IS wow pay to win now.

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"Pay to win"When you are boost a char,change factions or buy a mount ,Does it increase you any stats or you get anything special that is useful in the game that the rest who dont spend money dont have?How is it pay to win then?
08/11/2018 13:34Posted by Vaaleera
08/11/2018 13:15Posted by Crypsi
If you can't see that WoW is a Fully p2w game then u are blind....

You can buy a boost for literally anything nowdays, Glad in arena, m+, mythic raid boss kills, anything u want.

Some of you say it's fine cause it has been like that for years... i don't know how it makes it ok just because it has been going on for long enough but before at least blizzard used to ban people who bought gold, and the community frowned upon boosts... Now half of my guild are buying PvP boosts for gold to get achievements/mounts/gear and no one actually sees it as a wrong thing to do.

You say that you win nothing by buying boosts but it is obvious that u do. There are casual people who don't do much hard content and it might take them a month to clear heroic for the curve achievement, meanwhile anyone with a bit of extra money can do it in 2 hours by just buying 4 tokens, also they would get every single item that they can use from that run.

You might say that gear and achievements mean nothing and you are not winning because you are not skilled, but the rotations and overall class complexity has been dumbed down so much that it is literally 4 buttons u press over and over on almost any given class. You have so many addons to help you with everything that it makes the mechanics on bosses trivial. So most of your DPS increase does come from gear and distinguishing between a person who got boosted and not is not a very easy task.

Granted u can not buy the VERY highest things like world first or rank 1 in pvp but that is earned only by a handful of people in the world, for most people winning in this game is clearing raids, getting those achievements and that gear. I bet more than 90% of you posting here saying it is not p2w have gear and achievements that could be easily bought for gold, so how is it not p2w if i can create a brand new account and have same !@#$ as you within a week while u spent 2 months tryharding for it.

I have sold boosts myself, and i quit the game after realizing that nothing i earn myself really matters because any person with a deep wallet can stand next to me in orgrimmar and if u inspect us both it will seem like we both have same stuff yet i earned it all myself while he just whipped out his wallet and got it. The biggest problem with this is that people are either completely blind and don't wanna admit that their beloved game is p2w or they agree with it but they think is is completely fine for it to be this way. Blizzard is to blame for allowing gold to be bought for money, but community is to blame for making boosting a regular highly available and accessible thing that everyone is doing.


He paid to reach that level you played to reach that level, in the end you both reached that level , the game it's not P2W get over it. It would be P2W if he would have gear that you couldn't access and he would be picked in groups/parties / have an advantage over you just because of the wallet. The only advantage he had by paying that money was that he skipped the time to play the actual game. 13euro value gives you a month of skipping the content via gold in game and boosting.


Excuse me ? p2w is exactly what your first sentence states, you can get same places with money as u can without, also unless u are clearing full mythic raids or u are a gladiator level pvper (which 99% of people do not and are not) people can easily buy better gear and achievements than u, and they would get prioritized into a pug or even a guild over you. Lets say a fairly casual guild that has like 3 mythic bosses killed is looking for a person, there are 2 ppl OF SAME SKILL LEVEL applying and one only has full heroic cleared and 370 ilvl, and the other one has bought 4 bosses in mythic and has 380 ilvl, which one would get invited you think ? :D . Besides that a guy who bought the boosts will have better logs since he will have better gear...
08/11/2018 13:45Posted by Crypsi
08/11/2018 13:34Posted by Vaaleera
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He paid to reach that level you played to reach that level, in the end you both reached that level , the game it's not P2W get over it. It would be P2W if he would have gear that you couldn't access and he would be picked in groups/parties / have an advantage over you just because of the wallet. The only advantage he had by paying that money was that he skipped the time to play the actual game. 13euro value gives you a month of skipping the content via gold in game and boosting.


Excuse me ? p2w is exactly what your first sentence states, you can get same places with money as u can without, also unless u are clearing full mythic raids or u are a gladiator level pvper (which 99% of people do not and are not) people can easily buy better gear and achievements than u, and they would get prioritized into a pug or even a guild over you. Lets say a fairly casual guild that has like 3 mythic bosses killed is looking for a person, there are 2 ppl OF SAME SKILL LEVEL applying and one only has full heroic cleared and 370 ilvl, and the other one has bought 4 bosses in mythic and has 380 ilvl, which one would get invited you think ? :D . Besides that a guy who bought the boosts will have better logs since he will have better gear...

The 370ilvl guy can find a good guild to do mythic too so he can gear up.
07/11/2018 12:38Posted by Berserka
I noticed that you can buy WOW token for real money and sell them for gold in the AH. Effectively your buying gold.

Gold can be used to get boosted in Mythic Raids,Mythic+ Dungeons and PVP ranking

So rather than get good find a decent group of player you can just pay Blizzard cash for gold and beat the game with money.

Does no one else see a problem here ?

Whats wrong with people who want to use their real life cash to buy gold in WOW, instead of going out and farming it? Not everyone can spend hours in WOW to get gold, some simply want to be able to buy things on the AH. Look at it this way, guilds that are selling coveted gear, mounts, and other items can make gold from people who do not want to farm these items. But people need the large amount of gold to buy them. I buy WOW tokens and do not see an issue with it.
Still you make no sense even if someone spends millions in the game for gold you can reach him, sure it's gonna take you more time than he did but you ain't gonna spend real money to get there
08/11/2018 13:55Posted by Kellox
Still you make no sense even if someone spends millions in the game for gold you can reach him, sure it's gonna take you more time than he did but you ain't gonna spend real money to get there


You either do not understand what p2w means or you do not have enough experience with the game...

Mythic raids and Gladiator level pvp is considered the hardest content in the game, so only a fraction of dedicated people reach and clear it. Most of people do not fully clear the mythic raid or get Gladiator mounts/titles yet u can do that for gold, so you can buy the tokens and get it. I don't know how to explain it better to you but it is OBVIOUSLY a p2w game.

The whole definition of p2w game is a game where rewards from the hardest content in the game can be acquired by paying for it with real life money. Which in WoW's case is 100% true.
08/11/2018 14:10Posted by Crypsi
08/11/2018 13:55Posted by Kellox
Still you make no sense even if someone spends millions in the game for gold you can reach him, sure it's gonna take you more time than he did but you ain't gonna spend real money to get there


You either do not understand what p2w means or you do not have enough experience with the game...

Mythic raids and Gladiator level pvp is considered the hardest content in the game, so only a fraction of dedicated people reach and clear it. Most of people do not fully clear the mythic raid or get Gladiator mounts/titles yet u can do that for gold, so you can buy the tokens and get it. I don't know how to explain it better to you but it is OBVIOUSLY a p2w game.

The whole definition of p2w game is a game where rewards from the hardest content in the game can be acquired by paying for it with real life money. Which in WoW's case is 100% true.
You are clearly the only one here that doesn't understands what p2s is
07/11/2018 12:45Posted by Berserka
07/11/2018 12:42Posted by Elensentier
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Which part of ‘No’ confused you?


Explain how buying gold with cash and then buying a boost is not pay to win?


Because boosting your character through M+ or raids doesn't guarantee you anything. Also, if you put a well geared but terrible player against a badly geared but good player, the bad players will get absolutely destroyed. Skill>Gear, every damn time. So no, this is not P2W.
07/11/2018 12:45Posted by Berserka
07/11/2018 12:42Posted by Elensentier
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Which part of ‘No’ confused you?


Explain how buying gold with cash and then buying a boost is not pay to win?


How is that a win? You buy gold, buy a boost, get 2-3 piece of gear if you are lucky and then 2 months later even that 2-3 piece gear won't matter at all because the new raid comes out and in the end you just wasted 20$ on literally nothing that would make you look like a winner. Sure, you can buy a token every two week for boosts and then you can be the idiot who bought 50 token and wasted 1000$ on a game instead of playing it properly with other people.

Winners are those who clear content properly while they are having fun with their friends/guild. They also don't have to pay 20$ in order to do that.
ill try to make it simple and put it in one sentence:

"In WoW all the end game achievements and gear can be acquired by spending real life money."

that is a fact that you just can not argue... thus i will leave u with that and hope you are smart enough to figure out if it is p2w or not :D
08/11/2018 14:10Posted by Crypsi
The whole definition of p2w game is a game where rewards from the hardest content in the game can be acquired by paying for it with real life money. Which in WoW's case is 100% true.

Nah, p2w is when something that offers a competitive advantage is available through pay and cant be aquired through play.
07/11/2018 12:51Posted by Berserka
One is rich one is not money wins

Welcome to RL
Seeing how a skilled player who never paid a dime will still destroy unskilled boosted moron both in PvP and PvE...I fail to see p2"WIN" here. Pay to progress faster, pay to skip some annoying roadblocks = sure. But you don't WIN anything by paying.

I don't think you've ever seen a true p2w game, where you actually NEED to pay to play at the highest level. WoW is not it, and never will be.
but people have been paying me gold for years to get them boosted in raids
08/11/2018 14:49Posted by Wíkl
Seeing how a skilled player who never paid a dime will still destroy unskilled boosted moron both in PvP and PvE...I fail to see p2"WIN" here. Pay to progress faster, pay to skip some annoying roadblocks = sure. But you don't WIN anything by paying.

I don't think you've ever seen a true p2w game, where you actually NEED to pay to play at the highest level. WoW is not it, and never will be.


People just try to blame their lack of skill on the nearest conivient target, no matter how wrong they are
Sinds when does gold give you a advantage ? please tell me
Even if it was what is the problem?

To sum up what I have seen so far:
The argument is that one can buy mythic gear indirectly though being boosted and thus takes less time to get there.

This has one of two effects:
1 the player is actually good but does not have the time, they will do well with that gear and clear some content now, so they effectively just reduced the grind to perform at the level their skill level dictates.

2 the player has mythic gear and still sucks and gets 5% parses for their Ilvl in everything. Yes they can now be near the top dps in normal raids compared to someone who is actually good and at an apropriate level, but whats the point?

Someone without a drivers license can buy a Ferrari too if they have the money, for whatever reason they see fit, it does not make them a race driver.

Rotations are no longer super complex no but the difference between someone who just hits buttons and someone who actually knows how to play the class is still there and quite large, anyone who says otherwise is just lying to themselves for some reason.
08/11/2018 14:16Posted by Zenjiru
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Explain how buying gold with cash and then buying a boost is not pay to win?


Because boosting your character through M+ or raids doesn't guarantee you anything. Also, if you put a well geared but terrible player against a badly geared but good player, the bad players will get absolutely destroyed. Skill>Gear, every damn time. So no, this is not P2W.


I've said this a few times in this thread, yet it just get's dismissed. "Oh, they still get the gear, so it IS pay to win". Clearly it isn't.

If you put everyone with the same ilvl against each other, you'll EASILY be able to see the boosted player.
If you put every 370 against 340-350's, you'll EASILY be able to see the boosted player.
If you go into a Mythic raid or a Mythic+10 run, and see a 370-390 player doing barely any damage and messing up on every mechanic, you can see a boosted player.

Pay to Win may give you an advantage with gear, but that's it. If someone gifted me a Ferrari but I didn't know how to drive, I wouldn't be able to control the car. Where as someone who CAN drive and spent the time to learn would be able too.

08/11/2018 17:18Posted by Murlocleave
Someone without a drivers license can buy a Ferrari too if they have the money, for whatever reason they see fit, it does not make them a race driver.


I am so sorry, I didn't actually notice this comment since I had Quoted much further up, and it seems we made the same analogy xD
08/11/2018 16:07Posted by Evilbefall
Sinds when does gold give you a advantage ? please tell me

So gold is worthless ingame? For gold you can get all what game can offer to us.
Real money should not have any impact on gameplay, otherwise its p2w/skip progress.
its pay to lose because u lose ur money lol

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