BfA is dead, please dont screw up next expansion.

General
I remember the start of Legion, all of the HATRED towards the artifact weapon and the painful artifact power grind that followed. When Legion was first announced with the weapons, Blizzard got a lot of hatred about them. People saying it didn't feel "special" and other things. Though some of the content feels empty, there's more to do in BFA than there was in Legion at this point. IE's aren't great, but that's still something that wasn't in Legion. Same as WF's and the rares that spawn. Surumar was also majorly time-gated behind rep JUST to be able to complete that zone.

Now that BFA has hit, everyone LOVES the and misses the weapons, misses the grinds and misses so much about Legion. Even when Legion came out, people missed some things about WoD. It's just a never ending circle. People hate "new", but when they get used to it and something else comes out that's "new", they then miss the old thing that they originally hated.
People are saying "wait for more content, its just 2 months old".

Yes that is true and valid argument, but they are not going to do total rework on every class and fix 90% of stuff in few months between patches.

I am enjoying Uldir more than Trial or Nightmare, with future invasions and more warfronts it will be more fun too and they might add some new things.

But the actual gameplay, the main horse azerite system and class gameplay is going to be the same.
When it comes to any big improvements BFA can be considered dead, now it is only about keeping the content, be it warfronts dungeons or campaign, interesting.
22/10/2018 10:51Posted by Chiarc
8.1 is actually going to be awesome.

Will it? I hope we won't have to say the same about 8.2 when 8.1 is live. BfA has a terrible track record so far for the optimistic players.

BfA Alpha: relax it's just alpha
BfA Beta: relax it's just beta
BfA Prepatch: relax it's just prepatch
BfA Launch: relax 8.1 will fix everything

Will it though? Again I hope so but it doesn't seem likely.
22/10/2018 13:52Posted by Shortbolts
My 2c is when the next expansion hits, a lot of people will be doing the "This expansion is terrible, go back to BFA things!". Same happened for Legion, WoD, MoP and others xD.

I suspect the reason behind these was that communication from Blizz… ohh sorry, Activision was lacking. Not to mention discussions, have not seen any of those proposed by them. Introducing a lot of changes without asking or notifying the recipients in advance is a terrible idea.
I hope it will bounce back like MoP.
The thing that worries me the most is; we will face Azshara.
Please don't let such a great character die in an expansion that many people will probably remind as a failure. Azshara is a legend in lore, a mystique, a goddess. The light of lights. <3 I was so hyped about her for almost 14 years now, even more when I realised we will actually see her in game.
8.1 is actually going to be awesome.

Yeah, can't wait for Legion inva... i mean Faction Incursions. Hopefully they would be same as in legion but nerfed (as everything in BfA).
We have lost our legendaries, something which provided unique, fun and powerful traits that we could play around with and farm for.

We lost our Artifact (and many classes the artifact ability) but mostly, a WHOLE BUNCH of little traits that added cool things to each spell. Some of them were very strong.:(


you complain about losing legion legendaries and the artifact traits but for 90% of legion every single person was complaining about how the legendary system was the worst loot system they ever put into the game.

You also say that the artifact traits added "cool things" the vast majority of traits on the artifacts were worse than the azerite traits, the only really interesting traits on the legion artifacts were the golden ones, the others were mostly passive, things like bonus crit change on a specific spell, or flat damage on dots, or something else very minor and very passive.

people have spent way too much time just complaining about a system they are not fond of rather than giving some kind of constructive criticism about the game and offer suggestions on how to improve it and then wonder why the devs are so unlikely to reply or listen to them.
Speak for yourself.

It's not the best expansion ever, but I'm still enjoying it as a casual (unfortunately I don't have too much time to play).
the bad things are so bad that completely distract me from any good things! i can't focus on the good things!
like, every time i enter Uldir i can't help but think that someone decided that it's acceptable to have to dismiss pets as you walk in to the first boss of the first raid of the new expansion they sat in a table and they said "it's two clicks what's the big deal"
...as if classes with pets didn't suffered enough over the years.
22/10/2018 09:06Posted by Vanimelde
I don't honestly think BfA is that bad as people here and on reddit state so but compared to Legion it has so few it hurts.

Legion was CRAP (for some people like you) the first patch THIS IS that first patch.
Heck, some people will say only at nighthold did they manage to fix much of it.

22/10/2018 14:03Posted by Meristu
People are saying "wait for more content, its just 2 months old".

Yes that is true and valid argument, but they are not going to do total rework on every class and fix 90% of stuff in few months between patches.

They do not need to do a total rework on every class. People would love this in theory but people do not remember the bad things about the specs in the past complaining about your own spec has happened FOREVER even in Legion where we had a 5% dps difference FROM TOP dps spec to BOTTOM in the last 2 raids of the expansion.
The lowest % between the dps classes EVER was not enough for many people.
you asking for 90% of stuff to be changed shows how little i should care about you.

22/10/2018 14:03Posted by Meristu
But the actual gameplay, the main horse azerite system and class gameplay is going to be the same.
When it comes to any big improvements BFA can be considered dead,

I guess Legion was dead for you in the first patch of Legion.
as legendaries sucked to get the AP system sucked you could not have alts or even change spec without sacrificing Your main spec ability to do content.
You had to do suramar quest chain for the ability to open dungeons later on.
And so much more and that is before the bugs in the game at the time.
22/10/2018 17:10Posted by Hthonia
every time i enter Uldir i can't help but think that someone decided that it's acceptable to have to dismiss pets as you walk in to the first boss of the first raid of the new expansion they sat in a table and they said "it's two clicks what's the big deal"
...as if classes with pets didn't suffered enough over the years.


i am a warlock main and have never had to dismiss my pet walking up to taloc, what makes you think that you need to?
22/10/2018 13:52Posted by Shortbolts
My 2c is when the next expansion hits, a lot of people will be doing the "This expansion is terrible, go back to BFA things!". Same happened for Legion, WoD, MoP and others xD.


I dont think ive ever seen a serious post about that Legion sucks and we should go back to the 0 world quests, Trashran and Garrison WOD.

And people usually dont say "this expansion sucks as hard as Legion", they say "this expansion is almost as bad as WOD" which proves that people dont trash current content and looks back for nostalgia, they know when an expansion sucks.
22/10/2018 18:23Posted by Barry
22/10/2018 17:10Posted by Hthonia
every time i enter Uldir i can't help but think that someone decided that it's acceptable to have to dismiss pets as you walk in to the first boss of the first raid of the new expansion they sat in a table and they said "it's two clicks what's the big deal"
...as if classes with pets didn't suffered enough over the years.


i am a warlock main and have never had to dismiss my pet walking up to taloc, what makes you think that you need to?


i've entered a total of 5-6 times with a hunter and my pet got stucked every single time, i assumed it was the same for warlocks too
google it i'm not the only one
22/10/2018 18:14Posted by Ayellin
22/10/2018 09:06Posted by Vanimelde
I don't honestly think BfA is that bad as people here and on reddit state so but compared to Legion it has so few it hurts.

Legion was CRAP (for some people like you) the first patch THIS IS that first patch.
Heck, some people will say only at nighthold did they manage to fix much of it.

22/10/2018 14:03Posted by Meristu
People are saying "wait for more content, its just 2 months old".

Yes that is true and valid argument, but they are not going to do total rework on every class and fix 90% of stuff in few months between patches.

They do not need to do a total rework on every class. People would love this in theory but people do not remember the bad things about the specs in the past complaining about your own spec has happened FOREVER even in Legion where we had a 5% dps difference FROM TOP dps spec to BOTTOM in the last 2 raids of the expansion.
The lowest % between the dps classes EVER was not enough for many people.
you asking for 90% of stuff to be changed shows how little i should care about you.

22/10/2018 14:03Posted by Meristu
But the actual gameplay, the main horse azerite system and class gameplay is going to be the same.
When it comes to any big improvements BFA can be considered dead,

I guess Legion was dead for you in the first patch of Legion.
as legendaries sucked to get the AP system sucked you could not have alts or even change spec without sacrificing Your main spec ability to do content.
You had to do suramar quest chain for the ability to open dungeons later on.
And so much more and that is before the bugs in the game at the time.


Well I liked the talents from weapons and I liked passives from legendaries so that remained the same throughout whole expansion, fact that legendaries were just glorified trinkets and that !@#$ AP farming killed alts and multispec classes also didnt change.

Never liked class campaigns or stupid garrison tamagochi, nightborne were boring, first raids were total trash too, meeting broken demon hunters on every step was annoying as hell, story with stupid illidan even worse, then we get second tamagochi on broken shore etc etc ...

Well the point is yeah, legion didnt change during whole expansion, they added some dungeons or raids or quests or whatnot but if the weapons were still the same:
Crappy farming with some stupid mechanics and lot of asking why we couldnt just get our talents back and aside from few new talents (new azerite tratis will come too) that whole system didnt change a bit.
If you think about it, the artifact skill trees was nearly identifcal to the talent trees of old. Save for the fact that youd eventually be able to max it out.
With the golden abilities being those cool abilities you could unlock at certain spots, with the rest of the talent tree simply being boring fluff passives. Almost everyone took the best path theorycrafters deduced. And if you didnt have them, you were a bad.
22/10/2018 11:06Posted by Keele
22/10/2018 10:53Posted by Savola
good one
so you bought a new car...engine does not start, doors fall off, tires are flat. it stays in garage, you sitting inside for a half year, imagining you are driving it and hoping it will fix by itself
thx for giggles
Nope, BFA is a 100% functional game, regardless of how much you dislike playing it.

professions are functional?
thx for giggles
22/10/2018 19:24Posted by Savola
professions are functional?
thx for giggles


There's a difference between functionality and usefulness. Just because something is useless, does not mean it doesn't function. You can still MAKE the items with a little/a lot of grinding, but the items are useless.

22/10/2018 19:00Posted by Daerwicsh
I dont think ive ever seen a serious post about that Legion sucks and we should go back to the 0 world quests, Trashran and Garrison WOD.


Yes, I was more thinking when Legion came out, they wanted it back to MoP (Which is what they want now). But, my point still stands. First few months of Legion were nothing but terrible lag spikes, MAJOR artifact power grinds, quests trapped behind reps, a raid that not many people enjoyed (I think more enjoy Uldir, can't be certain though) and the introduction of the WQ system/emissary quests, which a lot of people started hating on almost instantly. Not to mention the hate for the Artifact weapons, and how people said it will "ruin the feel of the gameplay, bring back normal weapons!".

Where as now, 2 years after the Legion launch, the weapons are missed by many, the terrible grinds and lag spikes forgotten by many, and people actually MISS Legion. But, they don't miss early Legion, they miss end of Legion, where there were plenty to do because of it being the end of the expansion.

And that's what I mean by it happens each expansion. When a new one comes out, there's much less content then the end of the last expansion, which makes the world feel empty and boring. People expect to jump into a new expansion and get the same amount of content they were getting from the old one, and that's sadly not how it works.
The games been dead since the WoD expac
22/10/2018 09:25Posted by Keébz
You actually nailed it in this post.

Of all the problems with RNG and Looting in this game, I could easily, EASILY forgive if the actual combat of the game didn't feel so .. weak?

I feel like I have leveled to 120 and become less powerful.

Obviously, number wise, I do more dmg than in Legion.. but all my characters just feel less powerful on the whole.

We have lost our legendaries, something which provided unique, fun and powerful traits that we could play around with and farm for.

We lost our Artifact (and many classes the artifact ability) but mostly, a WHOLE BUNCH of little traits that added cool things to each spell. Some of them were very strong.

So in RELATIVE terms, our characters are stronger, but compared to their environment at the time, they are weaker.

Add to that the GCD changes which make combat feel like you are having a stroke whilst playing.. and overall it just doesn't FEEL good. :(

Not when we had legion anyway. If we had arrived here from WoD, I would be over the moon with the expansion, but to have tasted what our classes COULD be like in legion, only to lose it all and become weak, is very tragic :(


Putting the shamn class weakness aside I'm literally dreading getting to BFA content, I really don't want to feel that weak against open world enemies. I won't be able to dedicate the time commitment required to get to a decent ilvl so when I do reach level cap i have not a lot to look forward to except a struggle vs map mobs. Its demotivating me to the point of turning off xp at 110 and shelving the game until the next expansion comes around, and I really really don't want to do that.

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