Conquest gear

Please can you make the same changes have you make to Honor gear to Conquest gear.

With the changes to PvP gear, namely with them having two secondary stats on them, Conquest gear is superior to loots from heroics, craftable 476 loot, and all LFR loot. In other words, you are forcing players who wish to have the best possible gear for PvE raiding into arenas and rated battlegrounds, which is exactly what Vaneras said you would not do ("Players who enjoy PvE shouldn’t feel forced to PvP to get the best gear, and vice versa.")

I really do not want to, or have the time to, farm Conquest points for raiding, yet players that also do arena and/or RBGs (or even grinding normal BGs) have a disproportionate advantage over players that do not in PvE, which is surely not your intention.

See here for examples of players who have started to farm Conquest points because it is the best gear you can get until you have an equivalent piece of normal mode raid gear:'Gall/Cika/advanced'Jin/Brunixx/advanced

I know you want there to be a crossover to encourage PvPers to PvE and vice versa. However, having BIS PvP gear available and farmable so early on, with utility in both PvP and PvE, is not fair on PvEers, who have to grind raids to get better gear.
Have you thought this through?

The gear is lower quality than raiding gear and conquest gear is the equivalent in PvP to raid gear. With a cap of 1650 points a week and the most expensive items costing 2200 and weapons having a limit of of 7600 points before you can buy them as a PvE you are not at a disadvantage of needing it to raid,

If by the time you got the weapons you will probably be in mostly epic raid items. and you would only get maybe one or two items in before you could replace them from a raid.

I'm not sure you case is well supported.
The Conquest PvP gear is intended to be equivalent to raiding gear, not heroic dungeon or justice points gear. So you are actually comparing apples to oranges, where apples are clearly better than oranges and that is the natural order of things :p

If you compare the two items below you can see that they are quite similar overall and can potentially be used in both settings, but each one is clearly better for its intended purpose of either PvP or PvE:
Malevolent Gladiator's Warboots of Cruelty
Jasper Clawfeet

The reason that these are better for their specific roles (even though there are major stat differences) is because while PvP power and resilience do not influence PvE in any way, they have a large impact on PvP.

So this is why the Honor and Justice points gear is being changed but not Raiding and Conquest; because PvP and PvE gear of the same level are meant to be able to adequately perform both roles but be best for their intended purpose.
Dear Nakatoir. Thank you for responding.

I think, however, that you have missed my point.

At the moment, PvP Conquest gear is perfectly usable in PvE. In the past it was far worse than a PvE item of equivalent level because one of the second stats was resilience. Now, there are two secondary stats and also PvP Power and PvP Resilience. None of the item budget is lost simply because it is a "PvP" item. It is just as good as an item of equivalent level in PvE.

This gives PvEers who also PvP a massive advantage at the beginning of a new tier (in PvE), because they have access to gear that is not accessible to people who only play PvE. For example, at the moment, unless I farm arena and RBGs, the best gear I can get before raiding is 463, or maybe a 476 craftable at enormous cost, or a 493 world boss drop, if I am very lucky. The PvEers who play arena or do RBGs have all of these options open to them, but they can also obtain 483 gear and will be able to get rid of their heroic blues far more quickly. This gives them a massive competitive advantage in raids.

This is what you have just changed in relation to Honor gear, i.e. you have reduced the ilevel but increased the PvP-only stats. You have not, however, done this in relation to Conquest gear. What I am suggesting is that Conquest gear should be changed in a similar fashion and the primary (and possibly also secondary) stats should be significantly reduced, but the PvP only stats increased in order to maintain their effectiveness in PvP, but reduce their viability in PvE.

I am not saying that Conquest gear is better than raid gear in PvE, but it is better than everything else, giving PvEers who also PvP a massive advantage, forcing PvEers to PvP in order to min-max their character. This is just what Vaneras said you did not want people to have to do.

And please note that this will not just be the case at the beginning of the expansion, but at the beginning of every tier, while the best pre-raid PvE gear you can get is from PvP. Just look at the above links. Soon every slot where they do not have an item from raids will be PvP gear.
03/10/2012 14:18Posted by Noctùa
At the moment, PvP Conquest gear is perfectly usable in PvE.

What do you suggest they do? Lower the ilvl of conquest gear, but add huge swaths of PVP power / PVP resilience to it to compensate? Be specific, please. Lowering the ilvl without any compensation is a big no, because then raid weapons would be much better than conquest items in BGs and arenas.
03/10/2012 11:42Posted by Noctùa
In other words, you are forcing players who wish to have the best possible gear for PvE raiding into arenas and rated battlegrounds

Just like PvPers have been forced to PvE for the last 11 seasons in order to compete with people that raid and PvP.

Grinding the conquest for gear will be harder then getting the gear through raids anyway.

What would you do to fix this problem then?

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