I think this will be the last expansion

General
I think after 2-3 expansions, then there won't be more.

The reason is that the expansion model is a very old business model. Not many game companies release expansion-sized games anymore – and certainly not in physical game boxes!

DLCs is where it's at. Or where it will be. Content patches and optional, purchasable content.

Backloading so much content into an expansion that you withhold for the 2 years it takes to develop it is not ideal anymore. Customer retention is better maintained through frequent, but smaller updates.

This is what Blizzard does for all their other games. Smaller, but more frequent updates.

The 8-12 months long pre-expansion wait periods that WoW has are not sustainable.

The way we play WoW these days is also different from how it was in the past. A new expansion feels a bit bothersome these days, because it resets everything, removes something, and changes other things. That feels jarring today, whereas in the past it felt exciting.

A more steady flow of content patches is the way to go. Expansion packs belong in the past together with game manuals and CD-rom installation discs.
Ever heard of a vocal minority? The relatively small group of players who don't like the expansion will scream the house down and make threads such as this one whilst the people who actually like the expansion will just keep playing happily as it's been for every expansion to date. And before you say 'but there are more' now, no, the vocal minority have just found a way to maximize their noise levels.
With how its going, i think, next one will be the last one. That's considering if dev team doesn't change. They are obviously lacking new fresh ideas and passion for the game.

As of MMO genre its not dead yet, i could name at least 2 almost perfect concepts of MMO game which are there on surface you just need to find money and develop those perfectly. Thing is no one wants to do that.
01/10/2018 10:42Posted by Thedice
Everyone and their mother is rather vocal about how they hate BfA. But what they're really hating in their posts is the bread and butter MMO content, which is repeating quests at max and mechanical gauntlets (raids/M+) and not BfA itself.


Hate is a strong word.
I also think your wrong due to a misconception, I hear from a lot of people they do not like azerite gear or how dumbed down their class is, or the drip feed of content, or other mechanical stuff.

However No one complains about how the world looks, which imho looks beautiful.
Or how the leveling up process is, again the quests are top notch.

This however gets soured the moment a person enters the "endgame" max level and finds there isn't much to do.

This happens every expansion, Legion had the same issue, hit max level aaaaand nothing to do for weeks.

The other problem WoW has are game directors..
Every single one feels the need to press their own agenda, put their own staple on the game.
Which means they are always changing certain mechanics.
Instead of re-inventing the wheel, they could try to add on to existing mechanics, anyone else sick and tired of having their whole class re-invented every new expansion?
I doubt WoW is going to end any time soon, its still about the most popular MMO out there.
I dont even think that this expansion will be remembered that badly TBH. Blizzard are now staggering their content release better since Legion and so we really havent experienced the whole thing yet.
(although azerite gear is pants tho....)
01/10/2018 11:21Posted by Jito
The way we play WoW these days is also different from how it was in the past. A new expansion feels a bit bothersome these days, because it resets everything, removes something, and changes other things. That feels jarring today, whereas in the past it felt exciting.

Yeah I though about this too. Datamining and pre-emptively planning the most optimum path to cap (be that level or gear) has been the norm for a while now. For the world-firsters it's reasonable but then we also have all the raidkiddies copying what "the big boys" do. Indeed the model caters poorly to this mindset where anything not directly impacting this race is discarded.

01/10/2018 11:21Posted by Jito
A more steady flow of content patches is the way to go.

My experience is that content patches become quickly just a discard old - reintroduce "new". Essentially just the expansion model hastened.
01/10/2018 11:24Posted by Mondoe
Ever heard of a vocal minority? The relatively small group of players who don't like the expansion will scream the house down and make threads such as this one whilst the people who actually like the expansion will just keep playing happily as it's been for every expansion to date. And before you say 'but there are more' now, no, the vocal minority have just found a way to maximize their noise levels.


Ever heard of minorities who think they are majority?
01/10/2018 10:50Posted by Subbie
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_of_Warcraft:_Battle_for_Azeroth#Sales

"The expansion sold more than 3.4 million units on its first day of release according to Blizzard, making it the fastest-selling World of Warcraft expansion.[25]"

TLDR: No it won't be.

You realize that says absolutely nothing, right? Cataclysm sold 3.3 million units on its first day, and we all know how that one was received as well.

If you think big hype means good quality I can see a bright feature of getting ripped off left and right for you. Which is a good thing, because it means if I fail at everything in life, I will always have easily fooled people like you providing a source of income for me.
Art work , areas ,music are great. You can see a lot of work has been put in them .

I like the story so far , i did most of the areas quest chains for both alliance and horde and are quite nice.

I hate now that the honorbound is locked behind the exalted so it will take some time to get there.

For sure thats one of the big things to wait in 8.1 for me

Class design , azerite , buggs and exploits killed this expansion and made it bad .
01/10/2018 11:29Posted by Thedice
My experience is that content patches become quickly just a discard old - reintroduce "new". Essentially just the expansion model hastened.

But that is the WoW model. I think it's known as the rollercoaster model, as opposed to a sandbox experience or whatever.
Blizzard presents the content, and then we do that content. Like a rollercoaster, you're in it for the ride. And once you've tried one rollercoaster you happily move on to the next one!
Other games, like EvE Online, have other models. But WoW's is the rollercoaster model. Always has been.

If expansions were no more, the only difference in content patches would be size and scope. Think about it. The WoW team is somewhere between 200-300 developers. For the most part they just work on expansions. The moment one expansion is released they immediately begin working on the next one. And every 2 years we do get that giant pile of content in the form of a new expansion. But if you were to spread that work effort out across 2 years worth of content patches, that would be some serious content patches!
It won't be the last. As long as it's profitable, they'll continue doing more expansions. I've read somewhere that the number of subs required for a game to be profitable is ~500k. And WoW still sells millions.
Rofl not a chance.
01/10/2018 10:42Posted by Thedice
WoW as something else than a fancy hamsterwheel just wouldn't hold a cangle to other games


I tried to hold a cangle. It was too slippery though.
They probably have the next 4/5 Expansion already planned...what are u even talking about.
01/10/2018 11:49Posted by Jito
But that is the WoW model.

Exactly, just making it more fast and more piece-meal won't really solve the interest problem in my opinion. Heck, alot of games are doing a really poor job at it (DCUO comes to mind).

01/10/2018 11:55Posted by Shumensko
It won't be the last. As long as it's profitable, they'll continue doing more expansions. I've read somewhere that the number of subs required for a game to be profitable is ~500k. And WoW still sells millions.

Well this does give some sense of hope. I'm just afraid how much they compromise the game in an attempt to keep the severely diverse playerbase happy. They have a history with it.
01/10/2018 11:30Posted by Bubasparks
01/10/2018 11:24Posted by Mondoe
Ever heard of a vocal minority? The relatively small group of players who don't like the expansion will scream the house down and make threads such as this one whilst the people who actually like the expansion will just keep playing happily as it's been for every expansion to date. And before you say 'but there are more' now, no, the vocal minority have just found a way to maximize their noise levels.


Ever heard of minorities who think they are majority?

You talking about yourself ?
The forums is not a representative of the playerbase. Mostly its an echochamber in here, with people only hearing what they want to hear. Doomsayers having nothing better to do.

Look at the past, every expansion has been declared the end of wow. Yet it keeps chugging on. You will be wrong this time too.
01/10/2018 10:42Posted by Thedice
Everyone and their mother is rather vocal about how they hate BfA. But what they're really hating in their posts is the bread and butter MMO content, which is repeating quests at max and mechanical gauntlets (raids/M+) and not BfA itself.

For all the great stuff we have gotten lately just doesn't seem to interest people. They want this game to be something else than what it can be. I don't believe they will turn around the whole concept of "level - gear up - get achievements - make an alt" as a desperate measure. WoW as something else than a fancy hamsterwheel just wouldn't hold a cangle to other games (like esport titles). They tried to move towards that direction in Legion and now they're trying to move back to their roots. Feels like a twitching corpse in its deaththroes just doing anything to survive.

Tell me I'm wrong and that people haven't just finally given up on MMO's. I mean, it will happen one day, one day they will announce every future content as cancelled. This expansion, while beautiful and full of new things, feels like the last. Not because they're out of ideas.

but because we, as a community, are already mentally moving on. No king rules forever.


The main attraction for me is world exploration and overcome challenges using a character I created and using a toolkit I choose. Combat being the main feature.
Right now, combat does not feel good in pve and we don't have a toolkit to choose from anymore. The talent tree does not make any play significantly different.
I loved earlier expansions, where I could even choose talents cross specs.
Also, GCD for all skills is aweful and slows combat too much.
As it stands, combat is boring, and the main reason I really don't like this expac.
01/10/2018 11:31Posted by Naeya
01/10/2018 10:50Posted by Subbie
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_of_Warcraft:_Battle_for_Azeroth#Sales

"The expansion sold more than 3.4 million units on its first day of release according to Blizzard, making it the fastest-selling World of Warcraft expansion.[25]"

TLDR: No it won't be.

You realize that says absolutely nothing, right? Cataclysm sold 3.3 million units on its first day, and we all know how that one was received as well.

If you think big hype means good quality I can see a bright feature of getting ripped off left and right for you. Which is a good thing, because it means if I fail at everything in life, I will always have easily fooled people like you providing a source of income for me.


Damn, could you be any more aimless & clueless with your post?

Firstly, I never said anything about quality, and if anything, you posting Cataclysm's day one sales just further reinforces my point. Cata wasn't a greatly received expansion, true, but it still sold a ludicrous amount, and you know what? MoP followed, then WoD (which wasn't well received), then Legion, then BfA. BfA could honestly be the worst of the lot, but the sales alone mean that there will undoubtedly be a sequel.

Secondly, I've been one of the most objectively critical posters of BfA on the forums. The expansion has made me quit all forms of organized PvE, and has me questioning whether or not I should let my subscription lapse for the first time since Dragon Soul.

BfA is devoid of quality, and some might argue it's even devoid of quantity, but you can't argue with the sales, and that's what really matters when it comes to development: If they keep paying, we'll keep making. 3.4 million people paid, so they will, without a shadow of a doubt, make a new expansion.
01/10/2018 11:03Posted by Thedice
Heroes in Dota 2 also have 4 skills which usually are a dps, utility, passive, ulti. Imagine if they pruned classes more in WoW to achieve this balance in Warfronts and what have you.

I played healer in WotLK - hpal, dpriest, resto druid and shammy (mostly shammy) - I had like 3-4 buttons to play with + utility spells and it was more immersive than anything since WoD.

Quick edit: FOR GOD'S LOVE I don't say pruning is needed, I rather say gameplay is much slower than in past.

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