8.1 breaks levelling XP

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10/11/2018 19:28Posted by Murlocleave
I have a question to people who want it to be slower.

What is your endgoal? 4 days playtime per talent point? 1000 hours played for max level?
What is the point?

Leveling was never hard, even during old days yes it took time but that was not why it felt rewarding, it felt rewarding because you got something every level.

Levelling is something you can overcome with time no matter how "hard" it is, you can always overcome it by throwing time at it. There is no challange there, there is no failstate at all. Time=/=feeling rewarded.

Just making levelling take longer is the exact same as giving current hogger in elywyn forest 600billion hitpoints. It is not one bit harder or more rewarding you still can't die, you still can't lose you just punch him for 2 days and drops the same grey bracers.

Making levelling take longer does not make it mean more.


I think I can explain. I don't know when you started playing wow but this game was never a hack'n'slash with spell casters tacked on the side.

WoW was an mmorpg, much emphasis on the RPG part there.

The slower pacing of the old game was much more akin to how it would feel growing into your boots. They say a skill takes 10,000 hours to master in the real world and for the first 5% of that you're gonna suck so hard you'll be asking what the !@#$'s wrong with yourself.

After that 5% though, you start understanding and comprehending the skill path, you actually gain knowledge and it feels good. It motives you to carry on, a bit like gaining a level. So you keep going and you learn a new technique in your skill and it feels great! So far you've poured maybe 1000 hours in and this is you now. You are your skill and there's no turning back.

Soon people start to rely on you for you service because you're good, useful because you know that skill. A bit like being good at your class but you're still only level 40.

The point here is that the slower pacing lended itself to the very real feeling of achievement. When smething is just handed to you then that euphoric feeling isn't present, and you just feel like it's yet another obstacle to overcome (new spell) when instead it should feel cool to learn a new spell and figure ou how to weave it into your playstyle.

This is why new players feel so overwhelmed when they first join, a lot of them skip the leveling process and now they've got 30 spells to figure out what to do with and they have no idea. So it feels boring reading everything and figuring it out and instead of achieving something good it only ever feels like you're playing catchup just so you can enjoy the game and play with others.

Slower pacing and longer leveling is more to do with emphasising the idea of growing, achieving and role playing. The whole process is very immersive, with each passing day you're getting closer to your end-goal instead of just being given it or feeling like max level is the game. It should be something like 50/50 but instead now it's more like 10/90 and it feels awful.

I also want to mention that during the slower paced leveling process, sometimes it did get monotonous but these are the times when players would just choose to do something else instead like go exploring, role play in goldshire or anywhere, go fishing, level up some profession or simply hang out in trade chat. You chose to do something fun while you took a breather from leveling, just like in real life you might stop working to go hang out with your friends and party. Not to mention the wpvp too, the raids the happened and you were welcome and involved no matter what level you were because it was just fun.
11/11/2018 04:18Posted by Abacabb
10/11/2018 19:28Posted by Murlocleave
I have a question to people who want it to be slower.

What is your endgoal? 4 days playtime per talent point? 1000 hours played for max level?
What is the point?

Leveling was never hard, even during old days yes it took time but that was not why it felt rewarding, it felt rewarding because you got something every level.

Levelling is something you can overcome with time no matter how "hard" it is, you can always overcome it by throwing time at it. There is no challange there, there is no failstate at all. Time=/=feeling rewarded.

Just making levelling take longer is the exact same as giving current hogger in elywyn forest 600billion hitpoints. It is not one bit harder or more rewarding you still can't die, you still can't lose you just punch him for 2 days and drops the same grey bracers.

Making levelling take longer does not make it mean more.


I think I can explain. I don't know when you started playing wow but this game was never a hack'n'slash with spell casters tacked on the side.

WoW was an mmorpg, much emphasis on the RPG part there.

The slower pacing of the old game was much more akin to how it would feel growing into your boots. They say a skill takes 10,000 hours to master in the real world and for the first 5% of that you're gonna suck so hard you'll be asking what the !@#$'s wrong with yourself.

After that 5% though, you start understanding and comprehending the skill path, you actually gain knowledge and it feels good. It motives you to carry on, a bit like gaining a level. So you keep going and you learn a new technique in your skill and it feels great! So far you've poured maybe 1000 hours in and this is you now. You are your skill and there's no turning back.

Soon people start to rely on you for you service because you're good, useful because you know that skill. A bit like being good at your class but you're still only level 40.

The point here is that the slower pacing lended itself to the very real feeling of achievement. When smething is just handed to you then that euphoric feeling isn't present, and you just feel like it's yet another obstacle to overcome (new spell) when instead it should feel cool to learn a new spell and figure ou how to weave it into your playstyle.

This is why new players feel so overwhelmed when they first join, a lot of them skip the leveling process and now they've got 30 spells to figure out what to do with and they have no idea. So it feels boring reading everything and figuring it out and instead of achieving something good it only ever feels like you're playing catchup just so you can enjoy the game and play with others.

Slower pacing and longer leveling is more to do with emphasising the idea of growing, achieving and role playing. The whole process is very immersive, with each passing day you're getting closer to your end-goal instead of just being given it or feeling like max level is the game. It should be something like 50/50 but instead now it's more like 10/90 and it feels awful.

I also want to mention that during the slower paced leveling process, sometimes it did get monotonous but these are the times when players would just choose to do something else instead like go exploring, role play in goldshire or anywhere, go fishing, level up some profession or simply hang out in trade chat. You chose to do something fun while you took a breather from leveling, just like in real life you might stop working to go hang out with your friends and party. Not to mention the wpvp too, the raids the happened and you were welcome and involved no matter what level you were because it was just fun.


I get what you are saying but you are missing the point not one mob now from 1-120 offers a challenge they are just HP sponges .
If they hit harder and quicker and needed to be cc'ed and interupted like in classic i could understand but now its just slow for slow sake .
Scaling means you never feel stronger
No talents
No spells
Also means you do not feel stronger
Stats and item lvl as you grow dont make you feel stronger
There is no progression like classic/tbc/wotlk

There is no immersion now ,there is no talents or speels to pick up or see trainer its just mind numbing tedium whilst leveling hence people asking for the XP nerf and more choice how to lvl just like prior 7.3.5

wpvp too
didnt happen on all servers and warmode is a joke there is no way to balance the factions at all .

I can not see why people are so hell bent on others having a choice ,it's wrong people come into this thread and demand everyone be slow .
I played classic it was not hard it was time consuming but it had a little challenge in it .
What we have now is a mess and double the levels we need to hit max level .
11/11/2018 04:18Posted by Abacabb

The point here is that the slower pacing lended itself to the very real feeling of achievement.


Maybe for the first and second time, or for the third time if you really want to stretch it. Then? That "very real feeling of achievement" turned into frustration and boredom caused by that same exact slower pacing.


This is why new players feel so overwhelmed when they first join, a lot of them skip the leveling process and now they've got 30 spells to figure out what to do with and they have no idea.


This argument is really getting old. Leveling doesn't teach anything about your spec or class. Actually, the only way to learn about your spec or class is playing it at max level.

I was leveling a Nightborne frost mage for heritage armor until I had to stop at level 60 to not feeling so overwhelmed of the sheer boredom. All I did was spamming frostbolt and occasionally using blizzard when there are 3 or more mobs. How much did that teach me about frost mage rotation? Now, if this was vanilla I would've been fine because vanilla exactly had that single button rotation. But as it is now, it teaches nothing about my class and if I used that single button rotation I'm sure I'd be kicked out of even LFR or M0 dungeons.

11/11/2018 04:18Posted by Abacabb

Slower pacing and longer leveling is more to do with emphasising the idea of growing, achieving and role playing.


11/11/2018 04:18Posted by Abacabb

role play in goldshire


Might be hard for you to believe, but there is much more to RP than what's going on in Goldshire. Way to throw all roleplayers in the same box and put a "goldshire RP lolololol" label on it.

11/11/2018 04:18Posted by Abacabb
just like in real life you might stop working to go hang out with your friends and party


And then you get fired.

11/11/2018 04:18Posted by Abacabb
Not to mention the wpvp too


Better if you don't mention world pvp, I strongly recommend against that in real life. There is no such thing as corpse running, or so I've heard.
09/11/2018 05:13Posted by Tymaar

End of the line is stop giving into demands that break the game and turn it into a zerg fest either for XP gains or making mobs/bosses in low level content useless. Changes to XP in its current state on 8.1 break it dramatically and make the game's levelling design flawed. If the scaling were removed, it'd be a joke.


The game's levelling design isn't flawed because of the exp per level, it has been broken since MoP. Levelling is a slog, it's not rewarding at all. The only thing to enjoy levelling is the story in quests. That said, majority of the playerbase have already played through all the major questlines. So why would I not want to spend less time on going through the same content I've been playing for years, just because I want to try out a new class?

And if you are a new player, who never experienced WoW before, would you really want to spend 60+ hours to level up your alt? Especially considering how unrewarding levelling feels? And Blizz realises that, that's why you are given a 110 boost when you buy BfA.

I think you are stuck thinking, that more time investment = more rewarding playing experience. Sadly, in the current version of WoW it's not. The good news is, you might really enjoy WoW Classic.
09/11/2018 05:13Posted by Tymaar
You know, that poster who constantly posts about everything BAD in the game, but has in reality very little achieved or completed - you don't and won't please this mentality. These are the very SAME player(s) that HATE scaling in outdoor BfA content


I hate the scaling in BfA and I hated it in Legion too.

Come tell me how little of the game I've played.
11/11/2018 04:18Posted by Abacabb
I think I can explain. I don't know when you started playing wow but this game was never a hack'n'slash with spell casters tacked on the side.


Started in classic (gonna try and not use vanilla since ppl get triggered), leveled all classes to 60 even back then, didnt see any problems in it back then, I had characters spread out through realms with 0 slots available in account.

11/11/2018 04:18Posted by Abacabb
The slower pacing of the old game was much more akin to how it would feel growing into your boots


And as said it wasnt hard to learn your class, nor level fast even back then, I raided with all but warrior and priest.

11/11/2018 04:18Posted by Abacabb
The point here is that the slower pacing lended itself to the very real feeling of achievement.


No, it actually did not, I got my feelings of achieving something when we 1st fell Ragnaros, Hakkar and so on, progressing further into raids.

11/11/2018 04:18Posted by Abacabb
This is why new players feel so overwhelmed when they first join, a lot of them skip the leveling process and now they've got 30 spells to figure out


Are you high? Wow is not rocket science never was, new players get overwhelmed because they have sh*t gear, mobs are too hard to kill for them now, and pull more then 1 by accident and your dead.

11/11/2018 04:18Posted by Abacabb
Slower pacing and longer leveling is more to do with emphasising the idea of growing, achieving and role playing.


Ok I have all classes leveled, raided with, I dont do RP ... gimme my pre 7.3.5 leveling speed back.

In all, your post is not even remotely relatable, even in classic my goal was to lvl fast, gear up, get to raiding with my guilds back then, same in every expansion except legion and bfa, where I raided casually only.

Its pointless to say that slower leveling speed is good, its not, what would be good is to allow people to CHOOSE what speed they want to lvl in, and not punishing people who have heirlooms, since the ppl whining about how fast leveling is, do not even take heirlooms off.

Leveling is boring, yet I like making alts, except with this leveling, hope 8.1 makes it work again.

I like having multiple 120s geared and ready to raid or do dungeons, if friends need a warlock I got it, hunter sure, shama... no noone wants shamans now, slowly working on all classes to 120 from 110, but not making new characters, even thou I havent made any alliance allied race except emoelf which I used free boost.

But basicly activision is punishing new and veteran players, and only listening to the cancerous small minority who want to make things slow and agonizing.
Slower leveling doesn't work now. Before, we'd get a talent point to spend every time we dinged. Every single level we had something to look forward to, even if it was just a % increase to damage. Now we have to wait 15 levels for a reward, and after level 100 we get 20 levels of nothing.

Class/game design meant that the world was actually dangerous. You couldn't just leeroy into those groups of trolls in Stranglethorn, you had to pull them carefully or you would die. All of this took time, but when you succeeded it felt good.

Now, nothing really poses a major risk. No strategy required, just AoE as much as possible and watch it all die. It requires no thought at all and therefore is not as rewarding. Increasing the xp required to level just makes this worse, not better.

No. The process of leveling is not rewarding anymore. With the current game design, leveling is a boring slog that needs to be over as soon as possible.
11/11/2018 17:02Posted by Brewny
Slower leveling doesn't work now. Before, we'd get a talent point to spend every time we dinged. Every single level we had something to look forward to, even if it was just a % increase to damage. Now we have to wait 15 levels for a reward, and after level 100 we get 20 levels of nothing.


See this is what i miss a talent /spell /point to use like you say even if it was a 1% increase its something i mean getting 5/5 wands back in classic wasnt exciteing but it was something when u dinged .
Now there is nothing from 100 onwards :(
I disagree though with your point about AOE you just cant it takes far to long the mobs HP is insane yet they do naff all damage .
8.1 fixes levelling XP


Fixed that for ya
Leveling is boring, period.
im glad they're doing this. literally nobody but a tiny minority even wanted the changes. i stopped leveling completely after 7.3.5 only reason i did my lightforged was to easily unlock legion flying, i havent done anything in nearly 3 months. I might finally finish leveling my alts after this fix.

i can only hope they remove the global cooldown nonsense too it literally breaks some classes
09/11/2018 05:13Posted by Tymaar
For the players that had to take so long to level up to unlock their Allied Races' heritage armour, it totally slaps them in the face turning levelling into a ding machine once more, though I am grateful the scaling is being kept in place (Yay!).
As someone who has unlocked 2 of them no i disagree.
The chances of me staying around and leveling up any more races was next to zero, this is a positive.

Do i care that people will now be able to level up the two i already have much easier, no because i can see thats its good for everyone in the end that blizz has listened.
Allied races are already locked behind stupid long rep grinds because world quests are the only way to get rep beyond honored. After nearly burning myself out just unlocking the arguably easier horde allied races in legion. I don't want to go through the absolute misery that is 60-80 leveling. I'm not bothered by the content I did on my main back when WoTLK was current content. I can only level so many characters before its just excruciatingly mind numbing. There is nothing new to explore, there is no new stuff to get there is just one less level until its all over and you start the real, rewarding grind.

Call me what you like, but it needed streamlining especially with the new expansion gimmick being unlockable races.
10/11/2018 16:05Posted by Deathmidget
Why do people find the 60-80 so bad? I recently did it on an alt, Howling Fjord alone gave me 58-65. Took me 2,5 Wotlk zones, 1 dungeon and some candybuckets to get to 80.

But in general, I'm looking forward to an overall increase in leveling speed,because 120 levels are just alot!


i got 3 allied races i gave up on leveling personally and they are all 80 - 90 tbh...i found the 80 - 90 bracket the worse because of the content not the speed. after doing it 11 times in WoD , 10 or so times in legion and 5 times up to the point i stopped in bfa ... i just cant bear the same old content anymore xD faster leveling is good .. but it doesn't fix needing to run the same content to do it.
12/11/2018 00:15Posted by Pixelbear
10/11/2018 16:05Posted by Deathmidget
Why do people find the 60-80 so bad? I recently did it on an alt, Howling Fjord alone gave me 58-65. Took me 2,5 Wotlk zones, 1 dungeon and some candybuckets to get to 80.

But in general, I'm looking forward to an overall increase in leveling speed,because 120 levels are just alot!


i got 3 allied races i gave up on leveling personally and they are all 80 - 90 tbh...i found the 80 - 90 bracket the worse because of the content not the speed. after doing it 11 times in WoD , 10 or so times in legion and 5 times up to the point i stopped in bfa ... i just cant bear the same old content anymore xD faster leveling is good .. but it doesn't fix needing to run the same content to do it.


WoD is easily bypassed by bonus objectives and treasures, otherwise I don't think any allied race would get past 90


Sorry I don't have the high IQ required to read your post.
12/11/2018 01:13Posted by Drekhan
I think about 92-93% of you so called "people" or "players" are mentally impaired or just have lower IQ... Because i don't see any other logical reason why would you to discuss about this nonsense over and over and over again...

Go, get a help. Or at least turn off your pc and go out to real world for a while...


maybe you need to turn off your pc and go out to the real world for a while you seem a little tense :).
10/11/2018 13:04Posted by Mielikkí
Experience is experience, if someone corrects me on something I don't have experience in I'd feel more than happy about it. I don't judge experience by mount or pet collection, I look at achievements over all and see what they've done in comment to see IF they've even played it or possibly being influenced by social media on what to say or think.

If someone has 0 pets, or 70 mounts but yet has good experience I've no issue with it.

I judge by experience and logic, not petty emotions.


You do know right that players in top guilds hide behind low lvl alts and hide there achivements right ? making your whole post moot armoury shaming proves nothing and is a pointless task thats what you dont understand you have no logic at all .


Achievements are account-wide
10/11/2018 03:22Posted by Hosomaki
Not being funny but im a fast leveler always have been and today's leveling ia fast as fk.... i leveled a maghar orc to 85 in 2 days the fastest ive leveld that fast ever and now they make it faster? Wtf lol. Blizzard are just giving in to every complaint these days due to lost subs... someone start a mass complain for free game time mounts and gold.


85 in two days is fast? What? People hit 110 in 10-12 hours... lol

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