M+ to difficult for randoms.

Dungeons & Raids
11/11/2018 10:19Posted by Restometer
I am not definitely trying to say that it’s pandora’s box or anything impossible. Voice communication helps, from 10-13 I don’t even care if we have communication, but from 13 I usually do request everyone to join discord.
All I was trying to say is that if someone wants to do M+ that he/she should be aware of certain stuff that’s going on. I am not saying that he/she must know everything, absolutely not, but from 10 or higher keys absolutely everyone should be aware of what’s going on and what his/hers responsibilities are. Most time loss is comming from wipes and therefore they shouldn’t happen. Voice communication will help achieve a better run overall, but I have to focus on some things on my own, I don’t have time to call every singe interrupt or call when should someone soak something. By speaking I can make better coordination so that interrupts for example on certain stuff don’t get overlapped etc.
If someone is new to M+ and want to start doing it, he shouldn’t be discouraged like “nope, too hard”, but he shouldn’t be like “people are zerging this, this must be easy”. For starting M+ they should know what is going on in each dungeon. Just the basics and that is good to start. By doing dungeons he/she will learn minor things that do matter. Later on you are simply not overgearing certain dungeon and you must have a perfect run to do it in time, this is where finesses kick in.

This is probably were we differ greatly in were this discussion are headed. Your talking about content above +10. When i think of PuG's i think of content within the current seasons balance range aka. 2-10 or before the rewards start to "fall off". once your past +10 your not really PuG'ing anymore then your looking for very specific players and sometimes classes with some sort of indication that they are at the level of skill required. The players pushing these levels of keys are also just playing for the challenge itself.

This discussion seems to been more about mythic+ for the general community. The people that do mythic+ to gear up or just to challenge themselves a bit. Which means it's a whole different community of players. So that's why i focus on the basic stuff, since you just need the basic knowledge to clear 2-9, slightly more tricks up your sleeve at +10 since you deal with the spawn of G'huun.

Ofcourse a +13 is hard for about anyone except for skilled individuals. But people opened this post talking about stuff between 2-10 which have a whole different community compared to the more professional dungeon pushing scene. If were supposed to start talking about keys beyond +10, were basicly adressing 10-15% of the total community.

You won't find tanks able to do the professional routes, players that know every ability or even "meta" constructed groups with the right skill sets to handle things like soothing enrage effects etc. while going into the the mythic+ scene at these levels... you can't expect people to play as players at blizzcon etc. It's not realistic, but the average joe going into a +5 expect this. Hence it seems hard, cause unnecessary frustration etc.

Even in clueless groups you can succeed in BfA since the dungeons are easy and the mechanics are so well telegraphed you basicly have to try to fail. Going on voice, or type a plan in chat really helps in these groups. But noone does that since they expect people to play perfectly...

Even more specifically the tanks are a target of this "play perfect" notion of groups lately and that starts in the first few normal mode leveling dungeons at lvl 15. No wonder many players are afraid to play a tank, not only is the playstyle quite "meh" unless you really enjoy it to begin with, but the pressure from the group is immense.

Helped out a few friends in myth0 on my paladin. Our healer was a fresh 120 without any gear... she had 110-118 greens(even the trinket you recieve after a a level boost lol). We managed it just fine by adjusting to what we had and i could have a great laught that i outhealed the healer at the end of the dungeons, good times lol.
Yeah, you’re absolutely correct I I drew the line a bit higher than I should. Don’t know honestly that much about 2-9 area since I did stop playing them and I am to lasy to level alts.
However I did help my friend, fresh warlock with M+ content 2 weeks ago. Using voice in that area is amazing, absolutely agree, but individuals should kinda prepare for them as they do for raid. They shouldn’t simply come to explore during run. They should definitely know some stuff that’s going on, and that will be going on since you have FF/Tyranical from +2. Honestly they shouldn’t expect someone to explain them during the run what should they be doing during each encounter. If they don’t know, that’s where your key is going to demote.
I remember when I was helping my friend that we wanted to do his FH +5, found a tank, and before we even started M+, I’ve wrote clearly that we are going to shroud to first boss, that everyone should stay within the range of shroud and follow me without going through units. Everyone agreed, random dps and healer we had even knew for shroud tactic to first boss, but tank? Well, he agreed and as soon as the dungeon started he pulled 2 packs and didn’t give a fck. At first I was disappointed, but as soon as he started “eating” frontals(I think it’s called “Brutal Backhand”) he died, we wiped and he instantly left. Now, shrould could’ve saved us a few mins, but it’s absolutely his fault not to know about frontals. That’s why I would still suggest anyone who wants to do M+ content should definitely be aware of stuff that’s going on. Voice can help in a lot of these things out since you can point out before a pack what should others keep in mind, but it doesn’t help if they are clueless.
As for tanking, difference between good and okay tank are huge. Also differences between okay and bad tank are even greater. I was maining tank before hopping into bfa, I was playing WoTLK on private server and only thing I was doing was tanking. I absolutely like that play style, but there is one big thing now. Their mistakes are easily spotted and could be mostly deadly and cause a wipe. As I have heard in the end of Legion there were a lot of tanks, now in bfa, there aren’t so many. It’s not all about rotation but also includes game knowledge a lot. People who opted to play tanks in BfA since start probably spent way more time learning stuff, encounters etc. than others. Currently it takes a lot of knowledge to do well as tank. As I have mentioned example above, you shouldn’t do certain dungeons if you don’t know them. It doesn’t matter if you make a mistake, but problem is that tanks mistakes are in 99% of the cases more important than DPS ones. Everyone should be carrying their weight, unfortunately currently tank has huge weight to carry.
Whoever starts BfA should imho jump into dps first before anything else.
These wannabe elitists with 1k rio score leaving after 1 thing that doesn't satisfy them. I don't care if i have to ruin they're gameplay they way they ruin mine so im gonna post they're names everywhere i can so no more m+ keys get thrown in the thrash. Lovermp-kazzak is a very good example of this. You can inv him to ur group if u want ,but be prepared to throw it in thrash after first mistake.
Problem is that outside weekly chest, the max reward from mythic+ is the same as that from casual content like warfronts, so what's the point of doing m+ unless you spam +10 and higher for TF/WF? But at that level it's too difficult for most people.
12/11/2018 11:13Posted by Laakimage
These wannabe elitists with 1k rio score leaving after 1 thing that doesn't satisfy them. I don't care if i have to ruin they're gameplay they way they ruin mine so im gonna post they're names everywhere i can so no more m+ keys get thrown in the thrash. Lovermp-kazzak is a very good example of this. You can inv him to ur group if u want ,but be prepared to throw it in thrash after first mistake.

These elitists have been wiping for 200-300 keys already.

Once you get to the "elite" level, you'll do the same.

I had my share of braindead people destroying keys, sorry, but it's been enough, my time has been direspected enough and won't take it anymore.

Can you blame me, tho?
Dude you either play high keys or very low keys.
Like for me its easier doing +12 with randoms then a +8 because ppl at higher lvls know what they do and ppl at lower lvls dont think at all like they lack basic common sense.

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