This is why Titanforging is ruining the game.

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24/10/2018 01:24Posted by Marinkonk
https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/230064214218244097/504446185596125185/unknown.png

Guy went in mythic 0 as a 260 ilvl and got this.How is this even possible?Whats the point of hardcore raiding if you can get 380 gear from m0 dungeons.


Isn't this just the definition of what the R in "RNG" means?

Just because someone else got lucky with a drop, doesn't mean the game is rubbish because it didn't happen to you as well.
26/10/2018 14:30Posted by Baelrion
24/10/2018 01:24Posted by Marinkonk
https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/230064214218244097/504446185596125185/unknown.png

Guy went in mythic 0 as a 260 ilvl and got this.How is this even possible?Whats the point of hardcore raiding if you can get 380 gear from m0 dungeons.


Isn't this just the definition of what the R in "RNG" means?

Just because someone else got lucky with a drop, doesn't mean the game is rubbish because it didn't happen to you as well.


The game isn't rubbish because it didn't happen to me.

The game is rubbish because it did happen to someone.
24/10/2018 15:18Posted by Shortbolts

But it SHOULD be exactly this. If someone puts in more effort, then they should be given the better rewards. I get that Most high end M+ runners and HC/Mythic raiders have the higher ilvl, but when you see someone who has put no effort in compared to you getting the same/better rewards, it devalues the work you put in.


I'm getting SO tired of seeing this kind of reply.
NO IT DOESN'T DEVALUE IT AT ALL!

If you have achieved something and feel proud of that, NOTHING ANYONE DOES can take that away from you.

If YOU feel it devalues it, that's YOUR PROBLEM. It only exists in your insecure, low-self-esteem mind.
I can't wait for the Blizzard survey to put once and for all the question "Do the players like Titanforging?" to rest.
Dont bother OP, the points goes right through their head.
i dont personally think its titanforging directly, but i think its more item level is the problem... I made a forum post outlining why I think this and stuff.

But basically, it should be about stats and rotation, not another number on gear...
24/10/2018 01:39Posted by Tymaar
The odds are extremely small though

They're not really.
26/10/2018 14:59Posted by Rezista
I can't wait for the Blizzard survey to put once and for all the question "Do the players like Titanforging?" to rest.


And what do you think the majority will answer?
26/10/2018 15:15Posted by Leandros
26/10/2018 14:59Posted by Rezista
I can't wait for the Blizzard survey to put once and for all the question "Do the players like Titanforging?" to rest.


And what do you think the majority will answer?


I think the majority will answer in favor of removing Titanforge. But I'd accept if they don't and it really turns out that the silent players are enjoyting the feature. I certainly hate it and think it is the core reason why we have broken game balance.
26/10/2018 14:51Posted by Tahra
I'm getting SO tired of seeing this kind of reply.
NO IT DOESN'T DEVALUE IT AT ALL!

If you have achieved something and feel proud of that, NOTHING ANYONE DOES can take that away from you.

If YOU feel it devalues it, that's YOUR PROBLEM. It only exists in your insecure, low-self-esteem mind.


And I'm tired of people who have barely done ANYTHING to understand this. You hate Mythics and don't do them, you also have only done 3 bosses on Normal, yet you are only 5 item levels behind me, and you're above me on my DH who is 5/8 normal, done a few M+'s and cleared most Mythics, and she's at 352 ilvl. I've done all Mythics, fully cleared normal and done 1/2 of Heroic. Plus done M+5's most weeks.

The AMOUNT of work I've put into this game compared to you is huge, yet the ilvl difference between us is tiny. I don't see that as an accomplishment, I see that as moronic. You've barely done the content, yet you're on par with me when it comes to gear. Does that SERIOUSLY seem fair to you?
26/10/2018 15:21Posted by Shortbolts
26/10/2018 14:51Posted by Tahra
I'm getting SO tired of seeing this kind of reply.
NO IT DOESN'T DEVALUE IT AT ALL!

If you have achieved something and feel proud of that, NOTHING ANYONE DOES can take that away from you.

If YOU feel it devalues it, that's YOUR PROBLEM. It only exists in your insecure, low-self-esteem mind.


And I'm tired of people who have barely done ANYTHING to understand this. You hate Mythics and don't do them, you also have only done 3 bosses on Normal, yet you are only 5 item levels behind me, and you're above me on my DH who is 5/8 normal, done a few M+'s and cleared most Mythics, and she's at 352 ilvl. I've done all Mythics, fully cleared normal and done 1/2 of Heroic. Plus done M+5's most weeks.

The AMOUNT of work I've put into this game compared to you is huge, yet the ilvl difference between us is tiny. I don't see that as an accomplishment, I see that as moronic. You've barely done the content, yet you're on par with me when it comes to gear. Does that SERIOUSLY seem fair to you?
No offense but it seems you don't run high enough m+ to improve your ilvl. If you can get up to 9s or 10s your ilvl will increase rather rapidly. While also doing Heroic Uldir ofc, aswell as Warfronts etc.
26/10/2018 15:20Posted by Rezista
26/10/2018 15:15Posted by Leandros
...

And what do you think the majority will answer?


I think the majority will answer in favor of removing Titanforge. But I'd accept if they don't and it really turns out that the silent players are enjoyting the feature. I certainly hate it and think it is the core reason why we have broken game balance.


Hum, the real question being: "do you want to remove a chance to receive a (very) good loot without too much effort", not sure you will have the feedback you expect if the survey is proposed to a representative pannel of players
No offense but my guess is that you don't run high enough m+ to improve your ilvl. If you can get up to 9s or 10s your ilvl will increase rather rapidly. While also doing Heroic Uldir ofc, aswell as Warfronts etc.


That's not what I was getting at though. I know why my ilvl isn't that high, but at the same time, someone who DOESN'T run Mythics and who DOESN'T raid shouldn't be on par with ilvl to someone who DOES raid and someone who DOES run Mythics and M+'s.
26/10/2018 15:35Posted by Leandros
"do you want to remove a chance to receive a (very) good loot without too much effort"


Yes, I want to remove that chance.

26/10/2018 15:35Posted by Leandros
not sure you will have the feedback you expect if the survey is proposed to a representative pannel of players


I hope the survey is given to all players.
well can be annoying to not get titanforged items at times, when you start to be about 370 ilvl, but at same time, titanforged items do not have same impact now as they used to have due to azerite armor not being able to proc it at all, meening you can have like all your items at ilvl 380 but if you do not raid and only do M0 your chances to get azerite armor up, relies on you doing the warfront and get lucky, and you would still then be stuck at ilvl 370, where a Mythic raider can get higher up, so in a way if you are not lucky whit warfronts or the weekly where you need to do 4 mythics, you are stuck whit ilvl 340 azerite armor.
@OP
While I share your thoughts about titanforging being trash that's bad for the game - I don't share them for the same reasons.

Being able to proc high ilvl gear is one of the PROS of this system, not a cons.
The real cons of this system can be seen over a loonger time period.
You start seeing them around ilvl 375, but they're veeery visible when going closer to 385+
What do I mean? Titanforging is literally defeating its' own purpose.
The +6 warforge and socket upgrades in legion and mop were there to create an alluring reward beyond just having the item drop; "YES I GOT THE BIS ONE" kind of feeling.
The titanforge system was introduced as a more all-encompassing variant of this same system, but where all loot was connected, only separated by mathematic chance depending on starting ilvl.
There are 2 major problems with titanforging:
The proc chance
The player with higher ilvl than the base drop.

An example: If 1 guy did 100 dungeons, he/she MIGHT get some good stuff.
Now: If 100000 people did 1 dungeon each, some of them will most definitely get their BiS max ilvl socket and avoidance items.

You see the point of this? Titanforging is not a "farmable" system. it's a system that will give a certain percent of players doing something some good rewards, but you can't farm a TITANforge out, no matter how much you try. the iterations required for a solid proc above +25 ilvl are more rare than getting rare mounts from old raids. +35 ilvl and we're talking Sha of Anger. Don't get me started on farming "A specific item at a high ilvl" - Just give up before you start, do the dungeon normally and just pray. Farming is not worth it.

A player at a higher ilvl than base drops?
This is where the real problem comes in - With the WoD/MoP formula, you could potentially "Increase your power over the limit, becoming stronger than the ppl you're competing with" - OBVIOUSLY THIS WAS SOME GREAT STUFF. With good luck you can get some stuff that's stronger than what everyone else has, but you could ONLY get it from the highest difficulty raid with a weekly reset.

Legion/TF throws this idea out of the way. You can now farm gear from multiple locations and as much as you want, giving you an edge if you play more than oth.. Wait this doesn't make sense - the first point just said that I couldn't farm stuff from titanforging.

Both of these are true. What the system REALLY succeeds in is creating a sense of being "unlucky" rather than "lucky". You currently NEED to get procs to gain strength, you NEED to be lucky in order to get close to the big boys on logs. The effort/reward is so incredibly !@#$ed above a certain ilvl breakpoint that even though you put in quite a bit of effort, you barely increase at all in power, but it still is something that players like me want to do in order to stay relevant in damage.
WF/TF In it's current state it's completely illogical - you can be rewarded better for easier content than harder content... it's a really strange way to build and RPG or any game for that matter.

That said, Warforging and Titanforging could be such a cool system. Just off the top of my head could make it a way for proffesions to be very relevant. The relveant proffesion to your armor type could upgrade an items' ilvl by +5 (warforged) and/or +10 (titanforged). They could also allow certain proffesions to reforge the stats on an item as well allowing greater character customisation and progression.

This could be done through infusling the item with X Hydrocore's and/or X Sanguiceels that are collected from doing in game content, most of which are just sitting in people's bags doing nothing at this current time.

The current gearing systems are very shallow and based around luck. Blizz should be looking to bring some depth to character progression and gearing as this is currently lacking (along with many areas in the game).
@OP: So your game is ruined because someone else got stuff? That's sad.
26/10/2018 16:22Posted by Doomshaper
@OP: So your game is ruined because someone else got stuff? That's sad.


Many whiners here are jealous.

The probability is so small to get this.

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