesn't matter if it's horde or alliance as the rep is account (realm?) wide. If you play the game as it is meant to be played I.e. lvl 1 to 120 you will play through all the content in the game, when you hit lvl 100 you will go to the legion zones and play that content and get the required rep up to honoured by just playing the game. Now here is the advantage for anyone doing that now, you know you need 4 of those reps to exalted for the allied races so you can save yourself even more of the grind whilst playing the content with that knowledge. If you want all 4 go for them if you just want 1 then concentrate on that. Once you finish the content you do have a grind but it shouldn't take long as you have WQs, emissaries, insignia tokens and some weekly quests to grind through. The average is 3 weeks but some have done it in less some more depending on how much effort you put in (for example I didn't put effort in and it took me 5 weeks to get void elves and lightforged)

Blizzard want you to play the game and you think that unreasonable?

I suppose pushing you to lvl allied races 20 to 110/120 for heritage armour is also unreasonable because that means playing "old outdated irrelevant content" for the reward but those whingy posts haven't begun yet have they?

Ohhh and of course in 6, 12 or 24 months when new players come and they can't immediately have a dark iron dwarf or zandalari troll it will be unreasonable.

And flying being locked behind pathfinder is unreasonable because you have to actually play content and explore zones and get rep first.

The list could go on and on

Edit: spelling d'oh
18/08/2018 22:09Posted by Nefaryas

It isn't unreasonable to expect players to play the game <sigh> you only have to play through legion once on one character, it doesn't matter if it's horde or alliance as the rep is account (realm?) wide. If you play the game as it is meant to be played I.e. lvl 1 to 120 you will play through all the content in the game, when you hit lvl 100 you will go to the legion zones and play that content and get the required rep up to honoured by just playing the game. Now here is the advantage for anyone doing that now, you know you need 4 of those reps to exalted for the allied races so you can save yourself even more of the grind whilst playing the content with that knowledge. If you want all 4 go for them if you just want 1 then concentrate on that. Once you finish the content you do have a grind but it shouldn't take long as you have WQs, emissaries, insignia tokens and some weekly quests to grind through. The average is 3 weeks but some have done it in less some more depending on how much effort you put in (for example I didn't put effort in and it took me 5 weeks to get void elves and lightforged)

Blizzard want you to play the game and you think that unreasonable?

I suppose pushing you to lvl allied races 20 to 110/120 for heritage armour is also unreasonable because that means playing "old outdated irrelevant content" for the reward but those whingy posts haven't begun yet have they?

Ohhh and of course in 6, 12 or 24 months when new players come and they can't immediately have a dark iron dwarf or zandalari troll it will be unreasonable.

And flying being locked behind pathfinder is unreasonable because you have to actually play content and explore zones and get rep first.

The list could go on and on

Edit: spelling d'oh

Stockholm syndrom is a wonderful thing isn't it?
18/08/2018 22:13Posted by Chorizio
18/08/2018 22:09Posted by Nefaryas

It isn't unreasonable to expect players to play the game <sigh> you only have to play through legion once on one character, it doesn't matter if it's horde or alliance as the rep is account (realm?) wide. If you play the game as it is meant to be played I.e. lvl 1 to 120 you will play through all the content in the game, when you hit lvl 100 you will go to the legion zones and play that content and get the required rep up to honoured by just playing the game. Now here is the advantage for anyone doing that now, you know you need 4 of those reps to exalted for the allied races so you can save yourself even more of the grind whilst playing the content with that knowledge. If you want all 4 go for them if you just want 1 then concentrate on that. Once you finish the content you do have a grind but it shouldn't take long as you have WQs, emissaries, insignia tokens and some weekly quests to grind through. The average is 3 weeks but some have done it in less some more depending on how much effort you put in (for example I didn't put effort in and it took me 5 weeks to get void elves and lightforged)

Blizzard want you to play the game and you think that unreasonable?

I suppose pushing you to lvl allied races 20 to 110/120 for heritage armour is also unreasonable because that means playing "old outdated irrelevant content" for the reward but those whingy posts haven't begun yet have they?

Ohhh and of course in 6, 12 or 24 months when new players come and they can't immediately have a dark iron dwarf or zandalari troll it will be unreasonable.

And flying being locked behind pathfinder is unreasonable because you have to actually play content and explore zones and get rep first.

The list could go on and on

Edit: spelling d'oh

Stockholm syndrom is a wonderful thing isn't it?


Couldn't have said it better myself lol.
18/08/2018 21:22Posted by Manlovelol
18/08/2018 21:14Posted by Emowitch
...

Blizzard said no; then changed their minds

Read between the lines my manloving friend.


they changed their minds on a service not related to in-game rewards.

They changed their minds on opening a server to host the oldest version of the game, not related to in-game rewards.

those are two different things.


The result is the same my chocolate starfish loving friend. They changed their minds.
18/08/2018 22:09Posted by Nefaryas
Blizzard want you to play the game and you think that unreasonable?
Sometimes they can be unreasonable with their requirements. One great example that comes to mind: prestige. Guess what, players were unhappy with the requirements and Blizzard eventually relented because players were vocal about their displeasure.

You are happy with the way things are? That's OK, but I think they are over reaching and being unreasonable again, so here I'm voicing my displeasure to have it changed.
18/08/2018 22:13Posted by Chorizio
18/08/2018 22:09Posted by Nefaryas

It isn't unreasonable to expect players to play the game <sigh> you only have to play through legion once on one character, it doesn't matter if it's horde or alliance as the rep is account (realm?) wide. If you play the game as it is meant to be played I.e. lvl 1 to 120 you will play through all the content in the game, when you hit lvl 100 you will go to the legion zones and play that content and get the required rep up to honoured by just playing the game. Now here is the advantage for anyone doing that now, you know you need 4 of those reps to exalted for the allied races so you can save yourself even more of the grind whilst playing the content with that knowledge. If you want all 4 go for them if you just want 1 then concentrate on that. Once you finish the content you do have a grind but it shouldn't take long as you have WQs, emissaries, insignia tokens and some weekly quests to grind through. The average is 3 weeks but some have done it in less some more depending on how much effort you put in (for example I didn't put effort in and it took me 5 weeks to get void elves and lightforged)

Blizzard want you to play the game and you think that unreasonable?

I suppose pushing you to lvl allied races 20 to 110/120 for heritage armour is also unreasonable because that means playing "old outdated irrelevant content" for the reward but those whingy posts haven't begun yet have they?

Ohhh and of course in 6, 12 or 24 months when new players come and they can't immediately have a dark iron dwarf or zandalari troll it will be unreasonable.

And flying being locked behind pathfinder is unreasonable because you have to actually play content and explore zones and get rep first.

The list could go on and on

Edit: spelling d'oh

Stockholm syndrom is a wonderful thing isn't it?


Ah yes here come the insults. Fall back of all the "give me the allied races now for free" crowd. I play a game, I pay to play it, I played throughout legion on and off so got the required rep with no hassle. Had I boosted character I would have missed content and had to go back for it. I did not like legion but played for the bits I wanted I came back at the end to catch up on stuff I skipped, the only thing I regret missing is the mage tower but I left it too late so my fault I can't complain or whinge or demand the rewards for it.

I will most likely miss parts of bfa over the next two years and skip bits I don't like or don't want to do and again play catch up, in fact I'm looking at spending 18 months in and out of hospital so may end up missing more than I would like but such is life.

That isn't Stockholm syndrome or being a fanboy or a blizzard bootlicker or any of the other insults you want to throw at me for pointing out facts you don't like. It's part of the game you just don't like it and won't accept it. Your fall back to insults says more about you and your mentality than you ever will about me and 8ts a shame that everyone on your side of the argument acts in the same way.

But I am not continuing a discussion with children so I'm done. Believe what you want. Vilify a company for wanting it's product used and wanting to make money whilst still playing it and paying for it.
What saddens me most about this is the people coming on here defending Blizzard over this and trying to justify it. Yes the content is technically tied to Legion's story but Blizzard are using these races to both promote and to sell copies of BFA, I can't think of an MMO in the past that has used new races as a selling point for a new expansion but made players go through old content in order to unlock them. It goes against the very nature of the MMORPG genre.

I hope Blizzard do address this in future, even if it's to allow people the opportunity to gain the rep through playing BFA content somehow, that would be a fair compromise.
18/08/2018 22:15Posted by Emowitch
18/08/2018 21:22Posted by Manlovelol
...

they changed their minds on a service not related to in-game rewards.

They changed their minds on opening a server to host the oldest version of the game, not related to in-game rewards.

those are two different things.


The result is the same my chocolate starfish loving friend. They changed their minds.


Yup, but never for in-game rewards.
18/08/2018 22:36Posted by Manlovelol
Yup, but never for in-game rewards.
They changed their minds on the artifact skins, they compromised with the players over Mists challenge mode armour, by making look a likes for Legion, they removed the paragon system. This is what I remember from the top of my head. They do change their minds about rewards too.
18/08/2018 20:06Posted by Tirsiril
What the poster above me doesn't understand is that it's just silly to lock BFA advertised content behind a long older expansion grind.


Alright, I hadn't even looked at it that way...

If you advertise something for a new product, it doesn't make sense you'd have to go into old content. It's not a bad thing per se, but storywise it makes no sense and it's not very fun to do. I came back too late to get them, too - but I wasn't too sad coz I'm not much a fan of Elves to begin with.

Had these races been advertised for Legion, or had their rep grind been in BFA, that would have made sense.
I'm not sure you could sell that as misleading advertising, but I'm sure a creative person could make a case. I cba to do so, rly. Because when you look at it, they were a Legion feature because they were added before the pre-patch, weren't they?

Anyhow, Blizz said they wouldn't change anything, so there's that.
18/08/2018 22:36Posted by Manlovelol
18/08/2018 22:15Posted by Emowitch
...

The result is the same my chocolate starfish loving friend. They changed their minds.


Yup, but never for in-game rewards.


Doesn’t matter about what......that’s the point.
18/08/2018 15:36Posted by Wankman
Because in Blizzard's mind this will make them play longer, and that is literally the only thing they still care about at this point.

1) Stretch out every possible grind to infinity

2) People will play for ever and ever

3) Profit

Well, at least in theory.


I wonder how many people would go back to 'The Burning Crusade' to get exalted with the Blood Elves and Draenei in order to play them in this current BFA expansion?

I would XD
Becouse wow playerbase is full of idiots and they will play the game no matter how bad it is.
18/08/2018 23:52Posted by Averagebuble
Becouse wow playerbase is full of idiots and they will play the game no matter how bad it is.

Well, you are still in the playerba-...
Oh it's a self criticism!
18/08/2018 22:56Posted by Emowitch
18/08/2018 22:36Posted by Manlovelol
...

Yup, but never for in-game rewards.


Doesn’t matter about what......that’s the point.


Yes it matters. Companies are more flexible with certain aspects of their product.
Coz otherwise we'd have a billion extra [Void and Nightborne] elves running about. At least this way we can hold of the Elfication of WoW for a little while longer.

The Horde is dominated by Blood Elves already. If everybody could roll a Nightborne right off the bat then it would just be Blood Elves, Nightborne and a selection of miscellaneous Shaman and Druids.

Similarly, i'm pretty sure the Gnomes and Dwarves have left the Alliance already, judging by their rarity...

And the thing is, I know that if I were a new player, I would pick a Void Elf or Nightborne without hesitation.

So i'm part of the problem.

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