Modern WoW Today and why it sucks

General
PVE

Gearing;
Gearing today has lost its absolute meaning and value. And im not talking about the quality of gear whether they're epic or not, im talking about its use. Why should i gear today? Apart from PVP, why should i bother myself with farming wq's, dungeons, m+, and crafting only to be able to get into LFR with minimal itemlvl and complete the raid regardless. I dont see the point. It used to be that you farmed good gear in order to ENTER the raid and then progress from there. Now i dont have to gear up and i can still see and complete the raid. You might say "well in order to get the best gear you have to do mythic", well yes, you do, but why bother get best gear if i can raid in LFR and be done with it. It used to be that gearing up and seeing the raid were hand in hand. The goal of the game (apart from collecting and PVP) is to complete the raids and newest content. But me being able to do it in LFR just devalues the gear and effectively makes gearing pointless. On top of that even if i wanted to gear up gear is being thrown at me from every direction. Thus devaluing gear even more.

Normal/HC;
This sort of bleeds into LFR. First of all having 4 diffciluties is just ridicoulous. Even though this applies to dungeons as well im mostly concerned with raiding. We have LFR, Normal, HC, and then Mythic. And the absurd part is that Normal of today is not the same Normal that existed before, and im sure many of you know this but the HC of today is what Normal used to be, and Mythic is what HC used to be. So not only did they add 1 easier diffculty but 2??What on earth? Raids baseline needs to be diffcult. Thats part of their fantasy and meaning, and yea im aware that if i want harder raids the diffuclty is there but thats not the point. Im saying that easier diffculties than Normal of before (so in other words HC today) shouldnt exist. In todays terms it should only be HC and Mythic (which was Normal and HC). INB4 you say that Normal of before was also easy,... thats fine, its at least harder than today, so that if you wanted to go higher the option was there.

Catch-up mechanics;
Even after seeing that gearing was pointless and i decided to do it anyway i could literally wait untill 4 patches later and catch up with everyone there. The whole thing just devaulues everything, its like why even play? I could get the same itemlvl even though i dont have to, i dont have to farm AP because 1. i wont need it and 2. i get more the more i wait. The whole thing is just ridiculous

PVP

Gearing;
I dont see the problem with just adding a vendor and have it like it used to be. People want it and it gives freedom and customization to buy the pieces we want. But instead Blizzard decides to continue making it RNG. Even today with BFA its less rng than legion its still doesnt feel nice. On top of that i think the Wotlk model worked perfectly for pvp gearing. You bought the pieces but also some pieces like the weapons were gated behind rating thus rewarding people with skill.

Cross-Realm;

Groupfinder/WQ;
Oh man how i hate this part. I have never experienced something so unnatural in an mmo as grouping up to kill a world boss. Guys, i want you to think about this, a world boss! What do you do when the wq is up for the world boss. You go to the zone, you literally click one button and all of a sudden your teleported(phased) to 40 other players who all of a sudden appeared out of nowhere. You then tag the boss and wait for it die which takes no time at all and then once its done you just leave group and all of sudden everyone dissapears as if nothing just happened. Who in their right mind thinks this is good let alone fun gameplay? And this applies to everything with the group finder since its all cross realm.

Sharding/Phasing;
I hope with my all heart sharding doesn't get added for wow classic. But basically what this is also feels ridiculous. Im on a high pop realm and i remember going out to Stormwind where people duel and finding it completey empty! Why? Because despite being on same server they are in a different shard. I go raid or bg and when i come back 'poof' everyone is there. But you know how many times ive seen it completey empty as if im the only online? And then even when you manage to be in the same shard by sheer luck and you see all the people, once the limit exceeds on how many players can be there at the same time they all dissapear (this happaned mostly when me being ona differnet server was seeing people from other servers). It just feels bad. I remeber lvling in legion and even BFA now it was completey empty at some parts becuase people were in their differnet shards despite being in the same server.

Leveling;

LvL Boost;
The very fact that this exists is testament to how the lvling process is. It used to be that lvling was a part of the endgame and then when you hit max lvl you had a whole other game waiting for you. Travelling everywhere, actually going to the dungeons, elite mobs being hard, group quests actually requiring a group (legit in bfa, the grp quests for 3 people you could solo). LFG and heirlooms kind of !@#$ed it up. Now i believe in regards to those 2 specifically there could a compromise. Even though they were introduce in Wotlk it was only towards the end it was introduced. So you could make it that LFG is only available towards the end of the expansion or something like that and then lock it untill the end of the next expansion. This is just an example, i believe that lvling shouldnt include heirlooms or lfg. And then we have some of the lvling aspects of modern wow where you have 'treassure chests' and rares. Im sorry but those treassure chests are not treassures and those rares are just mobs that APPEAR on the map and have the name 'rares' yet nothing in common with being rare. It doesnt matter that youve gone through the lvling process X amount of times, it sholdnt change because of you because it destroys the process.

Scaling;
Scaling ruins the feeling of progression in my opinion. There are 2 places this takes affect. Mob scaling and zone scaling. In terms of mob scaling i dont think it shouold exist. We are playing an RPG, we are growing in power and that should should visible when you fight mobs. Howevers thats not to say that some mobs shouldnt be harder, i just think scaling is not the answer. In terms of zone scaling there is also a sense of progression being ripped away here. In low lvl zones even though scaling was introduced to 'fix' lvling as it is today, it should only be a temporary fix. Because when lvling is truly fixed (i talk about it later) scaling shouldnt exist. Its the same with the new zones in legion and bfa where you get to CHOOSE where to go. I liked it better when both allaince and horde were sent to the same zones and progressed from there, and if u really wanted you could add some choice like they did in Wotlk with Borean Tundra and Howling Fjord.

Small specifics;

Mounts;
In terms of ground mounts i believe the best compromise would have been lvl 30 for normal and keep it at lvl 60 for epic riding. 20 and 40 are too low. And then in terms of flying mounts i have a problem with pathfinder. And before you say "oh you just want everything handed to you blah blah etc..." i want the complete opposite but pathfinder is unneccsary. Look at TBC and WOTLK, both allowed you to have flying at max lvl so whats the problem? Blizzard should instead design zones that utilize flying. Look at stormpeaks for example, you couldnt complete the zone without flying. Flying in Azeroth should have never happaned but its too late for that, not a big deal.

Customization;
We used to have talent trees, double the amount of stat choices, glyphs and gems. Some will argue that the modern talent trees are better and that the old trees were just cookie cutter, i honestly think the differnce is very small, but talent trees felt better and probably gave u just little bit more customization plus it tied into the rewards when lvling up (where it used to be that every other lvl you would get a talent point to spend and the others lvls you would get a new spell).

Pruning;
And speaking of spells, pruning has just been awful. Classes today have never felt so dissconnected. In classic at lvl 60 we probably have the same or even more spells than we do today at lvl 120. just think about that. Now before i get into i know full well that you cant keep gaining spells each expansion. There has to be a limit as its impossible otherwise. (i go into this later on). But this ties into pvp and lvling. Part of why lvling was fun and sometimes rewarding was that each lvl you leveled you got something. Be it a talent point or a new spell each level it felt you grew. Today we dont get talent points and we can literally go several lvls without even gaining a new spell and today and even in legion we stopped gaining spells all together and even a new talent row. And in terms of pvp it has lost part of its nuance and beaucse of that its always changing. Remember buffs? The whole thing just doenst feel right.

Mission tables;
No matter what you may think about mission tables i just feel like they dont have a place in an mmo. It just makes no sense. The idea is to make you feel like a commander of whatever but no one in their right mind feels like that, its just a chore, and even if its use is not as strong as it was in legion or wod its still ridiculous. Its designed specifically to keep you logging everyday and retaining your attention. But the thing is, before in WoW, people would stay logged in regardless because they just had fun and lvling was part of the end game and there was stuff to do, now blizzard are implenemtning things designed to keep you logged in whereas before we chose to stay logged in.

AP;
Anything related to artifact power, so ie; artifcat weps, azerite, azerite armor, artifact power; they are just failed systems. What they try to achieve in the end is just most customization (even after you removed half of what used to exist) but this time you have to farm ap forever. Thus another thing designed to keep you loggeed in. It just feels annoying. AP didnt exist before and it was fine. I feel pressured to farm it and farm it everyday even though i know i dont have to. And on top of that even if you decide to accept it and farm ap they have catch up mechanics, so basically it just devaulues your effort and wastes your time.

Im sure theres more but i cant think of it all at the moment, but here is another thing that is good to know;

Why did Blizzard do what they've done?

LFR;
Here's the thing guys, when you think about, if you put yourself in blizzar'ds shoes and saw that less than 1% of your playerbase were actually seeing the raids, as a company it makes sense that you would want your customers to play what you are creating so creating something like LFR made sense. And i think even at one point Blizz stated that it wasnt worth so much resources into creating raids that only 1% of the playerbase see. But in doing so, maybe without realizing it they destroyed the games core. So now everyone can raid, but at what cost? Whats the point now?

Queing;
So this refers to things like LFG. This is due to probably 2 things. The first being that looking for a group to do things via general/trade chat just took longer and if anything happened to just one person in that group, replacing him/her would take even longer (potentially), however at the same time it added more value to whatever you were doing and enabled social interaction to take place which is the backbone of an mmo. The second reason is probably realm population. As people changed factions or servers sometimes you just wouldnt see or find enough people to do things regurlarly so adding a queing like system makes sense right, Now you have an abundance of available players to do everything in the game. But at what cost again? I guess you guys can already figure that out. In order to fix this, instead of making stuff cross realm, they shouldve have merged realms which they started to do muuch later (maybe due to the fact that the technology wasnt there yet). That way its still the 'same' and only 'one' server but much more populated now. Anything cross realm just does more harm than good.

Sharding;
They added this as a solution to launch day lag and crashes. And by all means they have achieved that. Legion and bfa launch was smooth, and this was aided by the fact that people get to choose which zone to start in (which is another minor problem in my eyes). But the problem is sharding is mentioned above.

LvL Boost;
A by-product of lvling being so bad and ruined.

Time;
The biggest reason and also probably the instigator for alot of these changes that happaned to WoW. Blizzard, in order to cater to everyone playing the game have trivialzed and streamlined lieterally everything in the game to the point that nothing really matters anymore and everything is effectively pointless when you analyze it. Its understandable that people no longer have time, they have grown up, they have responsibilties, they have families, jobs, school and things to do. But heres the thing. The game was at its peak popularity when these systems were not in place. ??? Theres a perfect balance for hardcore and casual play, and i believe Wotlk somewhat hit that mark.

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Possible Solutions/compromises

LFG;
I believe a compromise for LFG could exist. An example would be to only allow LFG to be availble towards the end of an expansion. Ideally heirlooms too but its more complicated than that. So basically lvling would resort to how it useed to be with you going out into the world and summoning and etc.. And only towards the end where people have basically finished the game, only then could you speed things up and allow LFG in my eyes.

Heirlooms;
This is the only thing in which im completey thoughtless on what to do. You cant change much with this without people compeltey losing their minds and rioting. Its too late basically.

Cross-realm/Group Finder;
Anyting that cross realms just doesnt work in the long run. It ruins more than it fixes. Yea today we have more players available to us to do aynthing than ever before. But everything we do with them is jsut mindless gameplay. What shouldve been done and what can still be done/reverted is for servers to merge and not cross. Faction imbalanced and low pop servers should be merged with their counterparts creating a live big and full server. Group finder can stay but be unique to each server, that way social interaction is still possible.

LvL Squish;
This weighs into pruning and alot actually, if pulled off correctly it could fix alot for the game. Unlike the number squsih which jsut ruins more things than it fixes, a lvl squish could help fix alot of things.

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Realistically

There are few points, so either;

Blizzard likes the way the game is and nothing will change

Blizzad is aware of the problems but won't change becasue they can't for whatever reason

Its too late becasue at this point it's probably not worth it to change so much because the players are too used to the conveinces of today so that even though on paper the changes are better for the game it might have the opposite affect on the playerbase and people will leave thus resulting in less money for Blizzard.

Times have changed. Other reasons for why WoW might never regain the players they once had is because of real life reasons (like family or work or age), the story direction of WoW, or other games being more fun and popular and less time consuming. Its just impossible to rewind time. Change is inevtiable but that doesnt mean its always good. No doubt in my eyes all these changes are 'good' for the game and how it used to be but alas that is the reailty of WoW today. Its funny how the world works, the game will constantly be in a decline if blizzard continue they way they are but if they change for the better of WoW it might end up even worse.

TLDR;

There is no tldr for all of this, im sorry :( but to understand it all you have to read. Theres no way i can summarize this. So if you choose not to read based on how big the text is then theres not much i can do. I did my part and i voiced my opinions and thoughts since im so passionate for warcraft but it has changed so much. One might ask themselves, "isnt this all pointless?". Yea, it probably is but i wrote it anyway beacuase WoW (vanilla, tbc, wotlk) was the single greatest gaming experience ive had the pleasure of playing.

Thanks!
ERROR...ERROR...CONSTRUCTIVE CRITICISM....CANNOT COMPUTE!
15/09/2018 21:36Posted by Ulran
ERROR...ERROR...CONSTRUCTIVE CRITICISM....CANNOT COMPUTE!


u wot m8
15/09/2018 21:40Posted by Chunin
15/09/2018 21:36Posted by Ulran
ERROR...ERROR...CONSTRUCTIVE CRITICISM....CANNOT COMPUTE!


u wot m8


Even though I agree with your post, I'm afraid you have wasted your time. Unless you are posting to get a rise out of the fan boys, your post will get ignored even if it has good points about the issues WOW currently faces. Look back here in few days and I'm sure you will see some post about how everybody is "hating" on the expansion without actually providing any valid arguments why its bad when there are several posts like yours.
I'm gonna reserve this spot and bookmark your thread. It seems like you spent a lot of time writing it, so I probably gonna read it once I have the time for it.
you have some valid points.
i like fresh plaers with a new thinking about game

i actuallly think that too withy all of this spoon feeding free gear fest on hotde even
on a mother!@#$ing warfront
ever been in warfront ? this is so %^-*tty that i cvan gey banned

but it was highlighted from blizzard to players

i can go an fduck afl or vomit in this place
Look at historic posts from every expansion ever made here..

It’s the same every expansion and that’s a fact.

People hate change at first but when it’s all fixed and what not people will still be subbed.

The next expansion will then release with another hero class and the forums will be riddled with complaints with no explanation.

Good post though. Some good criticism here.
Spot on OP. +1
15/09/2018 22:34Posted by Dappypally
People hate change at first but when it’s all fixed and what not people will still be subbed.
No, they're not. Not really. Some of them are, because they adapt and like the new mode, but WoW subscriptions have been going steadily down since Blizzard abandoned precisely what the OP just mentioned. Subscriptions were growing until mid WotLK, peaked at 12M, and then started falling and falling and falling.

A huge chunk of the vanilla WoW playerbase is no longer playing the game, and there hasn't come a new playerbase to replace it which actually likes MMORPG's. WoW has become a co-op action game. If you like that, fantastic. I like co-op action games, but I like MMORPG's even more. I completely agree with the OP.

I think the most important point that he brings up is that gearing now effectively pointless. It's just a treadmill of numbers that inflate out of control, followed by a reset to our stats a few expansions later. In Legion we started out doing 150k DPS, at the end we did 2.5M DPS. It's flat-out broken, and yet during all of this time I unlocked exactly 0 new pieces of content through my efforts. I could easily have done Antorus LFR in my Emerald Nightmare Heroic and Mythic gear - all the content I got to see was unlocked trivial by Blizzard pushing a time-gating button. Not once was content unlocked organically.

In BfA it's even worse. The minute you hit 120 the entire world is opened up, all world quests are available, and as you gear up, the enemies gear up with you. Getting better gear does not unlock a single solitary piece of content except Siege of Boralus and King's Rest. That's it. It's just paper thin and really boring compared to what we used to get.

And now I get to enjoy running Uldir on 4 difficulty levels. When the next tier unlocks, Uldir will become completely useless, instantly superseded by a new tier with 4 difficulty levels, each providing such good gear with such minimal effort compared to Uldir, that Uldir is obsolete, even for completely freshly dinged players.

I don't understand why they design their game this way.
Easy content==more subs, timegating==more subs. It's not a difficult thing to grasp.
Eh, you get used to gear being fairly meaningless, it loses the buzz when you have to regear every new expansion. Just play the game to enjoy it without going gaga over yet another gear threadmill.

I for one do not mind sitting out the stress of organized raiding and m+ dungeons this expack, did enough of it in Legion. And there will be gear catchups soon enough with next tier. So I see no reason to go out of the way for it.

You have to face it, wow is not a hardcore game anylonger. Catering to the masses.

Look at wildstar, they tried to appeal to the hardcore and failed miserably.
First of all, dude, thanks!
Your post simply summarize everything I have been thinking about the game lately. I could not be more agree with you.

Gearing;
Gearing today has lost its absolute meaning and value.


This is absolutely on point. You can't shine with nothing. Everything is being outdated literally in hours.

Normal/HC;
This sort of bleeds into LFR. First of all having 4 diffciluties is just ridicoulous.


I will just leave it here cause, man, It is just so true.

PVP

Gearing;
I dont see the problem with just adding a vendor and have it like it used to be. People want it and it gives freedom and customization to buy the pieces we want. But instead Blizzard decides to continue making it RNG. Even today with BFA its less rng than legion its still doesnt feel nice. On top of that i think the Wotlk model worked perfectly for pvp gearing. You bought the pieces but also some pieces like the weapons were gated behind rating thus rewarding people with skill.


I think the whole concept of the gear for PvP is to aim for something and try to reach it with arenas and battlegrounds. In other words - we must have a vendor.

Time;
The biggest reason and also probably the instigator for alot of these changes that happaned to WoW. Blizzard, in order to cater to everyone playing the game have trivialzed and streamlines lieterally everything in the game to the point nothing really matters anymore and everything is effectively pointless when you analyze it. Its understanble that people no longer have time, they have grown up, they have responsibilties, they have families, jobs, school and things to do. But heres the thing. The game was at its peak popularity when these systems were not in place. ??? Theres a perfect balance for hardcore and casual play, and i believe Wotlk somewhat hit that mark.


Yep.

TLDR;

There is no tldr for all of this, im sorry :( but to understand it all you have to read. Theres no way i can summarize this. So if you choose not to read based on how big the text is then theres not much i can do. I did my part and i voiced my opinions and thoughts since im so passionate for warcraft but it has changed so much. One might ask themselves, "isnt this all pointless?". Yea, it probably is but i wrote it anyway beacuase WoW (vanilla, tbc, wotlk) was the single greatest gaming experience ive had the pleasure of playing.


I am so glad that finally someone spent their time to say all this. It is time for the people to realize the absurd and meaningless game experience that "modern" WoW offers to them.
15/09/2018 23:33Posted by Shljivovitza
Easy content==more subs, timegating==more subs. It's not a difficult thing to grasp.


yea but heres thing, the game will nver gain subs it will alwys decline beucase of how its changed. Thats why i mentioned its funny how the world works, So basically

you have people still subbed beaacuse things are easy but leaving becasue things are easy, so that if you made things like the game used to be (even though its better for the game and makes sense) its possible will leave even more because they have gotten used to all the convinences.
15/09/2018 23:44Posted by Kamazh
Eh, you get used to gear being fairly meaningless, it loses the buzz when you have to regear every new expansion. Just play the game to enjoy it without going gaga over yet another gear threadmill.

I for one do not mind sitting out the stress of organized raiding and m+ dungeons this expack, did enough of it in Legion. And there will be gear catchups soon enough with next tier. So I see no reason to go out of the way for it.

You have to face it, wow is not a hardcore game anylonger. Catering to the masses.

Look at wildstar, they tried to appeal to the hardcore and failed miserably.


but the gear is becoming pointless withint the expansion BEFORE the nxt expansion this time, thats my problem.
And the game doesnt have to be onyl hardcore, it can be both, like Wotlk, but modern wow today is comepletey pointless, like its just no reason.
all i see is a nostalgia-laden rant with zero understanding for why many features we have gotten over the years exist in the first place

if wow was left in a limbo where no cross realm, queue systems or various difficulty levels existed the game would have never remained this popular

also lol @ thinking doing lfr is the same or somehow devalues mythic raiding

there is valid criticism of bfa or modern wow in general (like mostly useless professions) but this incoherent rambling doesnt cut it
16/09/2018 06:37Posted by Daffon
all i see is a nostalgia-laden rant with zero understanding for why many features we have gotten over the years exist in the first place

if wow was left in a limbo where no cross realm, queue systems or various difficulty levels existed the game would have never remained this popular

also lol @ thinking doing lfr is the same or somehow devalues mythic raiding

there is valid criticism of bfa or modern wow in general (like mostly useless professions) but this incoherent rambling doesnt cut it


i have a whole part in where i explain why this stuff exists.
and yes. If the goal of the game is to complete raids, then i can do it lfr without gearing. Thats my whole problem. At this point the only reason people do mythic is becuase they like the challange. Like really? Thats why u play wow, cuz u like challenge? Dont get me wrong, i like challenge, but raiding and challenge used to be hand in hand, now they are seperate. Like, okay to get best gear u still have to do mythic. But why get best gear if i can jsut completet the raid regardless. u see what i mean.
A lot of delusional lies in the post, but this normally happens when people live in their bubble for years telling themselves they're not the problem - it's everything else.
16/09/2018 06:56Posted by Rusputin
A lot of delusional lies in the post, but this normally happens when people live in their bubble for years telling themselves they're not the problem - it's everything else.


care to explain?
its easy for you to say that but i need to udnerstand what you mean
Chunin while you make some good points your syntax is that of an 8th grader and unfortunately that detracts from your argument immensely.
All this effort from so many people to write such detailed reasons for disliking the state of the game...

It s very simple and obvious. It s called Diablo. Diablo 3 to be more exact. If you haven t already, play it. You ll see what i mean. Gear is easy to get, the way you play your class is restricted to a few combos of skills and gear. You don t improve your char by getting new gear since you can t change anything or you ll destroy your spec. Rng is the God, it decides what drops you get and how fast you can clear stuff (mob density). You don t get new content when you clear something, you can only increase the difficulty and try to beat the timer. And many more similarities.

It s a cheap solution for every dev since you don t have to come up with new raids, dungeons with mechanics that will surprise everyone, you just ask people to redo the same thing but faster and on a new difficulty lvl.

I don t find it bad for a game like D3, being a one time buy thing and all, but for wow...

But from what i remember people were quite interested in the model when some were raising alarms about D3 similarities and as i see they are kinda getting what they asked for, hence i have little sympathy for today's complainers.

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