Blade dance

Arenas
10/11/2018 15:40Posted by Cewkz
10/11/2018 15:34Posted by Kelduril
...

HoJ into Trap can't be avoided either, your point?

it's almost like hoj into trap takes 2 players


So now we went from ''can't be countered is bad'' to '' can't be countered is ok if... "

Mana burn is 8% every 30 seconds assuming you don't manage to predict the Eruption and jump behind LoS while in midair.
Kelduril, friend.. Can you -shut- the !@#$ up soon?
You clearly have no idea how DH works, your comments on every thread proves that, you're somehow almost negative in 3s, despite DH having multiple Tier 1 comps.
Please, do us all a favour.
S
T
F
U

(Or get better at DH before you start talking)
11/11/2018 00:24Posted by Renie
Kelduril, friend.. Can you -shut- the !@#$ up soon?
You clearly have no idea how DH works, your comments on every thread proves that, you're somehow almost negative in 3s, despite DH having multiple Tier 1 comps.
Please, do us all a favour.
S
T
F
U

(Or get better at DH before you start talking)


More ad hominem.
10/11/2018 16:02Posted by Kelduril
Mana burn is 8% every 30 seconds assuming you don't manage to predict the Eruption and jump behind LoS while in midair.


what?
again with this stupidity

he stuns, then mana rifts
you jump, he stuns you wherever you are, it does not matter at all
you get mana rifted after

even in any of your dream jump scenarios, you'll still get mana rifted

you're so clueless it hurts, what hurts the most is how clueless are you about your own class

10/11/2018 16:02Posted by Kelduril
So now we went from ''can't be countered is bad'' to '' can't be countered is ok if... "

it's much different to get CCed and getting burned mana

1) HoJ+Trap also takes 2 players
2) trap is followed usually 4 seconds after HoJ, plenty of time for your teammates to react, fel eruption is followed like 1.2 seconds after stun, basically zero chance to move in to react for your team
3) you can play in a way (spread, be far away from each other) so enemy can get nothing out of CCing you (lose time travelling from you to your dps) thus rendering their CC useless
but no matter how stupid DH is, without any kind of team synergy, without any kind of thinking he'll always get full value from mana rift, just by pressing two buttons with no counterplay whatsoever

so not only its different situation (CC X Mana), not only it's much harder (to a point thats impossible) to counter but its also much easier to pull off

but main point is that its uncounterable
if only there was any way to jump or move to avoid it... there is not
11/11/2018 02:09Posted by Kelduril
11/11/2018 00:24Posted by Renie
Kelduril, friend.. Can you -shut- the !@#$ up soon?
You clearly have no idea how DH works, your comments on every thread proves that, you're somehow almost negative in 3s, despite DH having multiple Tier 1 comps.
Please, do us all a favour.
S
T
F
U

(Or get better at DH before you start talking)


More ad hominem.
Kelduril, you do realize that your aqusation of people deeming the things you say wrong because they come from you is ad hominem itself? This might upset you but people say this because the things you say ARE wrong and since you are learning resistent they conclude that you have no idea. They don't say they are wrong because YOU say them, they say it, because they simply are literally wrong. So please just stop it. Your tactic of discretizing people here by saying they argument against you with ad hominem is simply not working out.
This forum might be toxic but the people here acknowledge it when someone is right even when this person is generally disliked. There were times when people agreed with Jito or even Whisperer. When someone is right, he is right, no matter the person. You however have not been right lately. I would bet if you post something actually true for the first time people would agree with you.

So yeah, no ad hominem involved whatsoever. You are wrong, because you're wrong, not because it is YOU who said it.
11/11/2018 12:51Posted by Bloodlock
<span class="truncated">...</span>

More ad hominem.
Kelduril, you do realize that your aqusation of people deeming the things you say wrong because they come from you is ad hominem itself? This might upset you but people say this because the things you say ARE wrong and since you are learning resistent they conclude that you have no idea. They don't say they are wrong because YOU say them, they say it, because they simply are literally wrong. So please just stop it. Your tactic of discretizing people here by saying they argument against you with ad hominem is simply not working out.
This forum might be toxic but the people here acknowledge it when someone is right even when this person is generally disliked. There were times when people agreed with Jito or even Whisperer. When someone is right, he is right, no matter the person. You however have not been right lately. I would bet if you post something actually true for the first time people would agree with you.

So yeah, no ad hominem involved whatsoever. You are wrong, because you're wrong, not because it is YOU who said it.


Being right is sadly not a matter of popularity.

they conclude that you have no idea.


You don't get to complain about a mechanic not having a counter and then, when someone points out other mechanics that have no counter, backpedal and say those are okay.
12/11/2018 18:17Posted by Kelduril
Being right is sadly not a matter of popularity.

Sure, but it's matter of actually being right, which unfortunately is not your case either.

You remember how you think Adaptation is great against Fel Eruption?

So you may think you are being abused by majority, but the fact is, you simply are very very wrong. It was proven. Facts were shown and what you keep suggesting is simply showing that you don't understand even DH abilities.

12/11/2018 18:17Posted by Kelduril
You don't get to complain about a mechanic not having a counter and then, when someone points out other mechanics that have no counter, backpedal and say those are okay.

We pointed out Mana burning mechanic with no counterplay. You didn't point out other Mana burning mechanic with no counterplay.
So yes, we do.
Also HoJ+Trap is counterable much easier than Fel Eruption + Mana Rift, but then again, even if it was as stupidly uncounterable as mana rift, it'd still not be mana burning mechanic.
It was proven.


Nah, it wasn't. You just keep using tournament data which is irrelevant to live. I can't even Eye Beam while jumping on Live because there's a small chance I get DCed.

The statistics are still there. The game is not and should not be balanced for the top 0.001%, that's how you get a dead game with no players.

We pointed out Mana burning mechanic with no counterplay.


It's mana burning with a cooldown and a DR attached. It's not going away. WOTLK had mana burn in it ( it didn't require set up or had a cd ) and it was far more balanced than BfA. Mana burn isn't the issue.

Hell, from what I'm watching Trill wasn't even using it in the finals.
12/11/2018 23:09Posted by Kelduril
You just keep using tournament data which is irrelevant to live.

Not only that.
I was also using wowhead data to prove how stupid is it to take Adaptation for Fel Eruption, when Adaptation trinkets anything lasting 5+ seconds and Fel Eruption lasts 4 seconds.
That was proof enough you're wrong and you don't know how DH work.

12/11/2018 23:09Posted by Kelduril
It's mana burning with a cooldown

not an argument

12/11/2018 23:09Posted by Kelduril
OTLK had mana burn in it ( it didn't require set up or had a cd ) and it was far more balanced than BfA


1) this is BFA, not WOTLK
2) Mana Burn was interruptable, thus it had counterplay mechanic

12/11/2018 23:09Posted by Kelduril
Hell, from what I'm watching Trill wasn't even using it in the finals.

yep, they went full crazy broken mode when they popped all cooldowns and were able to win like that just because DH's burst and Boomkin's burst is that crazy
but then again

12/11/2018 23:09Posted by Kelduril
You just keep using tournament data which is irrelevant to live.


12/11/2018 23:09Posted by Kelduril
The statistics are still there. The game is not and should not be balanced for the top 0.001%, that's how you get a dead game with no players.


I am far from top 0.1% and still have huge issues with mana burning DH. There is nothing you can do against it, your mana gets burned whether you want or not and whether you play perfectly or not.

Also demanding stupid things for your class to be even more broken just because you are incapable of pressing mana burn is really bad sollution.
Game should be balanced around decent players at least.
Not noobs like you who suggest to take Adaptation to stop Fel Eruption, when having simple reading skill would already tell you how stupid that is.
just because DH's burst and Boomkin's burst is that crazy
but then again


Can you name me what part of the DH arsenal has crazy burst? Because I'm pretty sure Trill's Chaos Strikes hit for like 15K so I'm really curious where that burst comes from.

2) Mana Burn was interruptable, thus it had counterplay mechanic


DH can mana burn reliably every 30 seconds so maybe stun the DH when he stuns your healer?

:thinking:

Also demanding stupid things for your class to be even more broken just because you are incapable of pressing mana burn is really bad sollution.


Mana rift isn't anywhere near as strong as you think. Trill didn't use it in a game that went to 30% dampening, it's pretty clear it's sub par.

Not noobs like you who suggest to take Adaptation to stop Fel Eruption


Let it go, woman. It's been 1 month. I'm a better player than you are anyway.
12/11/2018 23:09Posted by Kelduril
It was proven.


Nah, it wasn't. You just keep using tournament data which is irrelevant to live. I can't even Eye Beam while jumping on Live because there's a small chance I get DCed.

The statistics are still there. The game is not and should not be balanced for the top 0.001%, that's how you get a dead game with no players.

We pointed out Mana burning mechanic with no counterplay.


It's mana burning with a cooldown and a DR attached. It's not going away. WOTLK had mana burn in it ( it didn't require set up or had a cd ) and it was far more balanced than BfA. Mana burn isn't the issue.

Hell, from what I'm watching Trill wasn't even using it in the finals.

You can’t compare spells from different expansion

Wotlk mana burn: requires cast, deals little damage

Bfa mana burn: instant

In wotlk arenas mana burning to death was not even close to easy unless this specific match up: disc+frost mage vs war+hpala and even here wasn’t easy. Let’s analize

Against warrior u risk to die just by casting 1 single mana burn. If he used overpower on your cast u got 6 !@#$ing second of 75% healing reduction and usually a war could kill a disc in 3 spells

Against a dk u can just be smashed or interrupted in many ways, or he can just dpsing your partner, he would probably be dead before you complete a mana burn cast. Yes this was dk damage in wotlk

Against feral just give up, you will never cast

Against any double caster comp if u try to even exit from pillar they will destroy you in a single cast

You don’t know wotlk, you have no idea of how fast and how punishing was that expansion. You coudn’t tank people easily like now and no dampening. Any dps was able to kill anybody without any healing reduction. Try to cast a mana burn and enjoy watching you or your partner die in just 1 second
13/11/2018 12:59Posted by Laksi
Against warrior u risk to die just by casting 1 single mana burn. If he used overpower on your cast u got 6 !@#$ing second of 75% healing reduction and usually a war could kill a disc in 3 spells


Considering Disco ran with Mage or Rogue back then that should not be an issue.

Also you're not casting Mana Burn when the enemy DPS is on you, you're casting it while your own DPS puts pressure. It's no different from Disco spamming smite in current, it was a spell you used when you had the upper hand. And with a Frostmage/Rogue's control that wasn't much of an issue in 3.3.5.

The deal was that every healer hit like a wet noodle in 3.3.5, so having mana burn was huge because it allowed you to play offensively, something no other healer could really do.

In wotlk arenas mana burning to death was not even close to easy


Redactedmane's top 100 is full of Priests so I'm gonna press X for doubt.

Considering how bonkers Frost Mage was in 3.3.5 you definitely can pull it off.

Any dps was able to kill anybody without any healing reduction


At high level, with 1400 resil? Fat chance.
13/11/2018 12:59Posted by Laksi
Against warrior u risk to die just by casting 1 single mana burn. If he used overpower on your cast u got 6 !@#$ing second of 75% healing reduction and usually a war could kill a disc in 3 spells


Considering Disco ran with Mage or Rogue back then that should not be an issue.

Also you're not casting Mana Burn when the enemy DPS is on you, you're casting it while your own DPS puts pressure. It's no different from Disco spamming smite in current, it was a spell you used when you had the upper hand. And with a Frostmage/Rogue's control that wasn't much of an issue in 3.3.5.

The deal was that every healer hit like a wet noodle in 3.3.5, so having mana burn was huge because it allowed you to play offensively, something no other healer could really do.

In wotlk arenas mana burning to death was not even close to easy


Redactedmane's top 100 is full of Priests so I'm gonna press X for doubt.

Considering how bonkers Frost Mage was in 3.3.5 you definitely can pull it off.

Any dps was able to kill anybody without any healing reduction


At high level, with 1400 resil? Fat chance.


Dude, literally please stop talking and posting everywhere. DHs ARE OVERPOWERED right now and its a fact. Just stop.
...

Considering Disco ran with Mage or Rogue back then that should not be an issue.

Also you're not casting Mana Burn when the enemy DPS is on you, you're casting it while your own DPS puts pressure. It's no different from Disco spamming smite in current, it was a spell you used when you had the upper hand. And with a Frostmage/Rogue's control that wasn't much of an issue in 3.3.5.

The deal was that every healer hit like a wet noodle in 3.3.5, so having mana burn was huge because it allowed you to play offensively, something no other healer could really do.

...

Redactedmane's top 100 is full of Priests so I'm gonna press X for doubt.

Considering how bonkers Frost Mage was in 3.3.5 you definitely can pull it off.

...

At high level, with 1400 resil? Fat chance.


Dude, literally please stop talking and posting everywhere. DHs ARE OVERPOWERED right now and its a fact. Just stop.


Don't tell me what to do.
10/11/2018 13:41Posted by Kelduril
And no, it's not about what's strong, it's about countering. They already know who they're facing and what classes those people are good at. It's not the same as ladder at all.


By this logic DH is broken, because tournament is about countering and Method Orange played DH every game and won Blizzcon.
Thus DH counters everything.
More obnoxious is when they accidentally completely immune your cc by using meta leap (sometimes it's deliberate but 99% isn't)
06/11/2018 17:19Posted by Gorewolf
DH gets significant DMG nerfs in 8.1 and maximally needs another Revolving Blades adjustment, yet people here want to take its defensives and utility aswell?

People here cry about literally the only viable to play DH which is with Demonic + Blade Dance Spec.

Momentum is meh at best and Dark Slash is hot piled garbage.

Fel Barrage is maximally good against a triple stacked melee cleave team.

Rest of the people dont even deserve answers because they even list up false stuff cuz they dont even have basic knowledge of the Game like the Paladin above me.

But, go on, nerf and prune everything and wonder next Expac why the Game is even duller and dumber once again.

Smh, no wonder what happened with this Game.


Admitting defeat in an argument I see. Good. Because you lost.

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