ARMS WARRIOR SUCK(PvP)

General
Arms Warriors suck in PvP unless they have a healbot, change my mind.
The class needs quality of life improvements, more self sustain and a baseline stun.
My other more detailed post on what Arms and Fury needs.
https://eu.battle.net/forums/en/wow/topic/17624623698
If you think arms sucks now, wait til you try it in 8.1, nerfed. Right now we're pretty insane aoe/cleave, but 8.1 we'll be poor so go with fury, it's just the way it goes.

Also wrong section, post in warrior one.
13/11/2018 12:19Posted by Skyrha
insane aoe/cleave,


No you don't have Cleave as it's a talent no1 specs in to ;) ba dum tss

And outside Warbreaker Bladestorm you can use Sweeping Strikes to cleave 1 additional target. In duels, you rarely face 1+ target ;).

Basicly, every other class does the same job, better.
13/11/2018 12:27Posted by Cactusjackts
13/11/2018 12:19Posted by Skyrha
insane aoe/cleave,


No you don't have Cleave as it's a talent no1 specs in to ;) ba dum tss

And outside Warbreaker Bladestorm you can use Sweeping Strikes to cleave 1 additional target. In duels, you rarely face 1+ target ;).

Basicly, every other class does the same job, better.


Wrong, sweeping strikes alone is really powerful, especially during execute phase where you hit 2 targets for 10-25k each. Warbreaker has insane damage, but in 8.1 damage will get cut in half. So yeah, if you think it's bad, don't stick with it, it won't get any better than this, go fury or some other class.
Idk what you're smoking, arms is one of the strongest classes in PvE right now
13/11/2018 12:32Posted by Skyrha
10-25k

We can talk numbers all day and how hard they hit. Point is, their quality of life, self sustain and utility = 0.

13/11/2018 12:35Posted by Lockhero
Idk what you're smoking, arms is one of the strongest classes in PvE right now

What I wrote to the other guy^
13/11/2018 12:57Posted by Cactusjackts
13/11/2018 12:32Posted by Skyrha
10-25k

We can talk numbers all day and how hard they hit. Point is, their quality of life, self sustain and utility = 0.

13/11/2018 12:35Posted by Lockhero
Idk what you're smoking, arms is one of the strongest classes in PvE right now

What I wrote to the other guy^


You said they suck in PVE, we showed you why they don't suck in PVE.
PvP is whole new story.
Uldir has been good to Arms. PvE-wise we're in a good place right now.

Uldir is about to become old content though, and the spec is seeing some considerable nerfs in 8.1 - so basically yes, unless you're playing at a casual level, Fury might be the better option in a month.
Also utility, isn't greatest that's correct but you still got battle shout buff, rallying cry helpful many times, fair enough defensives, great mobility, stun, aoe fear, kick... You can put in use all of that in M+ especially. Regarding the dps i can't see any problem decent single, great and effective aoe either to huge packs aswell as to 2 targets. Also pretty strong DoT effect on fights with a lot of downtime.
13/11/2018 13:14Posted by Skyrha
13/11/2018 12:57Posted by Cactusjackts
...
We can talk numbers all day and how hard they hit. Point is, their quality of life, self sustain and utility = 0.

...
What I wrote to the other guy^


You said they suck in PVE, we showed you why they don't suck in PVE.
PvP is whole new story.


You would still pick a rogue over a warrior in m+ any day :)
13/11/2018 13:22Posted by Hegynooh
Also utility, isn't greatest that's correct but you still got battle shout buff, rallying cry helpful many times, fair enough defensives, great mobility, stun, aoe fear, kick... You can put in use all of that in M+ especially. Regarding the dps i can't see any problem decent single, great and effective aoe either to huge packs aswell as to 2 targets. Also pretty strong DoT effect on fights with a lot of downtime.


The stun should be baseline and an aoe stun as many other specs have are more usefull than a fear.
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/19/#

Yeah arms warriors suck... 2nd highest damage class....

We should be first!

Utility wise we have fear, high mobility, health raid cooldown, huge cleave/aoe potential. Also if you look at the arms discord all changes got reverted apart from execute rage refund.

EVERYTHING IS SUBJECT TO CHANGE

The Warbreaker and Bladestorm nerfs that were on the last PTR build right before blizzcon were reverted. However the Execute Rage refund nerf (From 30% -> 20%) has not been reverted.

Executioner's Precision has also seem to have been replaced by the new 8.1 trait "Striking the Anvil" (Linked below). As it stands in the 8.1 PTR, there are no EP traits on any Azerite Slots.

EVERYTHING IS SUBJECT TO CHANGE
https://www.wowhead.com/news=288473/patch-8-1-ptr-build-28366-spell-azerite-and-class-updates
https://ptr.wowhead.com/spell=288455/striking-the-anvil
13/11/2018 13:36Posted by Cactusjackts
<span class="truncated">...</span>

You said they suck in PVE, we showed you why they don't suck in PVE.
PvP is whole new story.


You would still pick a rogue over a warrior in m+ any day :)


Rogue is the best dps in M+, you won't pick anything over rogue for melee
Who needs stuns when everything dies before it gets to do anything
13/11/2018 13:38Posted by Cactusjackts
13/11/2018 13:22Posted by Hegynooh
Also utility, isn't greatest that's correct but you still got battle shout buff, rallying cry helpful many times, fair enough defensives, great mobility, stun, aoe fear, kick... You can put in use all of that in M+ especially. Regarding the dps i can't see any problem decent single, great and effective aoe either to huge packs aswell as to 2 targets. Also pretty strong DoT effect on fights with a lot of downtime.


The stun should be baseline and an aoe stun as many other specs have are more usefull than a fear.


Which many other specs have aoe stun? Only DH,WL and Shaman comming to my mind (and prot war). And why would be stun even a baseline?
13/11/2018 13:36Posted by Cactusjackts
You would still pick a rogue over a warrior in m+ any day :)


I used to main rogue (still playing it but not as main) and I agree, it's a very strong class. But comparing both from a technical/utility perspective and then talking about people's subjective preferences makes no sense at all.
arms is strong atm ..

but in the words of that redpill guy on youtube

no king rules forever.

unless its disc priest
So basically it boils down to the way he plays his arms warrior that makes it seem a bit pants?
Arms was always the almost non existent self sustain and not that good without a lot of preparation/skill in pvp, you could insta gib people, take reduced amount of damage and outplay your opponent extremely well, it's just now most classes have self heals while warriors lost theirs but with a healer you are still a powerhouse.

As for pve, they are good for raids infact way too good.

But for M+... it's just sad and pathetic, most mobs are immune to fear, your stun isn't exactly helpful because usually everyone else has stuns, you can sacrifice damage for reduced damage taken, but others don't sacrifice damage and get natural self heals, you have 0 niche besides Taunting boss ( which alot of classes can do ), and huge aoe ( which other classes beat you in ).

And the biggest problem of them all, alot of the time you have no control over your fate which sucks hard, specially if the healer is pressed and can't spare you a heal or two, or if they are just plain bad, then R.I.P you. while on my rogue I can effectively keep myself up from a Tyrannical +10 TD last boss natural aoe damage without any heals from other sources for a very good amount of time, while my warrior will probably die in 10-15 seconds.

I feel like if arms warriors got the legendary bracers from legion baked in baseline, and some knockdown ability with 30 sec cooldown it would make us viable and feel good in M+.
Another clown who can't even play a fotm spec...

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