Stop making people choose between fluidity and utility.

General
Tl;dr: Classes should be built from the ground up to feel fluid, reactive and fun. Making people choose between fluidity and utility is a serious design issue that will bore people in the long run.

I believe that Blizzards current attitude towards class design is truly hurting this game and is lazily providing the illusion of choice.

What do I mean by this?

If we take a Ret Paladin as an example, people that play the class will know that there are two choices in the level 30 and 100 talents trees that are significantly impactful to the way the class feels.

I am referring to Blade of Wrath and Divine Purpose.

Without these talents selected, Ret Paladins feel clunky, slow and lack the fast paced reactive nature that many chose the class for.

While Hammer of Wrath and Inquisition may be competitive choices - I would argue that they are illusions of choice if you want to make the class feel enjoyable to play.

Moreover, it's not just Ret Paladins that suffer from this curse:

Arms Warriors feel drastically more fun rotationally with Sudden Death, Massacre and Dreadnaught.

Affliction Warlocks feel far more reactive and fast paced with Nightfall and Soul Conduit.

Outlaw Rogues feel much more fluid with Vigor and Alacrity.

You get the point.

These talents should not be choices we have to make as a player. Anything that makes a spec feel fluid and fun should be baked into the class and Blizzard should tune the numbers around everything else accordingly. Let's have talent choices that pit utility against utility rather than the current system of utility against fluidity.

Let's actually make the game feel good to play for everyone before we start worrying about numbers and tuning.
Of course some classes are much worse than others.

BM hunters for example only really have one talent in 'Scent of Blood' that impacts flow (via increased focus regen through Barbed Shot)
Yep. It's quite obvious that "class fantasy" is the biggest illusion and that the class developers don't really know what they're doing.

They probably think "Oh it's okay if we leave the classes/specs in this state, I'm sure they will adapt to it sooner or later!" no, people will actually unsub from the game if they don't enjoy playing their favourite class/spec, believe it or not.
22/08/2018 17:04Posted by Serious
Yep. It's quite obvious that "class fantasy" is the biggest illusion and that the class developers don't really know what they're doing.

They probably think "Oh it's okay if we leave the classes/specs in this state, I'm sure they will adapt to it sooner or later!" no, people will actually unsub from the game if they don't enjoy playing their favourite class/spec, believe it or not.


I just don't get their current mentality. They pretend it's providing a choice but that's just not good enough. If a class feels trash to play without certain abilities then I don't particularly care if other talents in the same tier are 'competitive'. I'll always choose the talent that makes the class feel good to play.

They could actually provide some real choice if they made these particular abilities baseline and then allow us to choose between utility talents instead.
remember when talents added extra stuff to your class instead of making or braking it?
22/08/2018 18:57Posted by Grigdut
remember when talents added extra stuff to your class instead of making or braking it?


Exactly

If a class is relying on certain talents to actually play properly, with plenty of interactivity and at a good pace - something is clearly wrong with the design philosophy.

I hopped on my Affliction Lock and Dotting a bunch of things with Corruption and churning out instant cast Shadowbolts with Nightfall felt really, really nice. Why the hell didn't they build this into the spec? It feels so empty without it.
Survival Hunter is another massive offender with this too, by having Hydra's Bite, Butchery and Guerrilla Tactics in the same talent bracket.

Carve is awful and Butchery should be baseline.

Wildfire Infusion is 100% the most fun talent but would be so so much better if you had 2 charges and the ability to spread Serpents Sting more easily. As it stands you have to pick one and that's shoddy design.

It also makes this mistake with Alpha Predator and Viper's venom being in the same bracket. The spec would flow amazingly well with all of these built into the class.
It's not just this, it's the fact that haste is at such a premium now and it's arguably the most important stat for making so many classes not feel slow as molasses to play.
I can't even imagine playing Arms Warrior without Dreadnought. I do enjoy Arms warrior, but only with dreadnought on. It is just way too slow without it.

And those two skills mentioned for Ret Paladin is pretty much essential for the class to feel good.

They should make the class feel fluid and good without talents, and then the talents should just add extra flair to the spec. None of the talents should be essential for a class to be fun to play.

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