Dueling/Arena Tips

Rogue
Hello. I casually started doing some 2v2 and 3v3 arenas. What I noticed was that in 2v2 arenas, I was chasing their healer and they are chasing mine, enemy rogues are able to kill my resto druid healer 1v1 and I cant kill their resto druid healer.

I tried dueling my resto druid to see whats what, and I wasnt able to kill my resto druid healer in a duel. Our ilvls are similar.

The druid simply doesnt take that much damage in bear form. I can kick him and stun him to interrupt him twice, but even so then he just heals himself back again. When I use my CDs(vendetta etc) to burst him down, he uses either his own defensives, or mighty bash, cyclone and heal himself.

I seem to be something wrong since my damage doesnt seem to be enough.

My healer says that doesnt happen, he eventually dies against other rogues.

Could I have some tips? Thanks in advance.

Edit:If there are any youtube channels you know about rogue dueling/arena stuff, I would also be glad.
Hey there!
I'll start with your talents.
You need to replace the talent "Crimson Tempest" with "Poison Bomb".
Crimson tempest is useless.
You could also replace "Master Poisoner" with "Elaborate Planning". (I personally prefer this)
I also noticed that your stats are off... You need way more haste and mastery. Should be around 15% haste and 30% mastery.
Both your trinkets are useless. Especially the one that summon a cannon and can break your blind / sap.
You need better dps trinkets. (Like the ones I have by example)

Btw testing to kill your druid in a duel instead of arena is not relevant since in arenas you have dampening (healing reduction)

You should watch https://www.twitch.tv/pikabooirl he's a really good rogue and try to teach people everytimes he queues 2s.
17/10/2018 04:02Posted by Düsk
You need to replace the talent "Crimson Tempest" with "Poison Bomb".
Crimson tempest is useless.


Thanks! That was my bad, I go with posion bomb in arenas, but I switched to crimson tempest for AOE'ing in isle of conquest/alterac valley. Forgot to switch back before logging out.

17/10/2018 04:02Posted by Düsk
You could also replace "Master Poisoner" with "Elaborate Planning". (I personally prefer this)


Thank you, I'll try this.

17/10/2018 04:02Posted by Düsk
I also noticed that your stats are off... You need way more haste and mastery. Should be around 15% haste and 30% mastery.


Thank you for the info again. Really helpful.

17/10/2018 04:02Posted by Düsk
Both your trinkets are useless. Especially the one that summon a cannon and can break your blind / sap.
You need better dps trinkets. (Like the ones I have by example)


Thank you. I'll look for replacements right away.

17/10/2018 04:02Posted by Düsk
Btw testing to kill your druid in a duel instead of arena is not relevant since in arenas you have dampening (healing reduction)

You should watch https://www.twitch.tv/pikabooirl he's a really good rogue and try to teach people everytimes he queues 2s.


Thank you again. I'll check it out.

Overall reply: I know my reply is full of thanks, but thank you again for your very informative reply. I took notes of everything you said in my mind. Its good to have nice people.
Hello again. Today I had to choose between 3 traits, heed my call, blood siphon and earthlink.

I was inbetween heed my call and blood siphon. I took heed my call because it would grant better burst. I was worried about it breaking sap/blind at first but then poison bomb also has a similar aoe effect. I'm not sure if I made the right call. What would you guys think?
17/10/2018 17:11Posted by Natinatinaji
Hello again. Today I had to choose between 3 traits, heed my call, blood siphon and earthlink.

I was inbetween heed my call and blood siphon. I took heed my call because it would grant better burst. I was worried about it breaking sap/blind at first but then poison bomb also has a similar aoe effect. I'm not sure if I made the right call. What would you guys think?


Heed my call is the best choice imo.
It has 3 yards range so it can break your cc but it is very rare (never happened to me over 500+ games played.)
Poison bomb cannot break cc (not sure why) but it just doesn't :).
Thanks :)
Go check "skillcapped wow" on youtube. I know they have a guide for outlaw, but dunno if the assa one is up yet.
There is the answer for most of your questions :)
Edit: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c-nGV3iU3P0
18/10/2018 11:20Posted by Wifeswap
Go check "skillcapped wow" on youtube. I know they have a guide for outlaw, but dunno if the assa one is up yet.
There is the answer for most of your questions :)
Edit: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c-nGV3iU3P0


Will do. Thank you :)
Master poisoner increases the healing reduction on deadly brew so its worth taking, try getting used to feint instead of cheat death, internal bleeding since your playing with a druid and it scales with your mastery. Mastery/haste enchants would help instead of crit as you would for PVE since the value of crit is halfed in PVP. Don't bother taking smoke bomb at low CR in 2's go creeping venom, mind numbing poison and deadly brew for your talents(this allows you to tunnel healers too if thats your pref go to for winning). Most of your kidneys are going to go on kill target and try to save vanish for blind > sap combo on the healer if your CCing the healer.

as for traits you want atleast 1 in shroud of suffocation for combo point generation in your openers, the flat agi from raid azerite pieces helps much too even when its halfed in PVP, you can check other player's azerite gear on the armory by looking at the 2 vs 2 or 3 vs 3 bracket high rated rogues just to see what tier pieces they use.

Also be mindful its a team game, so if your healer dies alot and you are peeling it might be something he needs to look into too as assa rogue plays itself more or less.
18/10/2018 17:14Posted by Vulrin
Master poisoner increases the healing reduction on deadly brew so its worth taking, try getting used to feint instead of cheat death, internal bleeding since your playing with a druid and it scales with your mastery. Mastery/haste enchants would help instead of crit as you would for PVE since the value of crit is halfed in PVP. Don't bother taking smoke bomb at low CR in 2's go creeping venom, mind numbing poison and deadly brew for your talents(this allows you to tunnel healers too if thats your pref go to for winning). Most of your kidneys are going to go on kill target and try to save vanish for blind > sap combo on the healer if your CCing the healer.

as for traits you want atleast 1 in shroud of suffocation for combo point generation in your openers, the flat agi from raid azerite pieces helps much too even when its halfed in PVP, you can check other player's azerite gear on the armory by looking at the 2 vs 2 or 3 vs 3 bracket high rated rogues just to see what tier pieces they use.

Also be mindful its a team game, so if your healer dies alot and you are peeling it might be something he needs to look into too as assa rogue plays itself more or less.


Thank you. I'll look into these :)

How that i think about it, I used to go with smoke bomb + deadly brew + system shock at first, then I watched pikabooirl twitch where he said creeping venom is better than system shock, creeping venom is just better damage.

Düsk(see above) said he prefers elaborate planning and I've seen some people take this, so I picked that too. However i think I'll go with master poisoner in 2s(resto druid + rogue), and elaborate planning in 3s(Warrior + rogue + resto druid) because warrior has a healing reduction too.

Taking mind numbing poison instead of smoke bomb in low rated 2s makes sense while going for healers, but I'm going to pick smoke bomb if I'm going for the dps. I guess this makes sense.

Note: I didnt have time to watch other channels people here mentioned yet, but I will. So if what I say contradicts theirs, apologies.

Overall, I thank everyone here helping me here. I appreciate it :)
Master poisoner only increases the deadly brew effect by 3%, so imo it's not worth taking.
Elaborate planning all the away :)
18/10/2018 22:43Posted by Wifeswap
Master poisoner only increases the deadly brew effect by 3%, so imo it's not worth taking.
Elaborate planning all the away :)


Lots of people seem to think that way. Thanks :)
Elaborate planning is actually quite good in 2s because of the kind of dumb damage damage damage meta (at least at higher rating I see Fury Warriors Mistweaver Monks 60% of the games, and Holy Paladins for the rest, so Master Poisoner doesn't have THAT much value). In 3s Master Poisoner is a solid choice because it not only increases the MS effect, but also the slow and that's amazing. Not saying it's better than Elaborate Planning, but at least on par with it.

As for honor talents, you will most likely kill healers in a CC, not when they are freecasting heals. So if you really plan on taking down a resto druid on your own consider picking System Shock over Creeping/Mind-Numbing. Your best shot at killing a resto druid is on a kidney out of bear form and a couple envenoms with MfD. Then, picking System Shock makes sense.

If you want to kill Druids, you need to hit them hard while out of Bear form. As long as they are in Bear form they aren't casting. So what you need to do is DoT them, hit them a bit and when you see their HoTs are falling off just wait with 5cp to Kidney RIGHT when he pops out of Bear form, then go hard on him. You should use Toxic Blade in every Kidney as they share the same CD, and MfD in every Kidney as well. If the Druid has DoTs on him, and you go Kidney > Toxic > Mut > Envenom > MfD > Envenom he'll take a huge amount of damage. If you have Vendetta up and he doesn't trinket that he'll most likely die, which means he will trinket. Then, you just be patient and wait for another nice Kidney window, at the end you Vanish, Cheap Shot DR, and when Cheap Shot ends you Garrote (because you have to play Subterfuge). That's 6 + 2 + 3 = 11s CC on him during which you hit him with everything you have. 'cause if you go for the healer you don't need your vanish to sap, so you have to use it offensively.

And also, Smokebomb in 2s, even if you go for the dps, isn't worth it. Damage talents actually net better results. Sad, but true. As an assa you can make deadly swaps, so even if the dps is your main target you can find yourself in a situation where you step kidney healer and try to kill him, and if you fail and he runs away, you go back yo kill dps while healer is mending his wounds. You need damage for that, not smokebomb.

At least that's my experience of 2s until now, be it at lower rating or glad rating.

I did start to make a few vids if you type my Rogue name on yt you'll find them, if that can be on any help to you.
Thanks for the detailed tips. Helps a lot :)

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