Void Elf RP - Are we doing it wrong?

Argent Dawn
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08/11/2018 11:29Posted by Hlaren
08/11/2018 10:24Posted by Thurillion
Not saying people can't or shouldn't. Just refuting those who say that it is the norm or that they SHOULD be some unstable dangerous crazy insane by default based on the island expedition people.

I understand, this is more so comments on the title of "Are we doing it wrong". If it was the norm then imagine how detrimental it is to the Alliance.


Thing is that is literally the viewpoint of some I encounter here on these forums and ingame, mostly sin'dorei roleplayers with a chip on their shoulder against void elves, the ones I've encountered anyway. They seem to think based on pretty much nothing that it is a matter of time that rommath is proven right and that the void elves will destroy the alliance or some bullcrap.
08/11/2018 16:29Posted by Thurillion
They seem to think based on pretty much nothing that it is a matter of time that rommath is proven right and that the void elves will destroy the alliance or some bullcrap.


It is not based on nothing though, Rommath was proven right about the void in the events at the Sunwell within the Nightborne recruitment scenario. I've not seen mentions about destroying the Alliance, which by itself is impossible mechanically wise because they are an allied race and because of plot-armour and worfing as they are a new faction that has to be established in the lore.

What I see being said, though and part of which I think as well is how easily the void addled elves have been embraced by other faction. No suspicion, drawbacks, etc. Welcome to the 7th Legion former exiles/traitors! Just a very mixed bag of odd-lore.
08/11/2018 16:52Posted by Garathil
What I see being said, though and part of which I think as well is how easily the void addled elves have been embraced by other faction. No suspicion, drawbacks, etc. Welcome to the 7th Legion former exiles/traitors! Just a very mixed bag of odd-lore.


It's worthwhile mentioning every so often you see blood/high elves slip up, for example the high elves in the EPL lodge turning wretched and losing themselves after discovering some artifact. And more recently in Warlords of Draenor we saw a blood elven woman go power mad after some upset.
08/11/2018 16:52Posted by Garathil
It is not based on nothing though, Rommath was proven right about the void in the events at the Sunwell within the Nightborne recruitment scenario. I've not seen mentions about destroying the Alliance, which by itself is impossible mechanically wise because they are an allied race and because of plot-armour and worfing as they are a new faction that has to be established in the lore.

What I see being said, though and part of which I think as well is how easily the void addled elves have been embraced by other faction. No suspicion, drawbacks, etc. Welcome to the 7th Legion former exiles/traitors! Just a very mixed bag of odd-lore.


I can agree with you, but seriously, this ship has sailed the day the Forsaken joined the Horde... With encouragement and support from the Tauren high-druid.

My first character was a Forsaken, back in 2004, and suspicion, drawbacks... Were never a thing until Garrosh.

I would add that unlike the Forsaken, Velves didn't ask for anything, the Alliance came spontaneously looking for them, as with all allied races.
08/11/2018 16:52Posted by Garathil
08/11/2018 16:29Posted by Thurillion
They seem to think based on pretty much nothing that it is a matter of time that rommath is proven right and that the void elves will destroy the alliance or some bullcrap.


It is not based on nothing though, Rommath was proven right about the void in the events at the Sunwell within the Nightborne recruitment scenario. I've not seen mentions about destroying the Alliance, which by itself is impossible mechanically wise because they are an allied race and because of plot-armour and worfing as they are a new faction that has to be established in the lore.

What I see being said, though and part of which I think as well is how easily the void addled elves have been embraced by other faction. No suspicion, drawbacks, etc. Welcome to the 7th Legion former exiles/traitors! Just a very mixed bag of odd-lore.


Except that it was Nether-Prince Durzaan who had been watching alleria and decided to strike the moment she went near the sunwell. Who follows her even after that to attack umbric and his group.

It literally took the person who probably has the most void energy inside them on azeroth (barring old gods and their crap) to physically be right in front of the damn sunwell, like literally touching it for it to react to her, for him to be able to use her as a conduit to spawn all his void crap in his attempt to take it over.

Also don't forget alleria was fine up until she actually touched it, as in she travelled to Quel'thalas, she waited, walked, talked with no incident. And later on even using void rifts to get around the ghostlands.

So tell me with that in mind, where is the proof that the mere proximity is a threat? Unless the ren'dorei intend to bathe in the sunwell physically or dance around in it. Also consider you have still technically have Shadow priests, demon hunters that use void in some of their abilities, warlocks and forsaken walking around in Quel'thalas. Oh and we we don't know how long umbric and his lot were in ghostlands for, but surely they practiced void magic and did little harm. Mechanically impossible for them to be in Quel'thalas if this was true.

So yeah... Where is he proven right again except when a powerful nether prince decides to spring his trap from the moment one of the most powerful void users in alleria gets right in front of the sunwell, close enough to touch it?

I would agree IF we see another example that happens in say Quel'thalas or silvermoon away from the sunwell. I'm just not convinced that void is an issue outside of being right in front of the sunwell itself.

In regards to the idea that it should destroy the alliance or send them crazy that they will turn on them. Trust me I've seen quite a few make that argument.
One time is enough of a risk to be honest, you forget that losing the Sunwell (again) will likely spell doom for the vast majority of h/belves and once again all the elderly and young will die. I don't blame Rommath/Lor'themar for their choice.

08/11/2018 23:51Posted by Thurillion
Also don't forget alleria was fine up until she actually touched it


She didn't actually touch it btw, it was just sheer proximity.
09/11/2018 02:40Posted by Aerilen
One time is enough of a risk to be honest, you forget that losing the Sunwell (again) will likely spell doom for the vast majority of h/belves and once again all the elderly and young will die. I don't blame Rommath/Lor'themar for their choice.

08/11/2018 23:51Posted by Thurillion
Also don't forget alleria was fine up until she actually touched it


She didn't actually touch it btw, it was just sheer proximity.


She literally walks right up to it, like smack bang in front of the thing, kneels down and is then sent flying back by it. She's as close to it as possible without perhaps physically getting in the damn thing xD

It only proves him right on the basis of being there, present at the sunwell to have an effect. And even then if the nether prince wasn't watching would there have been that void incursion? Or would she just have had a dodgy reaction? I mean it's obvious one deep in the void such as alleria would react with it once physically in front of the sunwell xD. So, hey if all the void elves plan to go to the plateau and throw a party there then sure its under threat.

However it still doesn't prove him right when you consider void use and Quel'thalas at large though, unless there are examples of this? The day void stuff is summoned in Quel'thalas at large then sure he is right, until then I give void elves the benefit of the doubt.

I honestly just disagree using what happened at the sunwell as an example, as it was an extreme case due to certain circumstances. The amount of void users and usage in and around Quel'thalas should have screwed up the sunwell long ago if rommath was right.

It's more or less a reason blizzard invented out of nowhere to have exiles from silvermoon, which screws anyone who rped a blood elf shadow priest or warlock who uses the void really.
Yeah Alleria, who is powerful but supposedly had "control" had to be in close proximity.

As opposed to Umbric and co. who were cavemen playing with nuclear weapons and almost got themselves turned into void monstrosities. What would that have looked like if it happened in Silvermoon? If Alleria hadn't been there?

Rommath was right.
09/11/2018 10:29Posted by Elenthas
Yeah Alleria, who is powerful but supposedly had "control" had to be in close proximity.

As opposed to Umbric and co. who were cavemen playing with nuclear weapons and almost got themselves turned into void monstrosities. What would that have looked like if it happened in Silvermoon? If Alleria hadn't been there?

Rommath was right.


Does absolutely nothing to prove Rommath right, unless you can provide an example of this? Otherwise you are just working off pure speculation there and the presumption that him being in Silvermoon would be catastrophic due to him not being as refined as Alleria.

I mean what is it? Is it proximity and void being inside of them, or is it you think he will just open up a load of rifts and affect the sunwell that way? Because again, nothing shows that being a void user in Silvermoon affects the sunwell. We only have proof that being right literally in front of it does anything.

And again, they didn't nearly turn themselves into void monstrosities, the same entity that followed Alleria to the sunwell, was the one that followed her to Telogrus and tried to subjugate Umbric and his followers. The nether prince was the one that turned them into what they are, not themselves. They had little to no idea he would just pop up, as much as Rommath, Lor'themar and Alleria had no idea he would appear from behind the scenes back at the sunwell.

Not to mention Umbric was slumming it out in ghostlands for who knows how long practicing the void with his followers, on pretty much Silvermoon's doorstep.
09/11/2018 13:29Posted by Thurillion
They had little to no idea he would just pop up, as much as Rommath, Lor'themar and Alleria had no idea he would appear from behind the scenes back at the sunwell.


Exactly, they had no idea. They were messing with a magic void cube which they didn't understand which opened the path for the servants of the void to show up.

Umbric and co. were dangerous because they were experimenting with this exceedingly corruptive magic without any sort of guidance and those experiments could've unleashed chaos on Silvermoon, which could eaisly have spread to the Sunwell.

The void's danger to the Sunwell was established with Alleria. Umbric's danger to Silvermoon was established with the cube.

Rommath was right.
I don't think that's unreasonable to say that Rommath was at least justified, In saying 'No, we don't want you to research the powers of the Void'. It was reckless, and without Alleria's intervention, it would have turned bad.

I don't think Ren'dorei would be a threat NOW, not any more than your average warlock or Forsaken Shadow Priest. Alleria is the only one with an actual dark naaru inside her.

But that's easy to say NOW.
09/11/2018 13:53Posted by Elenthas
09/11/2018 13:29Posted by Thurillion
They had little to no idea he would just pop up, as much as Rommath, Lor'themar and Alleria had no idea he would appear from behind the scenes back at the sunwell.


Exactly, they had no idea. They were messing with a magic void cube which they didn't understand which opened the path for the servants of the void to show up.

Umbric and co. were dangerous because they were experimenting with this exceedingly corruptive magic without any sort of guidance and those experiments could've unleashed chaos on Silvermoon, which could eaisly have spread to the Sunwell.

The void's danger to the Sunwell was established with Alleria. Umbric's danger to Silvermoon was established with the cube.

Rommath was right.


Except... they were messing with a void cube out in the middle of nowhere, where its effects posed little effect to Silvermoon. It's not like they brought it back to Silvermoon or the Sunwell and began to study it there...

And again you say established. But all we know so far is that the void is a danger to the sunwell when someone who is infused with it stands literally right in front of it. Again there are no sources, no examples of it ever being a threat in the city itself. So no, I do not think Rommath was right, and to say that Umbric would just unleash void terrors on the city would be pure speculation. It is entirely possible sure, but also possible that under supervision if they were allowed to, they could have come up with some useful results in their study. Also speculation.

I mean it is speculated or suggested that umbric and his followers have spent their time since the sunwell was restored (end of tbc onwards) studying void. So why is it they didn't cause problems in that time if true?

I am not denying it isn't a danger at all. The void is a danger to the sunwell, in that he is not wrong. But the only example we have seen is a VERY close proximity interaction with it. But we do not know yet how much of a danger except from the Alleria example, and I repeat it wasn't exactly a normal case.
09/11/2018 14:45Posted by Thurillion
Except... they were messing with a void cube out in the middle of nowhere, where its effects posed little effect to Silvermoon. It's not like they brought it back to Silvermoon or the Sunwell and began to study it there...


Almost like they'd been exiled and weren't allowed in Silvermoon. D'you think they'd be sat in the dank, undead-infested woods instead of the great spires of the Sun-Kissed City given the opportunity?
09/11/2018 14:59Posted by Elenthas
09/11/2018 14:45Posted by Thurillion
Except... they were messing with a void cube out in the middle of nowhere, where its effects posed little effect to Silvermoon. It's not like they brought it back to Silvermoon or the Sunwell and began to study it there...


Almost like they'd been exiled and weren't allowed in Silvermoon. D'you think they'd be sat in the dank, undead-infested woods instead of the great spires of the Sun-Kissed City given the opportunity?


You used it as an example of how they posed a threat. I just pointed out how it's not really an example of incompetence or a threat since it was contained and isolated and they had no idea that a random nether prince would follow Alleria and try to enslave them.

And no, I doubt they'd even know of the cubes existence if they were supervised. And I doubt they'd be allowed to bring it back, nor would they. I mean you could argue they could have taken it out of telogrus to the ghostlands but they didn't.
I would add something by the way.

Assuming that VElves are, dangerous for the Sunwell, that's a pretty good reason to have them in the Alliance. It's a nice weapon of dissuasion!
Guys. Isn't this ooc arguing whether the Velves really is a threat to the Sunwell the whole point with the race getting exiled in the first place? Rommath and his followers thought so, Umbric and his followers didn't, and they will stick with their oppinions and see proofs where they can find them, isn't there supposed to be this conflict?
09/11/2018 23:47Posted by Ashekiran
I would add something by the way.

Assuming that VElves are, dangerous for the Sunwell, that's a pretty good reason to have them in the Alliance. It's a nice weapon of dissuasion!


This would also affect the High Elves as well as convert the Sunwell into whatever the void has intended for it. You'd be pretty much chopping your feet off because you managed to stub your toe.

10/11/2018 00:31Posted by Doltri
Guys. Isn't this ooc arguing whether the Velves really is a threat to the Sunwell the whole point with the race getting exiled in the first place? Rommath and his followers thought so, Umbric and his followers didn't, and they will stick with their oppinions and see proofs where they can find them, isn't there supposed to be this conflict?


The conflict in itself is a little ridiculous IMO; you have this story in TBC where the Blood elves descend into a bloody civil war because their monarch taps into a power of ill repute in the search of power to better his people.

And then years down the line you have a race dragged out of Blizzard's !@#$ which pretty much rails against all of that actual progression and then some; arguably the Void is worse than fel magic and demonology, hell, its why the Burning Crusade existed at the very root of its cause.

It's trite and pretty much a cut and chopped mesh of key High/Blood elf plot points to gift the Alliance deus ex machina.

They have a nice dark elf aesthetic, but beyond that? They're badly written in and unnecessary, IMO.
10/11/2018 00:31Posted by Aerilen

They have a nice dark elf aesthetic, but beyond that? They're badly written in and unnecessary, IMO.


Dark elves are grayish and ashen, not purple and blue. I wish there was something with that aesthetic, but alas. Nothing even close.
[quote="176235179932"]
They have a nice dark elf aesthetic, but beyond that? They're badly written in and unnecessary, IMO.


I was speaking more in terms of their armour design, not so much the colour scheme.
I'm still gonna disagree on that, but more on topic, I see no reason at all to say that it was even remotely illogical for the sin'dorei to shun and exile the void boys. Even if nothing might've happened, I'm pretty sure there's been plenty, plenty of warnings of 'hey, you, stop doing that void thing'.

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